Hi there,
I already own two CKCS who are two and a half and one and a half years old. They are fantastic dogs who get on really well. I kept in contact with their breeder and now she has a gorgeous pup we would love to have. Do you think it would really disrupt things to have a third? I have never owned more than two dogs at a time and I wonder if a third ruins the dynamics. I now this seems a silly question but I need advice off people who have owned more than two dogs.
We can afford it including any unexpected bills, I am a stay at home mum. We have a large garden and live two minutes from the woods for walks. We would love to have another dog. We are just worried that we are crazy to consider another dog. Also our two dogs get on so well what if a third ruins that? Please someone talk sense to me.

I think you may be asking the wrong people :D Most of us on here (I think ;) ) own more than 2 It is a bit harder, especially as the new one is a pup, but I can't remember a time when I didn't live with more than 2. Ok, except for when my youngest bitch was in season and went on holiday I'm trying to decide whether to go for a 4th member of my canine family :)

DH is working away this week and so far we have phoned each other 5 times this morning to discuss the pup and have should we, shouldn't we conversations.

I think once you go up to 3 dogs you do notice a big difference well I did anyway, just silly things like taking 3 out on leads is more hassle than 2, its not so easy to take 3 places, suddenly kennel costs and injections etc cost just that bit more. But hey we now have 5 (and Roger the Lodger makes 6 at the moment - my friend is in hospital so we have her dog for the next 2 months) and to be honest once you are up to 5 we dont even notice that we have an extra one just now as she has fitted in with the gang.  You sound like you have the right lifestyle to have more dogs so if it is what you really want just go for it :D  Bear in mind though that non doggy friends will start to think you are mental :D :D  The dogs are worth the extra work but you do have to adjust your life accordingly as before when you were going somewhere you c ould prob take both of yours with you but it isnt always practical to take more than 2.
Let us know what you call the pup when you get her - cos you know you will, you have already made your mind up!!!

OK I just got through to DH who is still on the train and I think I heard "go on do it" but the phone cut off and I cannot get back through to him arggggggggggggh. My non doggy friends already think I am mental anyway for having two lol. You are right I had my mind made up last night, I was just trying to be a little bit sensible :rolleyes:.

Sensible?  What's that? :D

If it helps, I used to know of someone who had show cavvies - and by the time I moved her 8th had just reached 6 months, a little boy pup to go with 7 girls! They all got on fabulously, he did get a bit trampled when he was tiny but I wouldn't think you'd have an issue with that with only two adults :)

> My non doggy friends already think I am mental anyway for having two lol.

Mine too, and my family - when I got my third Dad just could not fathom why I wanted her, or why I travelled 4 hours - twice - to get her.  He had to give up trying to understand in the end, but he thinks she's fabulous now!

Sense?

So you want to be told that 3 if hard work (but you answerd that by saying your at home all day)

It costs extra (but you've implied you have funds to cope with this)

I've  never found dynamics are ruined by odd number of dogs, it's great seeing more then two dogs all being able to play with eachother.  As long as you put in the training it's not hard to have all the dogs well behaved.

Oh and yes you are crazy to consider another dog but arn't we all?

We currently have 5 plus a lodger making it 6 untill she finds a home.

I would just say you need to think about their whole lifespan.

If you get dogs so close in age you will end up with three old dogs at the same time and possibly face the expense and heartache all in one go.

How many dogs do you intend to own at any one time maximum, and will you want in 10 years time only to have old dogs?

Would it not be more sensible to wait another five or 7 years and have another and then 2 years later a fourth. 

You would then have two pairs of friends, and when you loose the first tow you will still have the mature younger pair and no hurry to get another for a while.

i know that the absolute maximum number I can look after comfortably is 6.  For this reason I have a rule of no more than four dogs under 12 years of age (the breed lives on average 13 years, but some go onto 15 - 17).

In theory this means I need a 3 year age gap between dogs.  In practise they are 2 to 4 years apart in age and I have never owned more than five at a time, giving room for any temporary lodgers if I should have a former pup returned.

I think Brainless has a good point here, and as the dogs are Cavaliers, it would perhaps be sensible to consider the very real possibility that in a few years time you may have not one not two but three dogs all requiring heart medication. Having said that, if vets bills are no problem and you are aware of the fact that whatever happens, the likelihood is you will end up with 3 old dogs all together that may die close together, then Cavalier is a breed that usually love other dogs and get on so well together regardless of sex -and you're not talking about 3 giant breeds either. :) I had 4 Cavaliers at one point. Right now there's 10 dogs in this house (although to be fair the newcomer DOES belong to mother in law!) and my old Cavalier was delighted when he met the new rescue dog yesterday. I'm getting a second Papillon in 2 weeks time so that will make it 11 dogs!

Our plan is to travel for a few years once the children leave home so these will be our last dogs for a good few years. Otherwise  staggering their ages a bit more would definitely be a point to consider. My sister has 2 Cavs as well and we have had all four dogs stay together for a week with no problems which is a good sign. They are such a friendly breed. OK I am in trouble, DH has told me to book a viewing and you know we will not be coming home empty handed. Looks like we are going to be a three dog family. Yipeeeeeeeeee.

We have 4 males living together, 2 rotts, aged 7 and 3, a 2 year old entire pug and a 13 month old entire Frenchie, with no problems. They were introduced carefully when they were pups and now adore each other. I have no problems at all to be honest.

Go for it - as long as you've considered seasons if you have any of them entire / unspayed etc, the more the better with Cavs. I have 2 so far and a Yankee. :-) I was a bit worried when my (entire) boy went to the dogsitter last week as he does argue with my Yankee, and the dogsitter now has a 6 month entire boy, but they were fine together, he didn't want to come home!

All the valid points have already been raised - especially Brainlesses age difference thing.

The only thing I can think to add is that 3 specifically can be an odd number for nights away or holidays - 4 is much better :D  Many hotels, B&Bs, self catering cottages etc will only take up to 2 dogs - which would leave one on its own in the kennels. Even though they are(will be) 3 small dogs you'll struggle a bit to find somewhere to accept them.

Fantastic idea about four. I walk both dogs on a joint lead in one hand before we get to the woods so I need two dogs on the other hand to make for a well balanced walk. Just have to suggest that idea to DH now. No seriously we rarely leave them in kennels as they stay with family when we are away. Most of the time we go away in my mum's caravan and the dogs come with us. Ok obviously I am getting this dog as I am talking my way out of every obstacle you throw in my way. OK the children want to call her Star so yip no backing out now lol.

Good luck, do report back about the pup!!! :) :)

I'm still smiling at Goldmali!  You have made me feel so perfectly normal!!!  When people know how many dogs I have - they say "HOW MANY?"   Eleven is just right for me too!  There was a time I used to be far too concerned about how the resident dogs would accept a newcomer.  Until a very tiny Yorkshire Terrier made it quite clear that she wasn't going to stay in a puppy pen, when there were such warm Cuddly Bearded Collies to snuggle up to!  Although they all have their own beds, it's far more usual to see up to 5 in the same bed!  Half are neutered, I have mixed sexes, and I have never had a fight.  Mixed ages from 10 months to 15 years.  Happiness is dog shaped!

:D :D :D :D

I don't know, when I look for dog cottages I tend to find most places that take more than one dog will take almost any number. We've had a couple of lovely holidays in places happy to have 3 small dogs. :-)

Blimey Lucy, where do you look? When I searched the standard holiday cottage websites the ones that took dogs mainly all said 2 dogs welcome. I only saw one that said 3 dogs and none at all that would take 4 :( 

When they say two, chaumsong, if you speak to them they will often agree to more, particularly if you mention crates etc.  But it would depend on size of dog I suppose :)

doh! I assumed two meant two :rolleyes: LOL  Ok - I'll ask in future :)

Erm can't remember sorry! :-( Something like dogfriendlycottages.co.uk or something??

MichelleD can probably confirm, but she and other friends and a mutual friend took doggy holidays each year with up to 20 dogs.

they rented a couple of cottages, and took references from their previous holidays to get the accommodation.

They ensured that they left the accommodation better than they found it, and I believe agreed to pay for any damage.

There is a photo taken by Michelle I belive of all the dogs on one seaside trip, if anyopne wants to see it I can mail.

Blimey - 20 dogs! And I couldn't find somewhere to take 4

Would love to see the pic Barbara :)

Done

Fabulous pic :)  Do the Elkhounds in it do obedience then?

Yep up to about two years ago when she couldn't get the time offf work at weekends.

now that's impressive. I like to see 'different' breeds doing obedience or agility, especially the hounds :)

There's a nice photo of him at an Obedience show in the present on retrieve.  I have it on my website on relatives page.

My Kizi's sister (they will be 10 in October) regularly worked at the Exemption shows which is all her disabled owner could manage these days.  Sadly poor Dyna developed Auto immune problems following a gastric virus about two 1/2 years ago.  she now is Hypothyroid, has demodectiv mange bouts and terrible gastric problems with malabsorbtion.

It is painful to see her (walking skeleton as all her muscle has wasted) when her sister is so fit and young in body and mind.  Several times we have thought the time had come to let her go, but she has an indomitable spirit and enjoys what she has of life. 

I've been reading through problems of taking dogs on holiday.  Back in 2003 I had been looking at holiday cottages, and it seemed that, even when dogs welcome was advertised, they meant two itsy bitsy tiny things.  I sent an email to Torbay Tourist Board, and was extremely impressed with the help I received.  Although the places I'd chosen were not going to accept a lot of dogs, the guy at least told me of an alternative.  I was holidaying alone, so couldn't take my whole gang, but got a dog sitter in, and took 4 dogs with me.  I took a duvet with me to throw on the kitchen floor, and they all curled up at night.  I had a bungalow that actually slept 6, it was outside Paignton, in a rural area called Marldon, with lovely countryside.  The owner accepted animals but not children!  He had regulars that took their parrots every year!  He came down one day to look me and my dogs over, and couldn't believe they were all waiting obediently while I unloaded the car.  I took 2 Bearded Collies, one Toy Poodle (obedience trained) and a terrier cross.  We had the time of our lives.  It was the last holiday for my 15 year old terrier, and I still have a tear when I look at the pics of her paddling in the rock pools, but my memories are wonderful.  My dogs never let me down once, and were as good as gold in a strange place.  I was so glad that I didn't just accept the adverts, and made enquiries.  Oh, and did I mention?  I also took my guinea pig with me!  Yes, I know, totally mad!

I think many hoteliers etc are reassured if you crate your dogs.  Also try to get references from the places you have stayed as this will help convince others.

As always some good advice here.  But I am someone that did have problems introducing a new pup but only the once and we do know why it happened now - it was just very unfortunately really even though one of the bitches was very dominant the real problem came because the younger bitch started to produce milk about a week after we had the new pup and the older girl (just spayed) got jealous and attacked the younger one - so primarly a hormone thing.  But you know the two you have now best of all and I assume that you don't have any worries about them with a 3rd dog so I woiuld go for it.   Good luck - a very exciting time for you.

I am so glad I read this as I was wondering when we should get another but hadnt thought about when they get older and losing then all around the same time. Skye is 18mth and Piper is 8mths so we will be waiting a couple of years before we add to the family.
Mary

That's the only downside I think - although if you mix and match breed types then it's less of an issue.  I did worry about losing my two younger dogs close together, as when I bought Opi she was a rottweiler (grew into a mix :rolleyes:) - lifespans for them and dobes are similar and she is only 2 1/2 months younger than Rem.  Not so worried now though!  But it is worth bearing in mind.

So time for an update, we went to see her, fell in love, brought her home and are vet told us to return her. She was tiny and we knew we should not have brought her home but her personality was amazing. The vet was right though and we took her back. So we are all really sad now and to be honest I feel stupid for bringing her home in the first place.

That was very brave of you to let your head rule your heart - I am sure the right dog will come along for you :)

Can you explain a bit as I didn't get what you meant -the vet said she was too young, too small for her breed, unhealthy, what? What did the breeder say?

I'm confused

I'm confused too why would the breeder let you have her if she isn't old enough ???? 

We knew she was a bit small when we saw her but she was running around happy and she appeared healthy enough. She was very friendly and amazing with my children so we brought her home. The minute the vet saw her he said she was too small for her age which according to her birth date on her Kc certificate was 9 weeks. He also detected a very small heart murmur, which of course could disappear in a few weeks but it is a high risk to take with a CKCS. He was also worried there may be an  underlying health problem because of her size. I wanted to keep her anyway but as DH pointed out the kids were already getting very attached and if she was going to have problems it would be better to return her before the kids got really attached and had to face losing her. So we were all very upset and it is the first time we have ever had to do anything like that. I felt so dreadful. We have decided to keep searching though and we will be adding another CKCS to the family soon.

MVD does not show up as murmurs in pups -it appears in adult dogs, so it most likely would have disappeared. I'm unsure how a vet would know what is the correct size for a 9 week old cavalier pup -many Cavaliers are too big, and the size can vary greatly from just 6 kgs up to 9 or 10 or even more in adults. My smallest was 6 kg as adult  yet many are far, far bigger. Was she smaller than the littermates?

She was a tiny bit smaller and I explained to the vet that all of the litter were small  and that it had been a fairly large litter of 6,but he insisted we were fools and that she was a runt. He said he could not guarantee good health which frightened DH off. I so want to believe we did the right thing because she was an angel of a pup. You know you get that feeling sometimes that there is something really special about that pup and that it would make an amazing companion? Well that is how I felt about this one. DH has only had dogs since has known me though not all his life and I think he is more prone to listening to a vet that going with gut feeling.

Oh well the decision has been made and the pup has a new home already. The breeder welcomed her back with open arms and was really nice about it all. I feel so torn about our decision. I would have kept her if I only had myself to consider, but DH and I talked it over for ages and finally came to a joint decision to return her so I can not complain or have regrets because I could have changed his mind if I really thought keeping her was for the best.

Tazzles how much did she weigh?How did the breeder react when you brought her back and told her what the vet said? Did you tell her what the vet said,or did you use another reason for bringing her back? I bet the breeder would have been fuming if there was nothing wrong with the pup.

I phoned her and told her as soon as I left the vets and she just told us to bring her back. That is the one thing that did make me worried because she was not angry and just accepted it. I do not know how much she weighed but she could sit in one hand easily.

A GOOD breeder would not get angry, because their main concern is that the pup is in a good home where it's wanted. :) Obviously it's impossible to tell from just written descriptions, my gut instinct is the pup was okay, but you had to do what YOU felt was right for you because it's a dog that will be with you for years and not a hamster that will live for 2 years only. :)

Not saying it is the case here, but I have heard on more than one occasion Vets saying things about pups that made the new owners worry for no reason if they knew the breed.

Maybe we have come to the stage of needing to get our Vets to write a certificate saying the pups are fine (or not as the case may be).

The breeder was lovely to DH when he returned the pup. I could not take her back he had too. I sat in the car crying, I hate to think that the vet was wrong and talking rubbish. She would have been my third CKCS and to be honest I did think she was tiny as well. Oh well I have to forget about it now because the thought that the vet was wrong is a killer to be honest.

"He said he could not guarantee good health"

I am certainly not a breeder or in any way informed on this subject but I am a cynic and I wonder when any Vet. would GUARANTEE good health?

What an awful decision to have to make I really feel for you. Don't feel bad about having to make it, a proffesionals advice was taken and it may or may not be correct but thats not really important. The fact that your other half listened to it means that if you were to persuade him to keep her and she did develop any health problems later in life even by coincidance the vets advice would always be there and could cause some resentment. You will find the right pup for your family, good luck with your search.

Thank you, that means a lot. I hope we do find the perfect pup one day but we have been put off for a little while because it has been so stressful.