hi All
My girl has been pre mate tested and results came back to mate day 19-22,
her blood went lighter in colure as expected and she was very reseptive to my male so was mated on these days, the last mating was 4 days ago .
my concern is the her bleeding has got heavier than it was at mating time and it is very very dark blood.
can this be normal,
the last time she was mated she carried on bleeding and actually missed so i am a bit baffled
can you help do you think there is a problem with her still bleeding?

hI, thats exactly the problem we had, our bitch bled as normal, then went normal straw coloured at the correct time for mating, then at about 15 days started heavy bleeding again, this continued until day 21, I am pleased to say she is now 44 days in whelp and looking like the back end of a bus!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! hope this offers you some confidence. cheers di

thats good to here , but she has missed twice before and been in pup once, the time she was in pup she stopped bleeding after mating and went on to have very healthy puppies, but the twice she has missed she kept on bleeding after mating the same as this time. i am just worried there is a pattern to this.
has anyone elses dog done this at different times?

What has the vet said, Claudia?

Hi again, our bitch that is in whelp now, missed last time and bled again at end of season, then same again this time and as I say is 44days in whelp at the minute. So dont think there is any pattern to it. The bleeding started again and was brightish red then lessened daily till it was just a brownish stain at day 21, then only clear discharge since. Obviously if the bleeding is excessive then you must call the vet, her bleeding was like the first few days of her season. Hope this helps a bit more. cheers di

Hi
well she does seem to be really slowing down today thank god,
i suppose i will just have to wait ans see now but i am such an impatiant person it is going to drive me mad
thanks and i will report back when i know somthing

REALLY NEED YOUR HELP AGAIN!!!!
i thought my bitch was stoppping bleeding but she has started up again and it is quite heavy bleeding, she has now been bleeding for 29 days, she was mated 19-22. i have phoned my vet and he doesn't seem too bothered but said she could have cysts on her overies.
PLEASE CAN YOU HELP ON THIS SITUATION HAS THIS HAPPENED TO YOUR DOG BEFORE.

now that does not sound right, i think if your own vet not interested i would try another practice, there is nothing to say you cannot consult another vet.

Get this bitch seen by a vet or if they won't help go elsewhere. there are times they can help over the phone, and times the dog needs to be seen. This is the latter. good luck

Don't want to alarm you but I once had a bitch that came into season and 2 weeks after she had finished she began bleeding again,(she had not been mated) I phoned my vet and she finished up with an emergency spay operation as she had a womb infection.
Please take her to the vet obviously something not right.

I don't want to scare you either, but my bitch did exactly as you are describing, she got to 7 weeks pregnant then aborted her litter :(  even after weeks of AB's, the vet nor us had a clue why she was still bleeding and heavily at that, I was following her with a mop!

Hope the vet can help.

Hi
NOW ON DAY 35 AND STILL BLEEDING!!!
i have had her to 2 vets and both are saying that there is nothing they can do except wait for her to stop bleeding, they say it could be cysts on her overies. She is on antibiotics. she is really well in herself but i am still pulling my hair out with worry. I don't think she will be in pup as with cysts there chances are reduced my alot, which i am not bothered about she is more important to me than anything.

so sorry for you losing your pups at 7 weeks that must of been awfull

do you have any more sugestions

This is ridiculous, what if she never stops bleeding. Not to worry you, but the bleeding, if as heavy as you say it is and on Day35, could be doing more harm than good. If it were my girl I would have a vet x-ray or something immediatley. WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR???

I am sadden to hear you are just going to wait and not get seen by another vet, lets hope its nothing to worry about, for your sake.

Chezza

CHEZZA PLEASE DON'T BE SADDENED!!!!
I have actually had her scanned which resulted in nothing being found or seen, the vet did say that an xray wouldn't pick up on cysts.
They have both also said that there is no way to actually stop the bleeding so all we can do is wait.
maybe if you know of a way that a vet doesn't you should let me know.

Sorry for the late reply on this one. I have a bitch who bleeds all the way through her season, colour never tails off and this time she beld HEAVILY until past day 35. The blood was very dark gooey brown and I was very worried. I seriously didn't think with the amount and colour she was losing there was anyway she could be in whelp. She was put on 2 courses of AB's as the day after she stopped the 1st course the bleeding started again.
The Vet told me it was highly unlikely she would be in whelp. He later plapated her and said if she was it would be a small litter. I eventually got her scanned and she was scanned for 7 puppies. The bleeding still continued and then around day 40 stopped. She went on to have 8 puppies, we lost one.

Well thanks everyone.
after 44 days of heavy bleeding i took her back to the vet as she was loosing weight for no reason and he told me the same. just go home and wait for it to stop.
I took her home and the next day i noticed she was really down, drinking gallons, not eating, loosing puddles of stinking fluid.
I think we all know what i was thinking so i rushed her to the vet and yes i was right she had developed a pyo, she was spayed immediatly and is very lucky to be alive, she is only 3 years old and has won at many champ shows which i think is a shame she will not be able to be shown any more but i must stress i am just soooo happy that she is still here, she is recovering slowly and enjoying all the extra tlc.
thanks for your help.

She CAN be shown, you just need to write to the KC and ask permission, which they usually give with no problem!

On a more sober note, how sad, and how observant of you, at least YOU knew what to watch out for! Hope she makes a full recovery and gets back to her own self, all the best, Dawn X

You don't even have to ask permission, you just have to inform them.

Wishing for a speedy recovery and she can still be shown :)  Our veteran bitch is still showen and has been spayed.  She just needs a little more work with the coat. :)

Oh really, that is fabulous!!! i am so chuffed i have always been told that you can't show a spayed bitch.
oh you two have made my day
thanks

Talk about learning something new every day.

If you search either CD forum or  KC website you will find teh form you have to fill in to send to the KC...Or is it just a letter now days?  Someone will let you know how to go about it I'm sure! :)

You might find, as with spayed and castrated dogs you will have to watch weight but aslong as you are aware of that from the word go there shouldn't be a problem.  Our spayed girl is on a light diet and doing fine! :)

Coat may change abit but with regular brushing and grooming you can over come this if it does become a problem.

Other then that showing a spayed bitch is great....no seasons! :D So good luck with her shows in the future :)

Its a form and its on the KC website

You have certainly been able to show spayed bitches without exception for nearly 20 years with just the proviso of informing the Kennel club.

Prior to that the rule was that they had to have registered offspring, and no stipulation to ask permission or inform the KC.

I showed my first bitch in 1989 and the rule was changed shortly after that.

I am surprised that this idea still seems to persist that you can't show neutered animals.  It is certainly the case in many other countries but not the UK.

In fact a Sheltie bitch that was spayed after Pyo following her first season was top show do all breeds in 1995.  Her name was Ch Myriehewe Rosa Bleu (sp?).

http://au.geocities.com/ssc_nsw/judges.htm

It was in fact probably in 1980 as my Beardie bitch was made up in 1979 & & spayed the next year to save her life & the rule was changed just before she was spayed in the July

I know that the bitches/dogs that already had offspring were allowed at the time that I started showing (1989), but across the board wasn't until after that as I remember the announcement in the canine press, and being new to dog showing I always read all the regulations printed on schedules.

Maybe it was under operations certified by a vet for which permission could be asked?  As in her case it was life saving and not just a choice.

She never had any puppies :-( & she was granted leave to be shown under the change in rules, before that she wouldn't have been allowed to have been shown even if it was a lifesaving operation. Hiedi was born in 1974 & died when she was 15 & was spayed when she was 6 & was one of the first bitches to have permission granted without offspring

I agree, I used to read all the regulations etc as well, I definitely remember reading on a schedule about "progeny registered at the Kennel Club" in 1990 (that was the 1st time I ever saw a schedule so it certainly wasn't earlier than that). I think it was probably changed in 1991. Has anybody got a set of KC year books from around then that they can use to check?

That sounds about right to me, as I showed my Groenendael from 89 to 90/91, and then came back to showing the Elkhounds in 1994 when my son was old enough to leave with grandpa for the day.  I continued getting the Dog papers during the time I wasn't showing and the change occurred before I lost my Goren in 1992.

Phew, good thing you knew better than the vet!!! Best wishes for a speedy recovery and lots more success in the ring. :-)

Sorry, it is definitely earlier that 1989/1990 as Hiedi was spayed well before that date & went BIS aged 11 & she was spayed then so that would be well before 1989/1990. I don't think it was very well known, but I had all my other bitches spayed before 1989 & I went on showing one into the 1990's She was born in 1985 & spayed at three years old, not on medical grounds but because I did not wish to breed anymore & we bought in another male ,Erik, from Jackie Tidmarsh &  Tabitha  won her Stud book number after being spayed

As you will see from the dates of birth my bitches were spayed well before 1989

We had a Cocker bitch who had to be spayed after a nightmare pregnancy which went wrong. She had produced one puppy in a previous litter so we were able to continue showing her for a year or so after she was spayed (until her coat became too woolly). She was born in 1986 and was spayed in 1989 and the rule about needing registered progeny was definitely still in place then - I remember checking it with the KC after someone in the breed tried to complain about us showing our bitch.

You obviously spoke to the wrong person then as someone put down a complaint with the secretary at the show our bitch went BIS  after being spayed  & this was when I was living in Southend(1980 to 1982)they put down the £25(I think) as it then was & the KC kept this as it was an incorrect complaint & they simply wrote to us telling us that the complaint had been lodged & dismissed by the KC as permission to show had been granted several years before & we hadn't needed to do anything. We had Tabby spayed in 1987 & again had KC permission to show & she had never had puppies & it wasn't an emergency spay either

It was possibly trialled(like the allowing puppies under 6 months to be entered as NFC at Obedience shows whilst not in the "Red"book this was allowed for 5 years before becoming part of the G regs) not all KC Regs are put straight into the Red Book BTW

The change had certainly taken place by 1993 as I have the KC's letter saying my Polly could be shown despite being spayed, and she never had any pups.

Does it REALLY matter when it was??? :D

>Does it REALLY matter when it was???   :-D

'cos it doesn't it does mean that bitches that have been spayed & dogs castrated can compete on equal terms with entire exhibits, even if they haven't been bred from, which IMHO is fair, not everyone wants to own an entire dog for various reasons, but why shouldn't they be able to show them if they want to ?

I meant the tooing and frowing about the correct date! :D

During the 80's..... ;) There we go thats a good date...80's :D

I think the point is that the misapprehension still remains with many people that neutered animals can't be shown, if the rules changed 15 years ago or 25 years ago why do people still think this???

I first showed in 1989 and the rule printed in schedules at the time was that they had to have offspring.  whether the rules had tooed and froed I have no idea.