Hi, I Bred a litter of pups earlier in the year and have had a call tonite from new owners saying that they cant cope. I am willing to pick the pup up and was just wondering if when this has happened to other people do they offer a full refund? as this was my first litter i havent got a clue your input would be great thanks!

I think it is helpfull if the exact circumstances of such an event are clearly spelled out in a contract when the puppy is sold but if you have not done that I would suggest from the start you clearly spell out to them what you intend to do to avoid any of the unpleasantness that money can engender :)
This has happened to me once and I did exactly as described in my contract which was deduct reasonable expenses ie advertising and grooming costs (to make pup respectable for viewing) and food costs while he stayed with me and then pass on all the other monies received for him over to the first family.
I do it this way as I feel no need to make any profit from selling him twice (or be out of pocket either :))and getting some of their money back is an incentive for them to abide by the terms of my contract and return him to me rather that have a go at selling him themselves bearing in mind they are legally entitled to do so. 

I have taken 2 pups back in 6 years of breeding and my mother in law took a few back in the 25 years she was and I never have offered a refund as now that pup is classed as a rescue dog and could prove difficult to rehome or if you decide to keep the pup with you s/he could cause alot of problems.  When I collected one of the pups they was expecting a full refund or part of and when they found out that I was not prepared (the 'pup' was 20 months) we had a bit of an argument but when I pointed out rather than sell her in the paper and with the problems she had would proberly go from home to home and even end up in a rescue the lady started to cry and handed her over (the husband was not happy)  My mother in law once gave back two thirds of the pups price, as she sold the pup beliving it would make show standard and when the pup did not it was returned but they was good friends.

Hope this helps.xx

Hi,

If you sold the pup earlier in the year, I personally would not give a refund.  I actually put a clause in and get my new owners to sign it saying that I will always take back a pup whether it be 4 weeks, 4 months or 4 years but no monies will be returned. Most people do not expect you to anyway.

There is a reason for this.

No.1  It discourages people from treating a dog like a handbag, if it does not suit I will return it and get a refund!
No.2  Returning a pup is VERY distressing for it.
No.3  The usual reason for people returning a pup is they could not cope (toilet training etc.) and you usually have to retrain a pup all over again, if it has not been treated well you may also have to re-socialise it too.
No.4  Because it is important that the pup is placed ASAP so that it does not suffer too much going from home to home, you would not sell the pup for the same price again and may even end up giving it away to ensure a loving, permanent home.

There are probably a million other reasons, but at this time of night they have all evaporated, I may think of some more tomorrow, but in the meantime. I personally would not give any sort of refund. And make sure that vaccination booklet, Papers, microchip forms are all returned along with a signed letter to say the pup has been returned to you.

Hi wait and see what they want, and why they can not cope with this puppy, if they want money back you could tell them to wait untill you can find a new owner and tell them it may not be the amount they payed you as the puppy is now older and you will also be charging expences for its keep, that is what i would do . But wait and find out what they want first regards debbie. 

My dogs breeder has my word that if for whatever reason I could not keep her, I would return her to her (the breeder) . I would not have the gall to ask for a refund/money. The dogs well fare is tantamount. In any case the dog will need to be assessed (sp) cared for etc until a suitable home is found

i had this happen to me last year i had a phone call off the owner of a bitch that was bought for showing (i sold her as a pet the fact she was at the time show quality was a + to them) she was all fine but to shy for the ring so they decided to let me know and i could buy her back. 
i said we would meet them half way (as they live over 6 hours away) and i would pass on any money to them after we found a good home for her - taking out things like food and stuff, well they were not happy with that and i heard no more for over a week (i did try and get in touch with them) then a week later i had a phone call saying that they no longer have her as they sold her on.
i don't have any info of the new owners and have not seen a pic of her since she was 6 months old :(

if i could do it again i would offer money back right away not the whole lot but most of it

I took a puppy back through no fault of his own and i offered them less than the original price they paid for him. they where just happy that i would take him back and find him a long term home. I didnt sell him on i decided to keep him where he is now loved and well looked after....

This is what I now put in my puppy sale agreement to make the situation, at least in my breed clear.

"If through unforeseen circumstances it becomes necessary to find your dog a new home, you should contact me as I may be in a better position to find the RIGHT new home, this would normally not entail any refund, as the adopters would not expect to pay for an older pup or adult dog."

I have never sold a returnee, as I am concious that they are not a clean slate like a puppy is and am just grateful for a good knowledgeable home prepared to take on a dog with possible baggage and think that the problems the new owners may have rehabilitating are compensated for by them getting the dog free of charge.

Sadly some breeds are still very saleable as adults/older pups, and in that case a refund would be needed to ensure the dog was not sold on.  Realistically in my breed a pup beyond a couple of months old has no resale value as a pet.

I will always take a dog back, regardless of age, as I feel that if i bred it, its my responsibility to make sure the dog is in a decent home. I do say that, after the initial few days (and assuming pups has been to a vet) that I would offer another pup (or refund) if the one I sold had health problems. If it was a lifestyle problem, my contract says I will take the pup back and rehome if possible, but would only refund moneys after any costs incurred (including advertising, feeding, grooming etc), but its made clear in contract that this price may be no where near the price initially paid.

I do feel very strongly, that if i breed a pup, my responsibilty never ends and wouldnt think twice about removing a dog from owners who wernt taking adquate care of a dog also.

After reading the other posts from experienced breeders I'm beginning to think I've made a mistake. I said in my contracts that I would take the puppies back at any stage, at any age, and refund the purchase price in full. The reason I put this in was to (hopefully) stop the puppy being sold on to someone else. As I've only ever had one litter then at least I know that the worst that could happen would be to have to buy three puppies back - yikes!

I am active in my breed rescue.  Owners contact us for various reasons, cant cope, not what I expected, too old to exercise properly.  Some of the enquires have contacted their breeders to ask what they should do and I am sad to say there are some breeders who either don't respond or say its not their problem. 

The ones that come through rescue are re-homed with no money changing hands, but prospective owners are given the third degree and home visits before they get a re-home dog.  No money ever changes hands.  On the other hand the breeders I know, who re-home their own return dogs, never give money back for older dogs (older being over 2ish) as the amount of work time and effort needed to get the dogs back on track, sometimes not always, is costly in one way or another as is finding the right home.

If your pup can still be classed as a pup, and if it is this years I am sure it can, it may be possible to retrain and re-home it relatively quickly.  As others have said you must make it clear that you will deduct any expenses from and money you are willing to give back to them, and this includes kenneling which can cost between £8 and £12 per day and any additional time and expense grooming ringing round for new home etc.  Put your terms in writing.  At the end of the day you are responsible for the litter you breed and you are obviously a caring person or you wouldn't be asking the question now about taking the pup back.  After all expenses and a relatively smooth re-home I would expect to be out of pocket by £200 and I would not refund the deposit. 

If you need help re-homing your pup talk with your breed club, they are always my first point of contact.

>wouldnt think twice about removing a dog from owners who wernt taking adquate care of a dog also.

The trouble is you would end up on a criminal charge of theft if you removed a dog without the owners permission.  I think we have to recognise that when a puppy is purchased, not matter what arrangements and support we may offer to the purchasers, in law the dog is their property alone.
I think most of us that use this board would always do whatever we could to take responsibility for any puppies produced by us, indeed it is not just a sense of responsibility I sure most of us feel a deep sense of care what happens to them.  If I had to I would refund all the purchase price if I felt the owners where going to dispose of the dog in their own way as it is on the one occasion that I have had to deal with this my people, who had not asked for anything, were pleased to receive what amounted to a bit more than half of the original price. 
I think if you are going to charge £8-12 a day kennelling fees my system would not work as nothing would be left at the end of the day :)  These amounts would be appropriate for a kennel with overheads and a commercial profit but don't seem appropriate, to me, in the sort of situation where a dog is taken back into the breeders home.  I charged my people £10 a week which I felt more that covered his food and weekly grooming needs as I had charged £20 already to strip out his puppy coat and tidy him up.
I do have some issues with giving dogs away for free.  I am very, very careful about vetting, hence this only happening to me once from 3 litters dating back over 9 years, but I do think free dogs attract a lot of time wasters but then perhaps I am lucky as in Cockers there has always been a demand for older puppies and young dogs so charging a reasonable fee (about £100 less than a puppy) was never a problem.

Its not unrealistic to charge kennel fees. If I took a dog or pup back I wouldn't think of going to work and hoping that the returned dog would mix in alright.  I would expect to give the dog round the clock care, which would cost me in lost revenue.  Lost revenue means less money for bills including dog food vets etc.  I am lucky in that I am self employed, in the tourist trade not breeding dogs, but if I give up my time it has to be paid for some how.  With rescue we have a huge network and everyone gives their time free but the people who give 24/7 care are usually retired or lucky enough to be supported in some other way.  While we want the best for our pups you have to be realistic.

Even taking into account kenneling and the deposit I would still be prepared to pay back £350, being the difference between the expenses and the cost of a pup.  If I go on to place the pup or dog with anyone else it would be on the understanding that it would be sold as a pet, if old enough I would even consider taking the cost of spaying on my self before selling any pup on. I would vet new homes carefully again and sell the pup on for about half the cost of a new puppy.

Older dogs are almost always placed through our breed rescue with people who want older dogs.  They are spayed and monitored after they leave and the person placing the dog gives their telephone number in order to keep in touch regarding advice and support.

We al have our different ways, but we all want the same thing in the end.

I suppose I am even luckier and don't really work at all apart from the occasional bit of part time  :)  lost revenue does not come into the equation for me at all.  Therefore, it is not so much unrealistic to charge kennel fees in my situation but rather it would be unfair as I in no way put myself out of pocket, obviously if there had been further expenses such as vets fees they would have been deducted too.  I also think rescue work is different as you are likely to be called upon to do this sort of thing pretty regularly.  I'm not sure what sort of prices your breed commands but when I sold this pup it was initially for £350, second time round I just asked £250 If I had charged £10 a day to lodge mine for, say, just 2 weeks together with the grooming and advertising fee of about £35, there would have been virtually nothing left to give to my people making the whole issue of giving a refund pointless in which case, depending on the type of people they were, they may well have been tempting to the sort the issue themselves.

Your right of course every ones situation is different and if you are sure you are going to get your pup back come what may they you must do what you think best.  I wish I could stop working and be a dog lover full time but I cant maybe I will when I retire.

The more I read about puppy contracts the more I add clauses to my own, its been many many years since I bred a litter, I intend to go through every detail with prospective owners until they are fed up listening to me and to make it clear how returning works and when it becomes re homing.  I am very lucky that with my main breed every one knows every one else and I have people on my list who want to show, so I will be seeing them regularly.  If you can afford to take most of the expense on your own shoulders and you feel this is the way to go then you really must do it.

Good luck with finding a new home.

ATB Echo

Thank you so much for the advice that has been given to me! I have made enquires to people that i have spoken to after the pup where found new homes and also contacted the owners of the litter mates as a few have made enquires to see if i was going to have any more litters. They had contacted me due to them knowing someone who is interested in one of our pups. After a sleepless nite and almost jumping in the car at 2am this morning to make the 6 hour journey i have decided to email the family to see what arrangements can be made. i would love the pup in question to live with us full time but maybe the oh would need convincing!!!
Thanks so very much one and all.....

I had never had any pups returned to me until this year and I have had two out of the same litter :( 
The first one was used as a item to hurt a partner in a spilt relationship and he refused to let us have the dog back because the other one wanted us to.  My second one we paid £200 to get back and he is not going anywhere.  He is a lovely puppy and so we have decided to keep him