Hi,

We are currently looking for a gsp puppy but I would like some advice on what to look for and how to tell if a pup has show potential.  I realise some of it has to do with breeding, but is there anything we should look for or anything we should really avoid?

Thanks

If the breeder is a successful exhibitor and an experienced breeder, then they would be the best person to guide you as they will know how their line develops.

Agree iwth Val, choose the right breeder.  Firstly choose a breeder who has done well in the show ring, explain you want to start showing and they will help you choose the right puppy. :)

Agree with the others, after all it is in the breeders interests to choose the best pups to represent their kennel in the showring.  They can't keep them all.

Unfortunately I have found from experience that although a breeder may not want you in the ring with a 6 month + puppy of their breeding if it does not look how they thought it would be it does not mean that they will necessary sell you something that will look nice and what will do well in the ring.

For example I purchased a puppy (who was slightly older than the usual 8- 9 weeks they are chosen at ;-)  )from a kennel that was awarded the top show kennel within their breed.  This puppy had an aesthetic thing that it needed to grow that prevented it entering in the ring, and then its size it grew to hindered it a few months later.  In the meantime I had several months of petrol and show entries and other expenses that I paid out for each show only to be told by my breeder at each show that they did not want me going in the ring.  They would then ring me to enter the next show, and the whole cycle started again.  After a few months of this I put my foot down, and have asked my breeder to excuse my do from the ring as it is getting a bit silly now.  This cost me hundreds of pounds (some shows cost me approximately £120 each), and I never ever even got to go in the ring.

If I was to start all over again with hind sight and experience this is what I would do.

Read your standard, understand why you standard describes what it does, try to work out what points if wrong will have more of a detrimental effect on your dog's original purpose (as not all dogs have every point that they need).  Then look for dogs that best fit your ideal (I found the internet a great source, but another great one is the breed handbooks that most breed clubs produce every year).  Once you have found a Kennel that consistently produces the type you are looking for decide upon one bitch within their kennel.  Look at the first 3 generations of her pedigree, and that of the stud of any planned litters.  Do any of these 3 generations have dogs that display the faults that you worked out were the worst ones that your breed could have?  If the answer is yes then check to make sure that it has not consistently been reproduced down the lines (not only will this make it more certain that your pup will have this fault, but it can also make your breeding decisions harder if it is a hard fault to correct).  If it hasn't then speak to the breeder.  Make sure that they breed in a way that you feel comfortable with (e.g. how they look after the pups, the health tests they do, how they ensure temperament, etc.), and then be prepared to wait 1 year + for a pup of your choice.

It can be very tempting to plunge for a dog that is available now, or a dog who has a pedigree full of red, or a top-winning breeder, but from what I am learning these do not always necessary guarantee you success in the ring.

Apart from that I wish you luck, and I can't wait to hear you posting about your success in the ring! ;-)

Crikey Dog mad Feb, why did you allow the breeder to have so much control. Unless you bought the dog in partnership with the breeder, it's really not up to them to dictate whether you get to go into the ring at a show you have entered in good faith.

I've been showing a long time, had no spectacular success, but done OK in my own small way. So my dogs could probably not be described as top drawer, but never once have I been told what to do by any of the breeders. It's just not their business, you have bought and paid for the dog, the decision of whether to show or not, is yours, not theirs. If the dog isn't up to the task, quality wise, it will not be placed. Failure to win would mean you would soon get the message and stop showing. The breeder might advise against showing an inferior specimen, but cannot dictate.

I find the injustice of what you have said, outrageous.

Dawn R.

If you find yourself a good breeder that you can trust they will help you all the way with picking the right pup, both my boys breeders were helpful right from the start, they let me see all the pups, stood them on a table pointed out good points/bad points compared them to eachother etc.  We did this each time I went over, ive learnt loads and I had the pick of the dogs, and my Alf is a real cracker ;)  Alfs breeder doesnt mind the other "non" show pups being shown, we often come up against them at open shows, she does advise the owners not to bother with champ shows though but im sure she wouldnt mind if they did.

Where abouts do you live ? we have a good GSP breeder in my area.

Hi dog mad feb, i'm shocked to at that breeder but i also feel for you being taken advantage of in that way I will say this though there is some unscrepilous breeders out there who will not let a dog in the ring, if they hink it will reflect badly on them:rolleyes:

Well, I wouldn't go so far as to say it was unscrupulous for them to be concerned about poor quality pups reflecting badly on them. Just not realistic to expect to control to that extent, and not realistic to expect the dog fraternity to believe that every puppy they bred was top drawer. No breeder manages to get litters full of champions every time.

Dawn R.

i agree dawn there is no way a breeder could legaly stop you going in the ring with a pup i didnt think

wow thats all of it great advice.  I live in Kent so trying to find breeders down south, we have been looking for a pup for a few months and I am prepared to wait for the right litter.  I just want to get it right as I'd really love to give showing a go, we've had lots of dogs in the past but I have always loved the GSP, my mum has a Lab who still thinks it a lapdog!! lol.  I did a lot of obediance with my mums dogs, etc and a few local shows, we have had a few dogs from breed rescue, the last lot were ESS!  So this time I would like to train from scratch, We have a dog class were I work so ideal to take the pup to work!  I have found a ringcraft classes, so now got to find a puppy! and to find out what to look at for show potential puppies.  Thanks for all the great advice so far.

Renee

I would start by making contact with the breed club and asking for a list of breeders with litters available/due.
I would then phone a few and explain what you want.I would then avoid anyone who promised you a top quality dog since no one can guarantee that.I would also widen your area of choice by trying to travel as far as needed for the right pup.I live in Manchester and the first time I booked a pup it was from Brainless who posts on here.She lives in Bristol!
You need someone who you feel comfortable talking to ...someone who is willing to answer questions and someone who will also ask questions.
My breeders never picked a pup for me but helped me by pointing out what they considered good and bad points in each pup,by stacking them and explaining what I should be looking for and by removing any pup from the equation which was obviously not show quality.
Have you looked at the champdogs GSP page? Worth a look....a couple of litters there that are from good show stock
Archer 

thank you thats really good advice.  we have looked at details on here, but I really need to get in touch with the breed clubs.  I have got the web addys for them so will start telephoning.

And it's all my fault, even though my Tula missed :D