I wonder how many people looking for a dog really know what they are doing for example yesterday we had a young black lab brought in all work breeding ( feild trial etc) really smart dog but the family were a young couple with an 18 month old child he was working 12 hours a day she was two stone wet through the dog was going barmy needed  excersise so consequently he was given up to our rescue,what a fantastic dog in the right hands he would be great kind natured  just energetic why? when buying a dog dont peopel research into the breed or the breeding after all if you were buying a car would you just buy the first one no ! you would see wether it was suitable for your needs/family why dont they do that when buying a dog?
why do people assume a labrador will fit the bill they are an energetic highly inteligent breed dont wnat to sit in a kitchen all day and all night

When talking to people about choosing dogs I always tell people top look at what the dog was bred for. A working dog was bred to spend all day in the field. My Anna for example NEVER sleeps during the day (and appears to sleep precious little at night for that matter. Wonderful if you are working her but hard work if you want a quiet life!

This sounds very much a case of round peg/square hole Mattie!

Best wishes, John

Hello

Some people think that buying a cute puppy without taking into account the kind of stock that it has come from, is going to be okay, friends of mine have just brought a Springer puppy from working stock, to have as a family dog....now i can see how bright and intelligent this puppy is, and i know for a fact that theres going to be problems, especially as this dog grows older...but they seem to think that im a know all know nothing...
I wonder who it will be they come running to, when the problems start?  And i know that there will be some problems with this Springer, as it will have nothing to do, apart from being with a family who just want a nice companion...
Some people cant see past this, when buying a puppy, and its a sad, sad, shame.
Dean

so many dogs in springer rescue why oh why dont people realise they need stimulation we had a springer cross lab in rescue he was high as a kite what a brilliant  super imtelligent dog luckily had an active home for him but could have been disassater

I think nowadays the majority of people think that dog=pet. They seem to think (if they think at all, which a for a lot of them I doubt) that generations of careful breeding to develop a characteristic to make a breed good for its task can be forgotten with ease. WRONG!.

we had a really hyper lab in last month he had been with a family in a flat  locked up all the time  he came here and we contacted  the drug search team he is now well on the way to being a search dog for the prison service yet his family were so frustated they nearly had him PTS he i so happy now in his rightful life

I was just saying at our dog club last week that some people shouldn't be allowed to have dogs. We have a drakeshead black lab, and he is fit, very very fit, our vet says he has an 8 pack - but this dog is always on the go. Out of his litter of 10, 8 work, as does mum and dad. Our boy and his brother don't work as such but are exercised to a high level in plantations and fells etc so that they can really stretch out. This takes committment. Our boy works when he is out - in his terms - and our neighbours laught when they see him coming home sometimes lugging sizeable bits of tree (not little branches) with him.

Our breeder, who only did the one litter because he wanted some working dogs for himself, actually took one of his pups back because circumstances had changed with the owner, and the dog was spending all day locked in the kitchen. The dog was going nuts and barking all the time so he left the owner a note - coming for dog at 7.00pm - be in!!!! When his bitch had her litter he built this huge place for them at the end of the garden complete with garden shed like sleeping area etc, in fact it was so big his neighbours were joking that he could rent it out for T.T. (John would appreciate that).

Extendable leads are another bug bear of mine!!

Had a puppy enquiry from a family today, who live in a flat in Edinburgh - they couldnt decide between an American cocker, a working cocker or a border collie!  I said of the 3 th only vague possibilty would be an Yankee, but suggested a cat might be a better option.
bye
Gwen

Good suggestion gwen: my mother used to breed cockers and they need to work otherwise they go seriously nuts.

Have lost count of the number of people I have come across who have bought a BC from a farm and put it in a top floor flat and gone to work for 8 hours. In the end if the BC suvives the poor thing is mentaly damaged staring into corners or looking at the moon and barking non stop.

I've met a lot of new husky owners who are surprised that their dog pulls on the lead all the time.....well DUH!

When seeing a litter of puppies the ARGH.. factor comes in to play and common sense goes out the window.... When ive had puppies i find most dont ask the right questions eg. health checks.thinking a hip score is a dog dance... And lets face it pedigree dogs dont come cheep!!!! People need to be educated more when wanting a puppy, so that they can choose one thats right for them!!!!

Hi,

People also naturally assume Golden Reriever are perfect family dog yes they are provided you give them plenty mental stimulaion and exercise after 12- 18 months they need alot.
My oldest male thrives with the family but he is on the go all day and need alot of exercise mental stimulation otherwise with another family who perhaps expect him have 1 0o 2 walk day and then lie down or just wander around to be happy,he would probably start shredding through boredom etc

Like Labs Goldens are Gundogs and general public probably do just fall in love with the cute puppy perhaps forgetting that these breed like many others were bred to work and perhaps still have thet inner desire even if raised purely as pet.

Thing someone else said about border collies , excellent working dogs and i'm sure some make good pets but there is an awful lot in pet homes that have problem
because they want to be out on the go all the time with the mental stimulation they crave for and just not getting from normal family enviroment.

Just my thoughts Briony :-)

People just don't research enough into the breed that they want.  In labs especially when they just think of that cute andrex puppy in the ads!  I chose a lab after looking into the needs of the dog as well as my needs.  You have to strike a balance with them.  I chose a show type Poolstead lab after carefully talking things through with the breeder.  My mum and dad are retired and therefore are able to exercise him in the day when I am at work.  I must admit I considered a working lab but thought that it would be too much for my parents as they are highly energetic and I have now realised this because there are 2 in my class at training who are in a word "loops".  Henry is very well behaved (apart from running up the garden with the tea towel now and again and he has a fetish for the sky remote control!) but then he is a retriever and gundogs like things in their mouths!  He is the best thing that ever happened to me and I have no regrets whatsoever.  We do obedience and are now starting to win rosettes etc, he is very easy to train.  We have a go at working trials but I have to watch what he does as he is just too well built to be scaling 6ft!  Although he will have a go at 3ft!

It's funny watching the 2 different types of labs doing things.  There is such a difference.

I remember buying countless breed books and talking to people with dogs before deciding and that is what all responsible potential dog owners should do.

A theory put to the test, Bailey is a Carpenny dog, bred for show through and through. My thoughts now are that he will never make a good show dog, why? because I am working him. He is now 6 months, he eats twice the amount his sister has, not litter mates, 2 days age difference. Tia is a very laid back poser, and is larger all round that Bailey, although bone structure is similar. Bailey, is a lean, well muscled, highly active dog. I also find the more brain work he gets the more he wants, he never stops. My other labs are non working and do laze around unless proded or leads rattle, Bailey is constantly looking for stimulation. We went to URC show in Malvern yesterday and met Baileys litter mates, they were placed all the way through, Bailey didnt get a look in.  With all the litter placed side by side, the facial features were like peas in a pod, Bailey stood out as being lighter and leaner. The other pups looked heavier and their coats were different to Baileys. Bailey was much heavier because of the lean muscle he has built up, his coat get wet more often so although its thick, it is much softer.  This unfortunately is not what the judge is looking so Bailey Bombed. But it just goes to show the difference between show strain and working strain as John has said, seperates the breed entirely. Bailey was bought as a show dog for showing, and I know that if I had not begun training with him he would have been up there in the placings with his litter mates. But Bailey wants to work so that is what we shall do. He loves it and thats what counts. But the energy I put into Bailey is probably 5 times more than the others. He is very similar in many ways to Megan, my springer who passed away recently. Not hyper just highly motivated and constatly needing stimulation.
My theory? If you choose a show type lab and encourage it to develop the skills it was originally bred for, you will get a true labrador. It is our conception of how they should look in the show ring that has made our breeding of them so radically different. My Springers were bought for working and my labs were bought for show. Bailey is the first lab I have ever worked. I love my little fattie show dogs and I love my lean mean retrieving machine, but the difference is quite amazing.

Kay

you can show him in the field trail classes at breed clubs and champ shows and also at crufts in the same Im sure John or Jo Flatcoat can put you in the picture n this

Thanks for info Mattie, John has been brilliant with all my queries re; training, will call on jo when I feel ready to show him again. I know I could fatten him up for showing and trim him down again for working but this is not the right thing to do. Bulimia springs to mind.  I get the best of both worlds though, I enjoy showing my dogs, but I used to love working Megan until she became too ill a few years back, she was such a pleasure and wanted to please. Bailey is of the same ilk, he is so easy to work with, he has an amazing brain, and although he did enjoy being in the ring, in the field is where he belongs. I will show him again, when he has matured a little, he has only just turned 6 months, still a baby yet.

Kay