Took, him to the beach today as always, and he was attacked by an Akita, he had no chance, luckily he hasnt suffered any permanent injury, just a cut ear, but it was very nasty, and he was very scared, he tried to defend himself, and the owner got the dog off, i was still running towards them , it happened so quickly! Hes all shook up now, and sat with me, i really hope it doesnt change him, because he has always been wonderful with other dogs, and ive really enjoyed owning a stafford who was so trustworthy, i hope all my work hasnt gone down the pan, the other dogs owner was very sorry, and said '' he doesnt like bull breeds '' ! thanks for listening xxx

Thats awful! Hope he recovers quickly...best thing is to get him out with other dogs as if nothings happened.....
People like that akita owner make me soooo MAD
Archer

That's terrible!! You must be shook up as well. Some people make me very angry The Akitas owner gave a very poor excuse IMHO. How does the dog differentiate between breeds? Say that dog attacks a puppy or an elderly dog, goodness knows what the outcome would be.

Thank god there was no serious damage, get him out and about so that he and you regain his confidence ;)

According to the Akita Club, it is reccommended that Akitas are not exercised off lead. Sorry to hear about you boys experience, it's like one of your kids being beaten up isn't it!

Dawn R.

Thanks, yes and when i was running towards him, it was like i was in a dream, my legs didnt seem to be working ! hes fine though  x

Hope he's OK - and you!
I agree with the suggestion of getting him out and about as soon as possible, (not literally after the attack as the adrenalin will still be going and he may be in a bit of shock for a day or so depending on what exactly happened) but try to be very normal and if possible, take him to a place you know well where the dogs will be friendly and where he mayhave his dog friends.

Unless a dog attack has really shaken an adult dog, they usually take it in their stride if they have been well socialised :)

Good luck
Lindsay
X

Will Do , but this time ill put my running trainers on !!

Poor both of you,
I still think about the story of my Dad. He and my Mum were walking their two yorkie's last year when a dog grabbed the little one in his jaws and would not let go. My dad actually straddled the dog and started hitting its head and eventually he let go as the owner just stood there saying it was because he was on a lead.
Poor Harry was very lucky the dog left one very shallow puncture would and a bruise on the other side. The story though was horrific and I think it really shook him up, I bought them an alarm shortly after which is said to make a dog flee when its set off. He now carries this everywhere. 

On a good note Harry got over it and is still fine with other dogs.

Bigs hugs for the dog.
Regards
Karen

Not excusing but dogs definately do distinguish between breeds and often will like or in this case dislike ones they have run into before even if a different dog of same breed.  My lot are awful when it comes to Goldend Retrievers and Dobes as they ahve lots of freinds in these breeeds so always think it is one of their mates that they must say hello to.

The Akita should have been on lead, as their own breed club advises they are never off lead because of the combination of Dog Dominance and Independance makes them unreliable off lead.

Im really sorry to hear about this as an owner of three Akitas im absolutley discusted that the owner was walking their dog off the lead, they can be very dominant and dog aggressive breed also it sounds very much like that the owner knows nothing about Akitas or they would have known this one very simple rule.  Im really sorry to hear about this infact im gutted :( as trained correctly they are a wonderful breed, it only takes one idiot to cast them in a bad light, but even so even a well trained Akita should still not be walked off the lead.
Im sending hugs and kisses to your dogglet i hope hes feeling much better soon.xx

So sorry to hear about your trouble - I've been on a walk today with about 18-20 people and about 16 dogs of various breeds from Mongrels to Labs, from Staffords (mine) to Akitas, from Border Collies to Cockers, and they were all really really good one B/Collie was muzzled as she is unsure of other dogs and a rescue. And lots of the dos walked off lead throughout but the two Akita's were NEVER off lead all through the walk because as has been said they are dominant although they were friendly when meeting nose to nose with other dogs, the one lady I believe only the one (today) works for Akita rescue and said they are dominant dogs who should not be excercised off lead other than in secure places with no other dogs.

So sorry to hear about your attack - how old is your dog? the up side is Staffs are remarkably tolerant and laid back.

Karen  

My dog is 20 months, he is very laid back actually, i wanted to take him home straight , but he wated to stay and finish of his run ! but it was when he got home he was shook up, ive bathed his ear, and he is fast out , its nice to know that even when really provoked he only tried to defend himself,  and when the other dog had been pulled of him , he didnt go back. Hes a big sturdy boy, and i had my bitch with me aswell, she carried on playing with a tibetan she likes ! i dont know ! I actually didnt realise that about Akitas, the man was only a young lad about 19 and had little control over it, the other thing was that is quite ironic, is that its name was choaker, which is exacty what he was trying to do to Taz !!

As the owner of a male Akita, just like to say sorry about your boy's experience. Our Akita is never off the lead in public. We don't have a problem with him, he doesn't fly out at other dogs. The problem is other people who don't have their dogs under control - sorry to say, it's usually (but not always) Jack Russells who come running straight up to our dog. And the owners shout "It's alright, he won't fight" . Doesn't it ever to occur to them that the dog on a lead might strongly object to having his space invaded?

I totally agree, we were on the beach once with our fear agressive rescue dog (unsocilaised) A big airedale ran up to him and he started to freak, I was scared because my dog would bite in that situation. (we had only had him a few weeks) My partner shouted to the owner to call her dog back and she started shouting at us, why what's wrong with your dog. This stupid woman had no idea what we had been going through and that we were seeing a behaviorist to resolve the problems.

I'm thankful to say that with lots of hardwork our dog is no longer like that but for a time I hated walking my dog as I lived in fear of those who let their dogs off lead and then had a go at me when my dog got upset.

My dog si off lead now mostly but if I see someone with a dog on lead I call my mine back and leash him until we have passed.

 

god,i feel for you!
hope your boys ok

Hi im also an owner of an male Akita and please do not think bad of this breed they are wonderful dogs in there own right but do need strict handling and as they say there is no such thing as a bad dog just bad owners but I must admit there is a lot more irresponsible Akita owners than there is good which will bring the Akita breed down just like the Rottweiler and a few other breeds a few years ago, I do hope your dog doesn't suffer from his social training and recovers from his ordeal, though we have a similar problem in my area with another irresponsible owner of an Dogue de Bordeaux who thinks his dog aggressive dog should run free to do as it pleases and is invincible, I now have to avoid walking my dog in the same place as do other people, but sometimes it is unavoidable not to walk through this area and my heart is in my mouth as I do, it would be frightening to think what could happen if these 2 dogs got together, I cant help but think if there was to be a lead law in the uk there would be fewer incidents from dog attacks to other dogs and people alike, and large fines for those people who do comply with the leash law, I do think its not fair for the people with good social dogs to suffer form not letting there dogs run free but it will help solve those irresponsible owners problems, this is just my view and im sorry if I offend anybody

I dont think badlt of any breed there are good and bad in all , but as far as friendly dogs of the lead running up to dogs on, i woder why people who hve agressive dogs,dont walk them round the srteets on the lead,why do some people insist on walking in doggy areas, and then go mad when a friendly dog runs up to their dog ? not directed at anyone , just  a observation. Thanks to all those who replyed, i didnt want to give any breed a bad name, its the people not the dog  x

Sorry to hear about your dog, hope you both are feeling much better. Why does it always seem to be the nasty dogs that are allowed to walk off lead?  And in my experience the owners couldn't care less, and laugh at it. Or they say the usual saying, "Oh, he's never done that before". I was walking my Blenheim Cavalier dog once, and a dog which was always walked off lead (even on the road) went for him, the owner said "he doesn't like brown dogs". Shortly after I was walking my tri-colour Cavalier and the same thing happened. Only this time it was "he doesn't like black dogs". Some of these people don't even take a lead with them. I now have a GSD, and the only time she is off lead, is Forestry Commission Woodland which is just up the road from me, but if someone approaches me with a dog, I put her on a lead, not because I don't trust her as she is very friendly with other dogs, but the amount of people who say their dog is OK when they are not is unbelievable. I think some of them must get some enjoyment out of saying it, and letting their dog attack others.

I know what your saying but like yourself I took the time to take my akita to puppy socializing classes, My dog is always on a lead and he will great another dog in a social manner but things could go wrong if he doesn't want to play and although this has never happened im always ready to react but in all honesty if he was aggressive towards other dogs and I have control with a lead why should I not take him to the fields where there might be other dogs in my opinion like another post says if you see a dog over the field with a lead on they is a reason for this alarm bells should ring, and if you think your dog will run to great this dog than it should be recalled and placed under control, because most people in this position will say "im so sorry my dog has bitten yours but my dog was under control and on a lead but when I saw your dog coming over I did pull him closer to me I heard you shouting your dog back but it still came over therefore your dog was the one out of control not mine" im not saying that what I would say but iv heard it so often that why I think all dogs should be on a lead in a public then every body has control over the dogs and fewer accidents will happen

yes i know that but why would you take a dog to a field or the beach if you couldnt let it off ?

Your absolutely right!

Surely if a dog is a risk them it should be muzzled?

Anyway the owner sounded like a right pratt...I would have kicked him and the dog if it bit one of mine, right up and down the beach!

A dog under control and on a lead is not a risk. Do you suggest every dog should be muzzled? If not, where would you draw the line? A Chihuahua running up to practically any other dog would be at risk - because most dogs are much bigger. Put it another way. Why do owners risk their dogs by allowing them to run up to other dogs? I also have another smaller ultra-friendly Spitz breed & I would never let them go running up to other dogs who are on the lead. Even the friendliest of dogs feels at a disadvantage if it is restrained & another dog is running free. And Sarstaff - why on earth shouldn't we take our dogs to fields & the beach? Just because a dog is on the lead doesn't mean it has to be walked around the streets all day surely?

A dog on a lead requires more exercise usually than a dog off-lead - so why not on the beach/field ???

Daisy

its abit of a tease though eh! its like taking a kid to the chocolate factory and not letting them have any sweets!

Clearly if its ripping chucks out of other dogs its not under control and if your dog is not dog friendly is walked on a beach where you are likely to meet other dogs then shouldnt it have a muzzel???

If you know your dog has the temperment to bite then why not muzzel?

With a name like Chocker dog socialisation doesnt seem high on the owners priority list!

id prefer to muzzle than to have my dog attack & injure or maybe kill another!
(not that mine are nasty,but if they were!!!!)

Exactly, if my dog ever bit another dog or showed aggression when approached to the point I thought it would fight then I would muzzel.

Why is that such a dirty word?????? Surely prevention is better than cure? Your putting a muzzel arounds its mouth not pulling out its teeth.....

why is muzzling seen as such a bad thing?

Why should a dog that is on a lead and under control, have to wear a muzzle ?? It is up to the owners of dogs that are not on a lead to stop their dog from pestering the dog on the lead. Many dogs that are not aggressive get very upset if they are on the lead and another dog gets a bit too close for comfort :(

Daisy

Sarstaff, i am very sorry that your dog got attacked, but i think it is a bit mean saying that people with aggressive dogs shouldn't be allowed anywhere other than walked on the streets! Its a bit like saying people without a dog shouldn't walk through the woods!  How can you try to socialise a fear aggressive dog if he is never allowed to see other dogs? Some dogs who may be mildly aggressive are let off lead but put back on the lead when they see another dog. As long as the owners are sensible and have control of their own dogs there really is no reason why people with aggressive dogs can't go on nice walks! Don't forget just because you can't let you dog off that doesn't mean it can't enjoy the sights and smells of the countryside and beach, and the same goes for the owner! If a dog is aggressive then sure keep it on a lead or muzzled, but with a bit of consideration from ALL dog owners there is no reason why we can't all enjoy the same walks.
I hope your dog is ok.

The reason I did not want to muzzle my dog was because it was fear agression, I did try it once before I got help from a behaviorist but the results were awful, he was so upset he was foaming at the mouth and sick. if I continued to do this he would have been even more scared and would never get over that. If I didn't take him to a park or field how would I have ever got him socialised what chance would we have had of getting him better? If you are going to let your dog off leash you should be responsible to have trained them well enough to come back or at least leave another dog on lead alone.

 

The only trouble with muzzling, is that it only prevents your dog from biting another. It doesn't stop posturing, barking, growling e.t.c. so of approached by another dog can be at risk off attack themselves (many dogs will rise to the bait as it were if they feel threatened.) and have no way of protecting themselves if they were attacked. Once again we return to the real problem, not the one of aggressive dogs, but one of offlead dogs which are not under the owners control.

I am really sorry that your baby was hurt if anything happened to ours however minor I would be devastated

there are rights and wrongs here, as the owner of a softy Staff who loves all other dogs, she used to be a nightmare for running up to all other dogs leads or no leads and wanting to play when she was younger. She was great on recall until these cirumstances and then wouldnt listen to us even if we offered chicken!
So it would have been our fault if the other dog on the lead attacked her. So when we realised this was happening we were extra vigilant and would spot people/dogs before she realised they were there and call her back and put her on the lead. She is better now that she is 10months old seems to be a bit more wary and you can see her assessing the situation first.
I think though that if we had an aggressive dog for whatever reason , it would be our responsibilty to ensure that we would take her out at unsocial times when there was little risk of seeing other dogs so she could go to the beach or countryside and not miss out. Its a two way street , we all need to know our dogs' temperaments and weaknesses and assess their needs,then decide how to juggle it all. We owe it to our dogs and other owners/dogs
Perhaps easy fo rme to say, we're lucky cos we live in a rural area and there are hundreds of places to take Giorgia if we had a problem with aggression

Why take the dog out at unsocial hours ? Surely a dog that is nervous of other dogs needs to be taken out and exposed to as many other dogs as possible (on lead and at a safe distance). If your dog was frightened of humans, you wouldn't take him/her out at night so that she never saw anyone ? :)

The original poster's dog was attacked by another dog that was NOT on a lead. This discussion has twisted somewhat and implies that ALL dogs that are on lead are aggressive or that an aggressive dog will attack anything that comes near it even if it is on lead :) There are many dogs that have many different problems with other dogs - some small problems, others not so small.

Daisy

The trouble is, being on a lead makes many dogs nervous and more likely to attack - many years ago I had one just the same. If he was being walked on a lead we needed to carry a large stick to break up any fights - if he was off the lead he ignored other dogs.

We found the best thing to do was to walk him where either all dogs were on leads, or none.

But yours is a very good example why people should have control if they let their dogs off the lead. Nothing annoys me more than an amorous male who pounces on my (spayed) bitch when she is on the lead (sorry - male dog, not human :D ). If their advances continue for more than a few seconds she quite rightly tells them off :) But this is not aggression, merely her right to protect herself.

Daisy

Exactly daisy! Few dogs are actually just aggressive for the sake of it. Most are doing it out of fear. And the only way to get rid of fear aggression is to socialise, socialise, socialise! THere are also 2 types of owners of aggressive dogs, the responsible ones like us who do all we can to prevent problems, and owners such as the akita owner in the original post, who pdon;t really canre and will walk their dog whenever they like, rarely on lead, and rarely ever care if the dog attacks another. THey are not going to change. However the responsible owners who unfortunatly, often through no fault of their own (think rescue dogs for example) have aggressive dogs, feel ostrasized enough without being told that they are only welcome to walk in nice areas such as a beach or park at the dead of night, or else they have to pavement pound, purely because people do not want the hassle of recalling their dog and putting it on a lead if there is annother dog on lead. I am sorry but to me that sounds so unfair. As i said as long as ALL owners are responsible there is no reason why we should not walk at the same time as everyone else in the same places as everyone else. If i had a child who was a bit of a bully i wouldn't refuse to take him to the park unless it was the dead of night, incase we saw other children?!

I think maybe the discussion has got out of hand, i didnt mean to offend anyone, suppose my view was a a bit narrow minded, i hadnt really thought it through, but i would have thought, owning a dog who is very agressive with other dogs and it is beyond change, then wouldnt it just be frustrating for the dog to see other dogs running of the lead and having fun, Of course theres always a risk when you let dogs off they might not get on, but i was talking about dogs that were beyond repair. I have to admit though that my dogs are not fantastic at recall when other dogs are about, and are naturally curious, but are very good at reading signals and will avoid trouble. The only problem i can see is if you have a young pup who is inquisitive, and is in the process of being tought recall, and it gets atacked by a dog on the lead. It just seems cruel on the agressive dog to let it see what its missing out on.

I agree I would not personally muzzle my Akita aggressive or not I use a dogmatic head collar and a lead and I have the best control over my dog if somebody's dog came over and he did bite it I would be distraught to say the least but if I muzzled him what defence would he have if an aggressive dog like the Dogue de Bordeaux attacked him he wouldn't stand a chance and like I said why should my dog not walk on a field or beach just because other people cant control their dogs, I do walk my akita on a field with a normal lead and head collar and use a 25ft lunge lead for a horse when its all clear so my dog does benefit from a run and a bit of freedom although I still have control and reel him in if I see another dog but there is a few people that couldn't give a s**t if their dog goes and picks a fight, I also take him on buses and the beach I do not drive so he has to be social epically with people but really people shouldn't let their dog off the lead until they have total recall as any dog can be aggressive I don't think anybody can put their hand on their heart and say my dog will never attack another dog because even the most friendly dog has a bad day and doesn't want to play and might nip another dog that might react badly and attack, after all dogs will be dogs

Daisy

what I was trying to suggest was a way of allowing aggressive (for whatever reason) dogs the freedom to run off the lead . This could be combined with other walks on the lead for the socialising part.
The fact that the discussion has digressed a little is a good thing too because the lead or no lead problem causes significant problems for many owners. Also Sarstaff did mention their concern about aggressive dogs not being on the lead so that opened the new thread of the discussion really

Thgen w2e would be like in the USA where dogs never get to run free except in dog parks where there ae loads of dogs and fights more likely to break out.  I would hate to not be able to let my dogs get their free running living as most people do with jjust a postage stamp for a garden.  My dogs are very well socialised and can cope with freindly, grumpy and agressive dogs.  Won't say their recall is perfect as being a scent hunter they do get their noses down, but they don't get into bother with other dogs, they have better things to do.

Hi sarstaff you do have the right to make a complaint your dog was attacked by another dog regardless, the dog was only doing what it thought was natural (in animal terms) but it's the owner that's suppose to have a brain and this Akita owner hasn't done his homework as Akitas must never be let off the lead as they are very dominant dogs and not only that they have a very high prey drive for small animals also very independent so the chances of recalling an Akita is second to none, But allot goes to the irresponsible breeder as well for not vetting the buyer and not informing the buyer to what he\she its buying and the potential dangers of owning such a powerful breed

Whoa. I have a staff and would not muzzle mine - because

A. I am responsible.
B. I am responsible.

I would however walk a dog through a park or on a beach on the lead with no free running especially if I thought/knew my dog was liable to attack or defend themselves viiciously if attacked.

I walked my adult staff bitch with over 20 dogs at the weekend various dogs from Akita's to Border collies some rescue dogs too (one collie who wore a muzzle and was not let off lead throughout the walk - a rescue who was more scared than vicious but would have bitten if not muzzled her owner was doing the best they could and after a while the dog calmed down if you don't try you won't move forward will you)
You cannot critise a dog for poor social skills if you are not willing to help the owners improve.

Another dog ran free (owner only had him 3 months another rescue) but was muzzled at the start (very hyper, and liable to bite due to being over excited) After a short while the muzzle came off - happiness.
The two Akita's were kept on lead throughout the walk but were fine with the dogs runing loose around them.
My Staff bitch mostly ran free throughout and was fine (but she has been loved and shown the right way from day 1 first by her breeder then by us) however she is not submissive and  she will not be picked on but does no more than let the dog know this thats all, and when called away from playing comes straight away. But by the same token I rarely stop her playing nicely. And there again she will not dash up to other dogs off lead because its bad manners she will not even cross over a 3ft pathway toward another loose dog if told "no" because people put thier dogs on leads for various reasons and I do not know why on just the approach so better to call mine to heel or get her to sit or down until I get there.

And I would never ever let either of mine be off lead by roads or anywhere there are dangers like fast flowing water/cliff tops ect.

I'd expect loose running dogs anywhere else - and happily let mine play. If I didn't want mine to mix with other dogs then I would be a road walker at 3.00am :

Karen

I didn't make myself clear - the places where I personally believe all dogs should on a lead are near roads, cliffs or other dangerous places. Everywhere else people should expect that dogs may be off the lead and that dogs, being social creatures in the main, want, nay need to interact with others. They can't learn social skills if they're all on the lead. So, if I don't want to run the risk of loose dogs coming to meet mine (such as when one's in season, for example) it's my responsibility to take them where this won't happen.

Agreeing with you wholeheartedly again :D :D :D

I have taken so long to write that two people have posted after me :)

Hello JG and Brainless :)

Thank you Sarstaff - I can understand why you were upset. One thing I'd like to point out though. Some people seem to be assuming that all dogs who will fight and cause damage are aggressive. Most Akitas are NOT aggressive. They do not start fights. They are not nervous either, but totally self possessed. They would not normally start a fight BUT they like their own space, they don't want to be rushed up to by any dog. If they perceive that they are about to be attacked they (like any other breed) are not going to stop & ask questions. If I'm walking my Akita  and he is attacked I am not going to totally restrict my dog while the attacker takes chunks out of him. But if I don't & the other dog is seriously bitten who is going to take the blame? Obviously, it'll be the big bad Akita won't it?

Hi I think we are in the same boat Anwen I watch mine like a hawk when another dog grumbles because they are Staffs and who would get the blame in the event of a fight - the staff of course if people were as responsible with other peoples dogs as they are with their own there would be less trouble when dog walking - :)

Staffs do not normally start fights either but sadly they do occasionaly finish them :( and it those that hit the headlines.

Karen

I understand the reasons for keeping a dog away from others for example when in season. Mt bitch had to be on the lead for many months back in the summer because of the damage to her paw. It was surprising how many people - some well-known to me - would still let their dog jump all over her. My older dog needed exercising too - so are you saying that I should have taken them both somewhere else, for many months, to avoid off lead dogs ?  :) There are many reasons why dogs are on leads and other owners should be aware of this and keep their dogs away. If they need to socialise their dog, then they should ask the other owner. If my dog is off lead, I would not just let him run up to strange dogs. I would check that it was OK first, before letting him.

Daisy

duplicated sorry :)

Exactly Daisy - but many people either have no control over their dog and can't or worse won't stop them running up to a dog either on or off lead.

Karen