> personally I think anyone giving up a dog to a rescue (at any age) should pay a large contribution towards the dog's veterinary, food and kennelling expenses

Quite, it is far to easy to divest oneself of ones responsibilities, which are equally the owners and breeders.

How profitable would puppy farmers,byb's etc find dogs if they had to pay rescue expenses.  The law already requires commercially bred pups be identifiable to the breeder, yet the laws are not enforced.

Hit people in the pocket if they won't take responsibility.

> No you made no mention of rescue dogs but the rescues themselves, I think asking who bred the dogs and mentioning rescues as implying that rescues are breeding these dogs to make money from - now how anti rescue is that?
>

where on earth did you get that from? brainless was refering to the dogs in rescue, in the main, being the product of poor breeding practise. where did you get that rescues might be breeding themselves?

> I do find it sad that you cannot talk about your rescue on here

sorry dogsababe and greyhounds4lif but i couldn't disagree more with this statement. no one on this forum has any problem with people talking about their rescue dogs. i've mentioned my now sadly deceased mastiff, the glorious Odin, often, mastifflover has a thread mourning her rescue boy who has passed right now, many of the people on the forum help run breed rescues, louise recent got a gorgeous cross boy from rescue and we all helped pick a name (Ozzy i believe she decided on). many people who come looking for advice on getting a dog are suggested a rescue, depending on circumstance.

everyone here loves dog, no matter their breed or pedigree. because they love them they (and i :)) will rail against anything that hurts them (such as poor breeding practises and the need for rescue), it doesn't make the dogs any less loveable.

> Maybe there should be legislation to ensure this happens (except for genuine exceptional circumstances), the breeder and the owner have to be legally responsible for re-homing.  There would be far fewer dogs bred, but those breeding responsibly would not be affected, as they already take this responsibility.

Now that is a good idea - maybe you should submit it to the APGAW enquiry?

> mastifflover has a thread mourning her rescue boy who has passed right now

Yes and he was a rescue mongrel - I have had so much support when I had to have him PTS. I have never had a problem talking about him and using him in examples where people are after advice, not once has anything I have had to say about him been belittled due to him being a rescue or a mongrel :)

I have never found these boards to be anti-rescue or anti-mongrel/crossbreed. They are anti-irresponsible breeding & anti-irresponsible ownership, if this attitude was wide spread then rescues would not be full, there would be a small amount of genuine cases to deal with.

I think that the focus on irresponsible breeding being made easy by rescues comes from the fact that good breeders will take thier dogs back - not use rescue as a dumping ground or to make breeding more litters easy.

I do think though that good breeders miss how much of a problem irresponsible owners are (please, this is not having a go at good breeders, I understand that as responsible breeders you see how much good you do and how much good would be done if all breeders were as responsible). As I don't breed, I see the otherside - the irresponsible owners who will rush out & get a puppy from the first & cheapest place they find, don't train it, when the novelty wears off & the bored dog is shut in the garden barking, they dump it in rescue & start again with a new puppy :( These sort of people wouldn't even consider contacting the breeder.

>These sort of people wouldn't even consider contacting the breeder.

Certainly there are owners who don't contact the breeder when they have problems. Sometimes it doesn't even occur to them, sometimes they don't think it's any of the breeder's business, sometimes they're too embarrassed to. So there are several reasons why dogs from reputable breeders find themselves in rescue - but it's not the breeder's fault; they don't have crystal balls, and unless the new owners tell them what's going on they'll never know.

As an aside to this lack of contact between owner and breeder - if owners don't keep the breeder up to date with the pups' health (even when it's adult) how is the breeder expected to know of any problems that might be in the line? Owners have a responsibility to the breeder, just as much as the breeder has a responsibility to the owner.

*climbs off soapbox*

> So there are several reasons why dogs from reputable breeders find themselves in rescue - but it's not the breeder's fault; they don't have crystal balls, and unless the new owners tell them what's going on they'll never know.
>

Yes, exactly, that's why irresponsible owners are just as much to blame for crowded rescues as irresponsible breeders. There is only so much a responsible breeder can do to ensure the dogs they breed will be in homes for life and not dumped in rescue :(

To be honest apart from the odd case most of the irresponsible owners wouldn't' get past a good breeders selection process, this is another problem with irresponsible breeding the lack of any real vetting.

To cover against any of mine getting into rescue and not being traceable I have always had my pups ear tattooed.

If I hear of my breed in a rescue or come into our breed rescue my heart skips a beat, and I am relieved when no tattoo is found.

I do feel that permanent ID of all dogs with record of the breeder kept on should be compulsory, be that tattoo or chip.

It would then be easy to see where the dogs in rescue came from.

Is there a way that the breeders details can stay perminantly on record with a chip? Or is it just tattoo?

BTW We called him Rio lol my lovely crossbred rescue, he would have been PTS now but i took him on and i am happily suprised he hasnt turned out to be a difficult case dog that everyone knew him to be. He was in rescue for over a year, incredibly timid and ditrustful of people. I now have him off-lead prancing through the grass with all his dog buddies, rolling in god knows what, scoffing his tripe and basically LOVING his life. Fills me with such joy to see his happy grin and his curly tail in the air.

Louise

Ps this is only having him 12 days

It will be a long process after being unwanted for so long, but sounds like he love you and your home already :-) Some things are just meant to be.

> To be honest apart from the odd case most of the irresponsible owners wouldn't' get past a good breeders selection process, this is another problem with irresponsible breeding the lack of any real vetting

Good point, I hadn't looked at it that way!! :)

> basically LOVING his life

well done you louise, thats lovely to hear. he's a really gorgeous boy and best of luck to you with it :)

Yes good luck Louise (love the name Rio as well!)

Just to say, I have a rescue, albeit an ex show dog but still a rescue dog, and I never feel like I shouldn't talk about her or anything on CD. In fact, when I posted that I was getting her I received some excellent advice from members on here!

Maybe we are using the wrong terminology for A breeder who you would be happy to buy a puppy from if you'd been a let's say serious breeder. The word i'd look for from now on if I wanted a stud for Miley would definately be Reputable breeder not Proffessional breeder. :)

> The word i'd look for from now on if I wanted a stud for Miley would definately be Reputable breeder not Proffessional breeder.

Why?  Until the thread wandered off course a bit on to Rescue, and breeder attitude to rescues, I thought we were being positive about professionalism in breeding?  I agree steer away from commercial, but why be anit- professional?

Unfortunately it is the connotation with the word professional meaning commercial, as Professionals are seen as making a good living from their profession, whereas breeding is a hobby conducted in a Professional manner by good breeders.

How to disassociate commercial and making a living from Professional seems to be the problem.

> The word i'd look for from now on if I wanted a stud for Miley would definately be Reputable breeder not Proffessional breeder.

Forget the words - what they call themselves matters not BUT what they do, and how they do it, is far more important

Responsible would be my word. Puppy farms are reputable because they have a reputation but we all know we shouldnt buy from them ;-)

Mainly because I think anyone can call themselves a 'Professional Breeder' there are certainly lots of adverts in papers and online for puppies bred by 'professionals' but a lot less are bred by reputable breeders, Those which have long waiting lists for their puppies and who breed every now and then for a show puppy. At the end of the day Professional is occupational,efficient,experienced, skilled not excellent,creditable,respectable and well-thought of like Reputable is.
I am not anti-professional, just think that every Tom, Dick and Harry uses that word.