Hi all,

I've just been advised by our breeder that our new pup, who's just turned 12 weeks (and we'll be picking her up on Saturday), will be having her first jab tomorrow - although I expected her to have had this done a few weeks ago now.

From advice I've been given on other forums, I know I need to get her on a pretty organised socialisation "program" (for the want of a better word). and had intended to get her second jab by early next week so I could start this in earnest ASAP. As this has now gone out of the window, when can I get her second jab done if she has the first one done tomorrow? Also, what can I do with her in terms of socialisation a few days after her 1st jab  and how soon after either jab can I take her out?

Also, if she's only had her first jab tomorrow, can I start outside training straight away on Saturday?

I appreciate some of these q's cross over into other Topics, so I'll be happy to move them if required.

Thanks everyone

Karen

To be honest Karen, I would be very sceptical of this breeder.

Firstly a lab should go to her new home at 7-8wks.  Definitely NOT 12 wks, ideally.

However, if a RESPONSIBLE and REPUTABLE breeder couldn't sell a pup and had to keep it on till 12 wks, they would DEFINITELY have given it the first jab at 7/8 wks so she could keep on schedule.  The fact that your breeder hasn't done this already is worrying.

If your puppy is only having her 1st vaccination tomorrow, according to most vaccine manufacturers recommendations she will have to wait at least 2 weeks before the 2nd jab.  That means she will be 14 wks before she has the 2nd jab.  If you are going to play it totally straight and according to the manufacturers' guidelines, you would then have to wait a further 2 weeks before she could go out, which would take you up to 16 wks.  Which is not very good at all.

The best protocol for vaccinations is: 1st jab at 7/8 wks.  2nd jab at 10 wks.  Puppy out and about by 12 wks at the LATEST.  This would meet the vaccine manufacturer's recommendations and would be the earliest you could do it and play it totally "by the book" or their recommendations.

Personally, I take mine out and carry them around every day from 7 wks.  They meet other adult dogs which are vaccinated from 7 wks, they meet both vaccinated and unvaccinated puppies and all kinds of people.  They go to a puppy socialisation class from 7 wks.  They meet farm animals while I hold them and they experience all kinds of different environments while I carry them.  Basically, they get exposed to everything, while being carried, and are allowed down to meet vaccinated dogs either in their gardens or our garden.  From 10 wks, straight after 2nd jab, they go down on the ground.  (I don't wait a further 2 wks, because I think socialisation is more important).

To be perfectly honest.  If I got a lab pup, I would want one at 7/8 wks and would not consider one any older.  That pup would have had both jabs and be down on the ground being socialised by 10 wks at the latest.  You are getting a pup at 12 wks which hasn't even had the 1st jab.  I would personally recommend you look elsewhere for a pup. 

BUT if you are strongly committed to this pup or for whatever reason won't follow that advice, if I were you, I would take her out and about as soon as you get her.  If you are in a high risk area, such as a city or town and on a pavement, where strange dogs may have defecated, then carry her around with you.  Enroll her in a class as soon as possible - I would take her before she has had her jabs, if the trainer will allow that.  Again, this is my personal opinion.  If you tell us where abouts you live, someone may be able to help you with suggesting a trainer.

Are you the person who also has a Cav??

Thanks for getting back so quick - and no she's a Retriever.....

I've got her from a lady who advertises on this site, and I've been to visit to see her surroundings and I've seen her mum, dad, grandparents etc and they're all great.

I've spent some time with her and 2 of her siblings and they were all very confident, bouncy and happy little things. They also look in great condition, and have all the necessary health certs, KC reg etc.

I've totally fallen for this little girl, so I'm really keen on getting her (bit of an understatement). I live in Nottingham and as you suggest am really keen on getting her into puppy classes.

Thanks again for your advice.

My German Shepherd was 12 weeks when we got him in November 1998 and he hadn't had any innoculations either.  We had him innoculated at 12 weeks and he had another one at 14 weeks and then I think if I remember rightly that he could go out at 15 weeks.:-) He was a bit scared the first few times I took him out and a golden retriever barked at him and he was scared stiff lol.  But he was a lovely lad and grew to look forward to his walks.  I lost him in 2004 due to Anal Furunclosis :-(

Good luck with your new puppy :-)

Hi, bit confused here, as she a Lab or Retriever, also yesterday you said she`d already had here 1st innoculations?

Would suggest you find out from breeder exactly what vax she`s had & hasn`t had, there could well be a perfectly good reason why she`s had the 1st vax :)

ok just seen she`s a retriever, ask her breeder what she recommends re vax.

My original post (yesterday regarding inside or outside toilet training) advised that I'd bought a 12 week old Retriever, and I was also asking for advice about socialising her with my friends (mentalist) 8 month old lab.

At someones advice I was told to contact the breeder to check what make of 1st innoculations she'd had to ensure I choose a vet that has the same make for her second set as I was under the clear impression from the breeder (I asked when I saw her) that she had had the 1st set. So I called her today and she advised that she hasn't had them, but that it's common (and I've also heard this from another lady) for Vets to supply the jabs again anyway. (I'm sure this would only apply to dogs where thier job history was unknown anyway ?? )

So today I come on to ask (yet more - thanks all!!) questions as I'm reading and being given so much advice I thought it best to come to the experts as it were.

Hope this clarifies..

Edited - just read the last of your post - should read before I type! lol.

My original post (yesterday regarding inside or outside toilet training) advised that I'd bought a 12 week old Retriever

Part of the confusion may well be that there are 6 different Retriever breeds so it doesn't specify the breed when you say Retriever- better to say Golden if that's the breed. :)

Right-o - will do so in future.

Hi would still ask breeder what vax protocols she follows :) There are many breeders who don`t vax pups till 12wks, resons being immune system at that age is more developed & better able to cope.

You might find this link interesting

http://members.aol.com/ganglineweb/src/gangline/vac.htm

Fluff:

Ok, sorry I got the breed wrong, but same goes for retriever as lab in this case.

You're right that it's not "normal" for vets to supply the same jabs again.  They only do this IF the jabs they give are manufactured by a different manufacturer than the one the dog has already had, OR if they don't know the dog's vaccination history (so safer to start again).

It is in the dog's best interests for her to have as few jabs as possible, because these jabs are a big whack on the immune system and really take it out of them.  Some dogs can react badly to them (only a few, don't want to panic you), and the risks of having a bad reaction are higher if you "over" vaccinate by having more than you really need to have.  So - well done on finding a vet that uses the same vaccine manufacturer as your breeder, it sounds like you've got this one sorted.

As for classes -

I don't know if this is a bit far for you, but she is definitely worth travelling for - an excellent trainer using only positive methods: http://www.teamworktraining.co.uk/puppy.asp

Also in Nottingham you are very lucky since you're not too far away from one of the UK's leading clicker trainers, Kay Lawrence.  She runs "Learning About Dogs" courses, which last a full day and are mostly "one-off" full day classes.  She is based near Birmingham, but you won't need to be going there every week since it's just one off days: Here is a link to her puppy classes: http://www.learningaboutdogs.com/acatalog/Puppy.html    (They are one-off full days, unless specified otherwise.)  You might also be interested in their gundog Puppy course - there is one in July: http://www.learningaboutdogs.com/acatalog/Gundog.html

Otherwise check out www.apdt.co.uk for a list of positive reinforcement trainers in your area, or www.puppyschool.co.uk

*They only do this IF the jabs they give are manufactured by a different manufacturer than the one the dog has already had*

Just to clarify, it should make no difference as to whether previously given vax are from a different manufacture than current vet uses, as long as the required time & protocol between any vax is followed. There is no need to start the regime all over again.

Factually and personally, I agree with you Christine. 

But vets and vaccine manufacturers don't - vaccine manufacturers can only attest what they have tested their products for, and they don't test them with other manufacturer's products.  Therefore they will offer no guarantee that they will work with other manufacturer's vaccines.  And vets want to cover their backs and will only do what the vaccine manufacturer has tested for.  Stupid, I know.