its called SUPADOG CONDITION, been feeding it for about 6 months and dogs look great on it, but reading all the stuff on here makes you worried , the ingredients are
   wheat, poultry meal 14% peas 4% poultry fat, fish oil, dicalcium phosphate, calcium carbonate, permitted preservatives and colours. its 4.99 for 2.5 kg.

          thanks x

Ingredients Wheat, poultry meal (min 14%), peas (min 4%), poultry fat, fish oil, dicalcium phosphate, calcium carbonate. Contains permitted EEC preservatives and colours.

So the largest single ingredient is wheat, hardly an appropriate food for dogs, not suitable for those with a problem with gluten and your food is 80% cereal........ incomplete protein. Which EEC preservatives and colours, why does it need colours, do the dogs mind?

But if it suits your dog and you are happy to feed it that is fine.

i feel like ive been told of tohme, if ididnt care what i fed my dog i wouldnt have asked,anyway what would you reccomend.

Well I would always recommend raw feeding as IMHO it is what they dog was designed to eat.

However that is not practical for everyone, neither does everyone want to do it or agree with it.

If I had to pick a dry food Burns would probably be top of my list, although it may contain too little oil for some dogs. Just meat, rice and vegetables, and I would avoid the variety that contains Sugar beet pulp, this just bulks up the stool.

My food of choice would be Naturediet, meat, rice, bone and carrots.

However, if my dog had a problem with rice then I would have to look elsewhere; not all foods suit all dogs but those would be my starting points.

Both are widely available and delivered to your door if wished.

However that is only my opinion.............................. :D

HTH

Honest opinion? It's crap! And very expensive. I pay £25 for a 15kg sack. Look for a food that has meat, ie chicken or lamb, not poultry meal, as the main ingredient. Wheat is a cheap filler and as the first ingredient on the list is the highest. Dogs do not need wheat, it is useless. A lot of dogs are also allergic to it. IMO the best ones are things like Burns, Arden Grange, Wafcol and the new Pets at Home range. On the other hand, if your dogs are happy on it, it is up to you really.  I would avoid Iams and Eukanuba like the plague. Neither would I touch tinned food such as Pedigree Chum. Or any other dog food you can buy at a Supermarket. You could also go back through the archives to see what others think of various dog foods. A good place to look if you are unsure of what is in dog food, is on the Burns website. They actually tell what everythng is and what to avoid. Hope this helps. Good luck!

thanks ill do some research

Up until 3-4 weeks ago I fed Autarky for breakfast and raw at lunch and evening meal. I now feed BARF, no processed food whatsoever. In just three weeks the difference in my labs is quite amazing, Bailey stopped itching, the two blacks have the most amazing coats. and my pups were weaned on a BARF diet. It doesnt cost much more than processed dog food and cost me £20 for a second hand freezer. A little more time is involved in getting the balances right but looking a my dogs now, I only wish I had the gumption to change earlier. Just needed a push in the right direction, thanks Tohme ;) I must admit to having an excellent butcher though.

Hi ClaireH - I'm afraid after reading the ingredients in that new PAH range I personally wouldn't put it in the league as Burns - granted it's not the worse I've ever seen but still looks like a lot of crap to me?
Sarah :)

It is heavily maize based along with other cereals, etc it is certainly not in the same league as Burns!

Hi Rozzer, what do you think is wrong with it? I wouldn't exactly put it in the same league as Burns, but for the first time in months my dogs aren't looking thin and having the squits every five minutes!

<<IMO the best ones are things like Burns, Arden Grange, Wafcol and the new Pets at Home range>>  Hi Claire, I think what is wrong with it, is that it contains cheap cereal fillers that you earlier describe as crap is all ;)  I personally wouldn't feed it to my hound, but if I were going to feed commercial dry food I would feed 'burns' - I noticed that PAH range also includes Sugar beet pulp and 'additives'.  I'm not critisising the way you feed your dog as such because that is your choice and as you say your dog does well on it - just found your earlier statement a little contradictory.
Sarah :)

I used to feed Burns Active, and that contains Sugar Beet Pulp! I now feed Arden Grange, it was hard to get hold of at first as there are no stockists in my area, but I have finally found a website that delivers and lets you order online. The a.g. website makes you fill in an order form. I used to feed Barf, but had terrible trouble getting bones from the butchers in my area, and I always worried I was missing something from their diet. Then I went onto Burns, but one of my dogs is a terrible scavenger, and was always getting the squits from eating bread etc on walks. They were both underweight, constantly hungry and I also felt the food was too dusty. I believe several other people have found the same. Whenever I contacted Burns about the weight loss, all I got was 'feed them less'! An active collie who does agility, flyball and obedience four nights a week, then double shows at the weekend can not live off 6 ozs a day! After 2 years of trying with Burns, I decided it obviously didn't suit my dogs. As someone who tries to do as much holistically as possible, not an easy decision. As you said, PAH is not in the same league as Burns or Naturediet, but it is miles above Euk and Iams. That was the only point I was trying to make.

Not all Burns varieties contain SBP.

I said Burns ACTIVE, I know the others don't contain it. Point is, if it is so bad, why do holyer than thou Burns put it in their food? I believe in keeping things as natural as possible, and that means as possible for that dog. At the end of the day, what is the use of feeding a holistic food, be it barf or Burns, if the dog is not thriving on it? I will feed my next pup holistically, even though the others aren't on it, providing of course it suits him.

i AM interested to in arden grange as it keeps coming up in post however have just checked with thier help desk this morning and asked if thier product was GM free the answer was that it is not .Jo

Hi Jo,
I work for Arden Grange petfoods and can tell you that ALL Arden Grange products are GM FREE.
I don't know who gave you the incorrect information, but I would suggest that if you need verification, contact the office again and ask to speak to the nutrition department.
Tel: 01273 833390.
I hope this helps to put your mind at rest.
Liz

<<<<dogs look great on it>>>>

If you think your dogs are looking good on it then I suggest you keep with it!

I know many people on here will slate Pedigree Nugurts but all my dogs are ooking really good on it and so guess what?  We feed it in our house and we have minimal pooing, nice shiny coats and all dogs with a nice weight! 

When I got Fagan I swore I would only feed him the *best* dog food.  So we started off on Burns, which although he gulped down (because you feed such a small amount he was starving) didnt put any weight on him and when I upped the amount it gave him the squits, he ended up looking half starved with bones popping out everywhere :(  so I put him on tripe for a week just to sort his guts out and he put on stacks of weight so I went onto BARF and for a couple of months he flourished and loved everything about it, then he went off BARF and refused to eat :rolleyes: even if I starved him for a day he just didnt want to eat it and just trailed it round the kitchen I was then given a bag of "all in one" from the natural dog food company by the petshop and Fagan loved it, knocking that back plus any raw meat I added to it - I thought I had cracked it ...... wrong :rolleyes:  We are now near the end of the sack and he is refusing to eat it but he loves the JWB that im feeding my friends dogs who im looking after, I wont be changing him to this because its not BUAV approved but I have phoned a few companies from the BUAV website for samples, and yes some of these contain different grains and things which originally I wouldnt feed him, one of them is even a vegan food ( ) but hell if eats it and he looks good on it then I will feed him it, I will still be mixing the raw with it to give him variety and im just going to get used to having two bags of food on the go because he obviously gets bored of one food all the time and who can blame him ;)  Alot of people say that he is spoilt but I dont think so (unlike my cats who regularly turn their noses up at salmon ), there is nothing worse than your pup refusing to eat day after day and losing weight just because he doesnt like what you feed him, so sod what the *best* food is, my dog eats what he enjoys eating and if that means changing food every so foten then thats what I will do ............ rant over :)

Claire - I must stress that this isn't about how YOU feed your dog, that is entirely YOUR decision and I respect it.  Its about you saying that a food was crap, one reason being its cereal content...Then, you recommend a food (PAH) that contains pretty much the same thing as the crap you earlier mentioned - thats all.  If we are agreed that high cereal content is a bit crap then PAH brand falls into that category.  But that is nothing against you for feeding it...As you say, it works for your dog, so great :)
Sarah
PS apologies if that doesn't make sense?  Got a lovely bottle of red by my side :D

Can I just suggest that before feeding any dry food check on how much it swells up first by placing a handful in a basin and pour warm water over it. Leave for say 5 minutes then see how much it has expanded.
Why? simply because if your dog eats a stomach full and it starts to expand in the stomach then gastric torsion (bloat) can occur.
Hope nobody minds me putting in this tip for those who may not have considered this before.

Bazza

I have fed crap to my dogs all my life (currently Burns). They have thrived on crap, be it a high content of rice, maize, oats or other cereal (even wheat).
In the UK the highest selling dog food is Bakers, and next would come a range of similar foods full of colourants and additives. Tescos sells the greatest amount of of pet food in the UK (again it is the "crap" category as there is a high cereal content).
Even with the majority of the UK feeding these foods to dogs and exercising their pets less than ever (with obesity problems et al on the rise), the dog are living longer.

I know and see many dogs fed on "inferior" foods and I often wounder to myself why I pay £20  more for a bag. I stick to what I am happy with though and as yet have not ventured outside of the crap foods.

if you say something often enough it makes it belivable   We call our selfs a nation of animal lovers but in most cases we look at the justification of spending the least amount we can on food for our dogs justy it by saying "the dog looks well on it " iF I spend £20.00
more on a bag of dog food its because i want my dog to eat the best. its not just a case of looking good but feeling good to. Robert to fully justify your point go and by a qaulity product and compare and check how much better your dog becomes , look at the feeding guides (they tend to be less because the correct protien source is used)   instead of  just the money side (Bakers i belive has  salt in it and dogs can become addicted to salt hence the reason it sells ,backed up by a massive advertisment campian amined at the human gullibility )

I do buy a quality product. I feed Burns at the moment. My dogs look fantastic, they are healthy, energetic, bright eyed. Execellent toilet etc. What are the improvements that I am looking for? Tell me what signs I am looking for when you say "how much better your dogs become". I have been recommended one or two hollistic foods recently with no cereal in it. Because my dogs are doing so well I will continue with the crap (i.e high rice content)

My point is that there are a lot of comercial foods out there. Some good, some bad. Most foods sold through pet stores etc have a high cereal content. I do not label a food as crap just because of the cereal content. Many people on this site seem to have a Burns love affair even when they don't use dry foods. i guess this is because it uses the most digestible of the cereals and as no additives in it. The reason I use it is because it suits my dogs and has a fairly clear food label.
i have bought foods with maize as the main cereal source in the past and have had excellent results. These had the same feeding rates as I use now (there was a good meat base in both foods). I have one or  two friends with dogs fed on foods with high wheat content. They don't appear to be suffering in anyway to me.

i simply don't think we should judge foods based on the cereal content alone. We should look at the additives, the level of salt in the food, the meat content etc. , but as importantly how it suits our animals.

My point about Bakers (which is not something I would feed) is that there are plenty of dogs who thrive on it in outward appearence. i always bear the 'average' dog owner in mind when reading some of the stuff on this site - i.e. the busy family with pet food on the shopping list. it's not the most important thing on their minds. They buy a food after seeing a picture a bit like there dog on an advert, then repeat buy on the basis that Fido is doing well. Then when there is a special offer on another food the owners look at each other and say "Fido' not been looking so good the last month, it's time for a change".

Thats a pretty much gerneralised sweeping statement there :p

Dont forget that alot of people are reccomended these types of foods by their vets, so they think they're feeding something thats ok. My vetsaid to me that anything purina was ok, so I had mine on Bakers Complete for a year. No vet visits, health excellent. After doing some research on here, I switched to Barf, but I do still feed bakers and Eukanuba (sp?) mixed for his dinner.

Each to their own I guess, and some people dont know any different. :)

    I have fed skinners for the last 3 Years Field and trial  Maintainace in the summer then 50% maintaince 50% country recipe 26% protein in the Shooting season the Maintance is £11.50 for 15kg and the country Recipe £14.00 for 15kg Vat free makes it very competivly priced and the dogs work twice a week on it in the winter and look rely well all year round

Well i think personally that its down to you as there are so many foods out there and so many different opinions some say burns is great otheres say stay away ect burns for me gave my dog upset tum and the poos along with all tinned food and jwb so just what your dog likes and settles on really i went through so many brands that people suggested and most of them he either wouldnt eat of upset his tum so as i said everyone gives a good side and others a down and then you are stuck for choice as to who is right

    i tell you something ive never thought about dog food as much since i started coming on here, its great that we all love our dogs so much but i bet most dogs on here are fed better than the owners kids!

Me too i started mine on a food then came on here and so many different views on food i didnt know what to do i think you should just go with whatever the dog is happy on

My Bichon was fed on Bakers and Cesar he lived until he was 17 with very few health problems :)