Does anyone else's vet charge them an admin fee for processing their claim form?   I have a no excess policy with M&S but have been sent an invoice for "insurance administration" by the Vet practice.   Not a happy bunny (they took 5 months to send the paperwork to M&S ) and so have now had it waived, but I'd like to know if this is the norm with practices?

Thanks in advance, Teri

I've not heard of that before - but that doesn't mean that it doesn't happen :D

You are norty :D

Yep - my vet charged a tenner to complete a form on one of my horse claims :)

A lot of vet's do to charge for filling out the insurance claim form.  I think it is the larger practices mainly but can't say for sure if all the smaller village vets do or not!

I agree I think it's a cheek when they can take up to a week to fill out (and longer in your case) - well done for getting it waived!

My vet charged me a £5 admin fee which I paid when I dropped my claim form to them. The vet explained they were charging to cover postage and admin costs for the forms, which to be honest i actually think is fair considering how many insurance claims they now handle, and also considering that they were the ones to encourage me to use my insurance, and I got back £150, for only a £5 cost, so I was ok with that.

I've never heard of it before and know my dog vet nor my horse vet charges a fee.

Bev

Now £5 doesn't seem so bad I agree - but £10-£15 when they take forever to fill it out I think is a bit too much sometimes but when you weigh it up with the claim then I guess you are right - a small price to pay I guess?!

Hmmm, this seems odd to me.  Postage is what, 30p or thereabouts, an envelope (if not already provided) maybe 5p and the claim form is by the insurance company so no stationary charges there then.   Add to that my insurance form is about two-thirds filled in by me, they only have to give "medical name" of illness and stamp it with the practice rubber stamp.   I'm not thinking this is value for money :D  My invoice was for £6-85 and I spent that much again in petrol and phone calls chasing the claim up in person.

I don't get why the vet doesn't add this admin fee to the insurance claim or could it be that they realise an insurance company wouldn't be so easily ripped off? :rolleyes:

Could it be that vets are finding more and more ways to make up for not getting the bread & butter annual vacs these days?  After all from my experience a vet's first question is often "Is the pet insured?" - wonder how much of a price difference there is between one that is and one that isn't for the same treatment

Probably £6-85 at our place at least LOL  :P

Thanks folks, Teri ;)

not been charged up to now in fact I am such a good customer :D I get a 10% discount LOL

>Could it be that vets are finding more and more ways to make up for not getting the bread & butter annual vacs these days?

Probably right Teri, I've noticed KC has just slipped onto the core vac annual protocol around here.  Interestingly enough, it just happened at the same time the practices moved to the 3 yr vac for Distemp/ parvo/etc.  Now that's a bit of a coincidence.  :rolleyes:

No admin fees here.  We pay for any treatment up front and then claim it back.  Both dogs are currently on Synoquin; we submit a claim twice a year.  I hate filling in forms; this way I have 2 forms twice a year instead on 2 every month.

I can understand tho, if vets are spending a lot of their time filling in forms for a large number of their Client database then no doubt itemized admin fees is one way to reclaim the cost of their time taken.   It is possible that some vets have higher consultation fees that others to absorb admin costs while others have cheaper consultation fees and charge admin fees separately.  It's a bit of a minefield really.

Yep, I know of one practice - certainly last year - that was using an obscure *annual* vaccine rather than Nobivac all of a sudden   

The information should already be detailed on each clients' card and so it only needs a nurse or even clerk to copy it!

Yep, Teri we have one around here too.  Uses annual vacs and suddenly claimed Nobivac aren't as effective at the same time the 3 yr guidelines came into effect, I might add.  What a cheek and so transparent. :rolleyes:

>I've noticed KC has just slipped onto the core vac annual protocol around here.

Who or what is KC? What is a core vac annual protocol?
The other reason they may be decided to charge for this work, something Doctors have done for decades to my knowledge, is the huge growth in insurance for pets so presumably a huge growth in form filling.
If you are filling you own claim forms in, obviously there are going to be no Admin fees :)

KC = Kennel Cough

KC as a recommended annual vaccine as opposed to being optional.    

I do believe claim forms have to be completed by the vet, with a section for the owner to complete.  I give him blank ones with my signature so yes my vet completes the forms.

I see.  This is a practice that does not seem to have been adopted elsewhere.  My vet certainly regards it as optional.

I know Isabel, I don't believe it has.  It was my vet that told me that they were moving to the 3 yr regime in July 05 and when they do they would be recommending KC as an annual vaccine.  And then the issue was raised again when some clients were commenting on having KC pushed at them all of a sudden.  It's clearly a business decision and not a response to an increased threat. 

Perhaps, I don't know the level of KC in your neighbour but I don't think it can be that extraordinary :)  Not sure it would bring a great deal more income though as there are annual vaccinations recommended anyway and as I have mentioned in another post the actual cost of the vaccine is only part of it.
Not entirely comfortable with the idea that vaccination issues are decided on a financial level in general.  I'm sure, like any other group of people, there are some vets that would be motivated thus but that cuts both ways in the vaccination debate ;)  I think it is best if we continue with the idea that the vast majority of people on both sides of the debate are motivated by their understanding of the welfare issues alone :)

Well of course Isabel, from a welfare point of view.   I believe there was an internal guideline issued where vets could use their discretion to recommend KC annually.  Moving parvo etc to 3 yr left a gap, why not recommend KC?

If you look at it from the vaccinations do no harm and more is better point of view, it's not a financial decision.  But then if you look at it from the point of view that more is not strictly better and too many vaccinations can do harm, then I guess it becomes an issue.  It depends on how you see it. 

It may not be a lot of difference in cost to the individual but if you add that cost up over x amount of years with a database with over 3000 clients, some with multiple pet households, then you are talking about a big difference.

But we have to bear in mind that vets have a living to earn too and a lot of these decisions are based on the balance of welfare issues verses financial reasoning.

I disagree, no caring vet, which I believe the vast majority are, would consider a move that they thought could have any detrimental welfare issues in the name of finance.  As I say I think it is no fairer casting these sort of aspersions as it would be to suggest that people decide on what would be best for their pets on the basis of what it costs them.
As I say very few, infact I don't think any other than your vet, have been recommended KC annually so if there was such an internal guideline and it was interpreted as you are suggesting they do not seem to have taken that route in any numbers worth noting.

It's the bigger picture I'm talking about, Isabel, not the individual vet.  Individual vets don't all agree, they have different opinions and they have different opinions about vaccinations too.  Nobody said they don't care, of course they do but there are always restrictions and different opinions in every walk of life.

I'm not too sure about the KC route, because it is not just our practise that is doing it so you might find some are, here and there, if you care to look. :-)

>Nobody said they don't care, of course they do but there are always restrictions and different opinions in every walk of life.

I think that is what I was saying :)  There may be differing opinions but it would seem from the snap shot we have here at Champdogs, which is where I care to look for all things doggy ;) that this is surely a minority one.

I don't have anybody insured so don't have recent experience of that, but I have had my vets do all sorts of other paperwork. For instance male cats need a certificate of entirety signed before kittens can be registered from them -all it involves is the vet chekcing the balls, checking the chip if there is one and signing and stamping a form. I don't get charged for this.  Twice in recent months I have had blood tests done on female cats prior to them being taken out to stud, and my vets have done the blood test in house, but each time they have written (upon my request) a certificate  giving the cat's name, breed, colour etc, stating she tested negative, again no charge. A couple of weeks ago I had one of my stud cats DNA tested, which involved taking blood to be sent off to Bristol, paperwork filled in etc, microchip checked. All I was charged was £10 to take the blood (the lab fee was separate as that was charged by Bristol) -not even a full consultation fee. And my vets are quite expensive when it comes to most things. :)

My Vets practice charge £5.01 for adminstration costs invovled in completing claims forms, but the last time I needed one done I wasn't charged, maybe because I save up what I claim for, as it's ongoing, and only put the claim form in once a year.

I remember years ago my GP friend telling me the fee he charged for a insurance report was £25 I would imagine it would be very much more now so these vet fees sound pretty good to me.  I always understood it was charged to the insurance company though.  Perhaps it is up to you to put in a claim for extra fees, expenses etc.

Yep, I agree that it's not a huge amount of money but like you I would have thought that they would - nay more adamant than that! :D  - should charge the insurance company.  Hopefully it will be a long time before I'm needing to claim again and when the day arrives I'll be politely suggesting that they add this admin charge onto the claim.

My last claim was dealt with by the Vet Hospital and apart from paying the consultation fee up front, subsequent bills were sent direct to M&S and presumably any admin costs charged at the same time.  

Which brings me to another point - do vets usually get clients to pay after each course of treatment (for the same condition) and client reclaims from Insurance company or do any vets take the first payment only then submit costs for related treatment direct to insurers?

on a mission now

Teri 

I have asked Petplan to pay the admin charge before but they wouldn't do it...
Certainly, with equine bills, you get a bill at the end of treatment (or for treatment throughout that month at the end of that month if ongoing) and you collate it, fill out your bits and send to the vet. In the meantime the bill has to be paid - unless you negotiate for extra time with the vet themselves :)

I can't see many (for that read any :P ) insurance companies being happy about paying the vet's admin costs - so I'm not really surprised by that ChloeH.   It's just niggling (driving me quietly crazy(er)) me that I pay extra for a no-excess policy and the vet thinks he'll slip in a few quid that means I'm not really getting a bill-free consult/treatment :rolleyes:

It wasn't an expensive bill to start with, a few pence under £72, but methinks had I not had insurance at all it would probably have been lower still ........ cynical - ME -   Yep :D  

You are not paying the vet for a no excess policy.  If the insurance company will not pay incidental costs why should the vet do it unpaid? 

Yes, I see what you mean BUT, I hand delivered a pre-filled out form and envelope and all they had to do was sign and rubber stamp it - hardly took 1 minute of their time.  Now at £6-85 a minute that's a tad poor value for money IMO :rolleyes:  - or, on the flipside, a dang well paid job :D

I didn't really register it to be honest - mainly because my bill/claim was for £500 with a £100 excess (can't escape those with equine!) so I just put up and shut iup LOL :D It would probably sting a bit more on a £70 bill - but I guess the vets work is still the same...

As CloeH says I think the insurance companies dictate these things rather than the vets.  I suppose it is one of the choises to make when taking out a policy.

When I my Vet announced they were going to charge for completing Insurance claim. I changed Vets!

When I got the bill on Saturday morning in the same post as the cheque from M&S (which, had the vet done the admin correctly, would have been in my hot little hands 5 months earlier) that was my initial reaction too LOL.  But TBF it is a particularly good practice with some exceptional benefits so, much as I was a bit hacked off, I reckon it's in my dogs' best interests to stay with them.  

regards, Teri :)

Why should vets not charge? Do you do work for free Liberty?  I can understand people be annoyed that their polices don't cover everything although I think we should remember we are used to the normal practice to have a seperate, frequently optional, policy to cover incidentals for motor insurance for instance but I don't think there is any reason for a vet to go unpaid by anyone.

No I do not work for free, but then I do not dictate my charges and or treatment either. Most Vets are delighted to hear your pet is inusured, so no I do not see why one Vet should charge for completing a form and another see it as part of the service.

Edited to add: Same Insurance company, but different Vets, so whos cashing in?

I think any vet that sees an extra 20 minutes form filling over and above what he would have been doing for an uninsured client as part of the service is giving you a rather nice bonus :)  I don't see why any of them should be obliged to do it. 

As in my previous Vets, it was the Vet Nurses job to complete the forms, I'm sure the uninsured pets did not suffer from the Vets lack of attention........esp as he/she was busy considering what other tests/treatment he can give the insured pet in the knowledge he will be paid ;)

An enterprising vet may well get his nurse to do the pen pushing ;) but he still needs to read it, check the information in it and sign it.  He is also the professional who will take responsibility for what is recorded there.  I think when people think about the time that vets spend doing this and that and it doesn't always seem much they are not always appreciating that is not all we are paying for.
I should hope the uninsured pet doesn't suffer from lack of attention as they are definately not on the list of people that should be paying for anothers insurance claim ;)

My form took under 60 seconds       I don't see why, if they are efficient, it can't be filled in (after all it's largely done by the client) and signed immediately after each consult.   What's happened to good old time management :D :D :D

Mine didn't - it was a long complicated claim for a kick to the stifle which brought on laminitis - so 2 in one really. With PP equine the vet has a page to complete all themselves :D

As I say it's not just a question of time although I think checking the details against the records does take a little long than 60 seconds ;)  I don't know how the client fills the form in prior to the consultation :)

Checking what details against what records?   They'll only have seconds before examined the dog and they'd darn well better know his/her med records before commencing any treatment!  They only have to give the name of the illness/disease after they've made the diagnosis.   On my insurance form it can be almost entirely completed by me at home before I've even seen the vet :-

Policy Number
Owners name, address, contact details
Pet (type of, breed, sex, DOB)
Date first noticed symptoms & what these were
Details of Vet attending (or previous in last 3 years)
Owner's signature on declaration.
All of the above is mandatory for the owner to provide

Extent of vet section:  Name of illness/disease
Total £.....
Signature / stamp.

They know me by my first name as well as my dogs (covers any ID issues ;) ) - so, 60 seconds leaves time to spare :D and I could pop it in the post box for them on the way out! 

That may be the case on a simple form but many would have involved a series of tests and treatments.  My GP friend goes back into his surgery in the evening one evening a week to complete his rather than delay the next appointment.   I'm sure he refreshes his memory with each set of notes, remember yours will not be the only claim form to be done.

I think in this day and age it's fair to say that "many" will be pretty straightforward too Isabel :)   Insurance is now extremely common - I'm astonished at how many of my friends and dog walking buddies had it for several years before me.   It's all relatively new to me on a personal level having only taken it up 2 years ago and in my practice complicated cases are referred almost immediately to the Vet hospital as that's where most of the tests and lab work would be carried out anyway :)

>Insurance is now extremely common

Exactly :) Even the simple forms will add up in a vets working day. 
I suppose it is different in a city where there is a hospital, I don't know anyone round here that has been referred to a hospital for anything, only the samples sent off in some instances.

My vet is the hospital :)

We received the new fee rates this morning for a London firm of solicitors that we use at work. The clerk is charged out at £75 per hour, let alone the solicitor who deals with our cases who is charged at £475 per hour - so I think that £6 or whatever is cheap LOL :D :D :D

Daisy

I don't see how the insurance company dictates who pays the bill so long as it's paid promptly    I'd have thought it would be the decision of the senior partner or practice manager at the individual vets based on what they could afford to defer payment on (a LOT in my neck of the woods) and on how trustworthy and reliable previous arrangements were both with the client and insurance companies ......

When researching companies I didn't come across anything relating to this particular situation - but now I already know through experience that the Vet Hospital will deal direct with M&S :)