Well, Molly is 8 months old and no sign of her season yet.  And I am completely dreading it.  Not because of the mess and not being able to have decent walks (although that will be horrible) but because we decided we would have her spayed after her first season.  I am completely terrified (you'd think it was me going under the knife), I can't bear the thought of her having a major operation and am worried about losing her.  I know I'm being irrational, but I can't help it, she is my baby.  I suppose the downside of a site like Champdogs, once you've been using it for a few months, is that you know that dogs can die from routine operations / contract tetanatus afterwards, etc.  When her season does come, I am going to be a wreck.  I suppose I would just like some reassurance, really, that I am doing the right thing (though don't hold back if you think I'm not).  Thanks.
Rosie

Don't worry about it..our cats were done and were fine..they were both jumping about like lunatics after a few days....
nutters..
Dont worry.. :)

They can also die from pyrometra if they are not spayed, get accidently  mated & die whelping or from an infection from the dog   the lists are endless. I have any bitches spayed as I keep dogs & show them & do not want any accidents as my one remaining bitch is a GSD & my boys BC & CKCS

In the end it is your decision

Why are you waiting for her to have a season?Why not get her spayed now,and get it over and done with?The more time you have to think about it the more you will worry,i got my girl spayed at 6mths. I think it's a myth to wait until after the first season to be spayed,it makes no sense!Some breeders get their litters done at 8 weeks before they are sold to new homes so new owner cant breed them.The thought of going thru a season makes me shudder,i got my other female when she was 2(not spayed) i went thru 1 season with her and promptly booked her in,what a nightmare that was,all the boys hanging around my front door,Emma crying to get out to them,she even ran away once when we were on our walk,which is so very uncharacteristic of her,she usually sticks to me like glue.
As for the operation,please dont worry too much it is a very simple and routine op,nothing much can go wrong.
Please let us know how she recovers,just make sure your vet sends you home with pain killers for her,i got my other girl Bonnie spayed on a friday and they sent me home with no pain meds so i had to wait till Monday before i could get them,i was soo angry,at that time i didnt know what to expect re;pain etc. she was my first.

christine

I have had 2 bitches spayed, one at 10 and a half due to pyometra and my current girl.

Back in the 80's, my breed, Belgian Tervueren, were very susceptible to anaesthetic and so there was absolutely no question of her being spayed!! When she contracted pyo, i was terrified but anaesthetics had advanced by then and didn't have so much effect on the liver, but were passed out more quickly. She came through very well for an older dog.

My current girl, well, i dreaded thethought of an op. in case it went wrong, much like you. With my first Terv i had had to go for it; this was a choice. In the end it came down to the fact that the breed needs such a huge amount of exercise, and mental stimulation, that it was impossible to keep her happy at home and in the garden. ( I had managed before but i had also had my male BSD who was had been neutered because he was a unilateral cryptorchid. I think he kept some other dogs away and we walked very early. He also kept her busy.)We were both climbing the walls. I took her out to a part of the New Forest i rarely saw people, and dammit if i didn't meet an Irish setter all on his own - well, he had brought his brother along!! So i was desperately trying to call his owner, who was it turned out half a mile away; keep my own dog under control (she was very good) and fend off these two excited male dogs with one thing on their mind. It was dreadful. I found myself wonderig what Irish Setter x Belgians would look like!!

Anyway that did it for me, with my particular breed and in my circumstances i felt i had to have her spayed. It was horrible taking her in, and in fact i rang up about 10 minutes after i got home - to STOP  the op - and they had already done her and she was recovering nicely!!!

I was so relieved.... i hate messing with animals and it has to be down to your choice in the end, but unless you have a good set up at home like many breeders do, or a private area to exercise, it may be very difficult. If your dog can cope without a good walk for a few weeks, you may be able to manage :)

Lindsay

Well I dont think its a myth, and nor do many vets. They need to mature before speying.

Hi Rosie,
I know exactly how you feel! I am the same every time one of my dogs ever needs any sort of surgery at all, despite how 'routine' the procedure is, because as you say you can never eliminate all risk. :( Having lost two animals (one dog, one guinea pig) to the after-effects of surgery (not the operation itself) you can't take anything for granted. :(

You are quite right to wait until she has had a season, especially if she is larger than a toy breed. Midway between seasons (about 3-4 months after the start of the season) is best because then the circulating hormones are at their lowest level and the blood supply to the uterus is least, making surgery easier and safer for both bitch and vet!

If you really don't want to have her spayed, then there is no need, providing you are responsible and keep her carefully controlled while she is in season. I only had my last two bitches spayed (at the ages of 8 and 6) because I was forced to keep to males from a litter, and I didn't want chaos in the house with the mixed sexes. I had never had the slightest trouble when we only had bitches - yes it was messy, but we had no 'callers', no escaping looking for a mate, nothing like that. They still had exercise, though it was carefully controlled and at different times and different places to usual, and I took them in the car to start the walks to avoid leaving a 'treasure trail' leading to my door!

Let her have her season and see how you manage before you make the final decision. It honestly isn't the nightmare that many people would have you believe! Good luck!
:)

Fillis can you explain why you feel it is so important to wait until after their first season?Maybe things are different over there but here in Australia it is very widely known that it is a myth,the vets here reccomend getting it done at 6mths. for m/f.
I did alot of reading and speaking with vets regarding this spaying issue and i got the same responces everytime,"waiting till after first season IS a myth" apparantly it is just the old school thinking?Waiting is just putting off the inevitable
I have never ever heard of a female having any repercussions by getting spayed at 6mths., have you?Surely by the age of 6mths. everything  inside has matured enough to have the op done,personally i wouldnt take the risk of all the associated diseases that come with an entire female,(sorry cant use the word BITCH,it sounds too harsh for me :o)

look forward to your responce ;)

christine

Hi Christine,
Vets over here have found that surgery is much easier when the bitch is in a state of anoestrus, which lasts for an average of 15 weeks, when there is no activity in the bitch's reproductive tract. The circulating hormones are minimal, and the blood supply to the uterus is normal (not increased as it becomes under the influence of hormones in preparation for a possible pregnancy), lessening the chance of haemorrage during and following surgery.

Large breed bitches do not develop as fast as smaller breeds, and are certainly not fully developed internally or externally by 6 months, making long-term side-effects more likely, such as urine scald because the vulva is still small and 'tucked up' in the thighs, inhibiting the flow of urine when she pees, causing permanent 'nappy rash'. :( Also the female hormones affect the full development of the bladder sphincter - if this development is inhibited, urine incontinence is more likely.

Hope this explains things a bit.
:)

Hi Rosie,

I felt exactly the same way when I had Abby spayed this past September.  Even though I had a number of bitches spayed before, "thanks" to Champdogs, my worry level increased tenfold.  :-)   Abby is absolutely fine and I am grateful that I do not have to worry about seasons.  The reason I had her spayed is because I could not trust my husband to keep her confined when she was flirty and fertile.  

In my opinion, the only reason a bitch should be spayed is to prevent any chance of unplanned/unwanted litters. There are health risks associated with spaying and health risks associated with not spaying - in the end you make the decision based on what you think best for you and Molly. 

Stop worrying and give Molly a hug instead,

Stacey

I would have got her done now rarther than waited. Its no better to wait till after season as it make no difference to the dog.

I had my Rough collie done at 6 month and she was fine, whats more i didnt have to put up with the worry of her getting accidently mated or the mess they make!!!

Hi,

I got my Gsd speyed last year when she was 5 years old, I had been meaning to do it earlier cos of the health risks but kept putting it off. Eventually i had to get her done as I got a male and i didnt want all the hassle and it wouldnt have been fair to either of them. I do believe in letting them have a season first, I used to breed and show Gsds and I made the mistake of getting one of my bitches done before her first season, at 6 months and i felt that she never really matured mentally or physically. I vowed i would never do it again. About 10 days before ella had her operation I got in contact with an animal homeopathist and she put some pills in the post for me to give to ella coming up to the operation, these prepared her body for the trauma and bruising associated with surgery, and then she was on a course of them for 1 week afterwards, Along with giving lots of Bach flower remedy in her water she recovered amazingly quickly and the bruising came out within 12 hours normally it takes 1 to 2 days. She was up and around within 5 hours of surgery and never really looked back. I have had many bitches speyed and ella recovered the quickest and the only thing that i did differently was give her homeopathy and a diet rich in raw vegetables, fruit etc. and clear soups, much like ourselves when we are feeling poorly. It definitely worked for her, it might be something that you wish to consider, as we all hate seeing our babies in pain :-(
Good luck :-)

Hi Rosemarie
I know how you feel I have a 10 month old dalmation who was due to get spayed and half an hour ago got a phone call from the vets to say there was a shortage of vets therefore I would have to cancel, as you can imagine I'm not happy. My bf is taking the day off work on friday to look after her as I am on a course all day. Fancy phoning the day before her op, I'm foaming. I'm sitting here wondering whether to phone another vets and get her booked in. Its another week of worrying, I know I'm doing the right thing by getting her spayed but she can't tell me whether she's in pain.

sorry meant to say she was due her op at 9 tomorrow morning.

Hi I had my Boxer Saffy spayed yesterday 17th and worried about her all day long until she came home.  Shes fine just acting like a drama queen all deep sighs and sad looks until she hears the food cupboard opening and shes up like a shot and sittting at her dish!!!  I think she just like all the attention and cuddles. 

Jeangenie thank-you for explaining,you always answer posts so diplomatically and thouroughly ;) :D
I do see your point re; small and big dogs,the smaller ones mature quicker,correct? I wish more people would back up their posts with facts instead just disagreeing with someone and not explaining why,it is most infuriating ;)

But like i said i did alot of research on this before spaying my girls as i also heard you should wait until after their first heat,but i got the same answers from everyone,but i guess only time will tell if the early spaying has repurcussions or not?Isnt it true that any spayed female can become incontinent when she gets older regardless of the age she was when spayed??
best  wishes

christine

Hi Christine,
Yes, it is certainly true that any bitch, whether spayed or not, can develop incontince (so can dogs, come to that!) - there are many reasons. Medical reasons apart (infections etc) and concentrating purely on bitches, the timing of spaying does seem to have an influence on the likelihood of incontinence. A bitch who is spayed after breeding seems to be more likely to develop the problem, as well as bitches spayed very young.

The problem that many people have in associating these problems with the spaying is that it usually takes several years before the problem starts, so the owner thinks there is a different cause. It is only by looking at the full medical history of all animals presenting to the vet with these problems that links are made. And if people don't report it, then that is more data lost. :(

Hope this helps.
:)

My wee bitch Tia was spayed yesterday.
I was a bit like you and apprehensive about it all but when I went to collect her yesterday although she was a bit sedated she was fine. :) She slept a lot yesterday as you might expect, ate her dinner no problem at all & this morning although a bit slow because of her wound she is back to her normal self !

The biggest problem now is keeping her calm so that her wound gets a chance to heal. I have her brother as well & given the chance the two of them would be off out in the garden running about like mad things !! I'm having to keep Tia calm and make sure that she doesn't exert herself so I'm keeping them separate as much as possible at the moment.

So far so good & Tia is not as bad as I thought she would be, seems to be recovering well & doesn't seem much phased by it which is amazing considering what she went through only yesterday ! As I type this she has just brought me her ball which unfortunatley I will not be throwing for her for at least a couple of weeks !

Don't worry too much they do seem to cope with this better than you might imagine. :)

Something I've been wondering about - have any studies been done on the possible longterm effects of early spaying on the bone density of a bitch? I know that in cases of premature menopause in women (and girls) or early ovario-hysterectomy in woment they need to take HRT to prevent osteoporosis, it being the hormone oestrogen which does this naturally.

I'm assuming that, as spaying is becoming routine at very young ages (8 weeks sometimes) in some countries, that they have done studies to ascertain the safety of the procedure in this respect. Or are everybody's pets being the experimental 'guinea-pigs'?

Good point about the bone density, JG. Having recently been diagnosed as having low bone density, (due to my dislike of milk caused by warm full fat milk left in the sun at school :( ) i had just been thinking about this re. dogs and spaying!!! <g> Great minds think alike maybe? :D

Lindsay
X

Hi Christine, any bitch can become incontinent, especially elderly ones but it seems fairly certain that there is a higher incidence of incontinence in spayed bitches and the incontinence associated with spaying affects young bitches too. I find the whole spaying / neutering argument infuriating because research is quoted (on both sides!) as gospel, but when you actually look at the papers many of the samples were very small and some of the studies were badly designed. Thus you see figures quoted for anything up to 50% of spayed bitches having some degree of incontinence but that simply is not the experience of people with spayed bitches. You also see reports saying that 1:4 unspayed bitches will develop mammary tumours. Mammary tumours (not all are malignant) are relatively common in older bitches, but I think many of us who have kept a good number of entire bitches into old age would say that 25% mammary cancer has not been our experience or that of our friends. (Some breeds seem to be more often affected by mammary cancer so people with those breeds may feel differently).

I've given the subject a lot of thought but still prefer to keep my bitches intact unless there is a medical reason to spay. I wouldn't argue with people who do choose to spay though I don't think the evidence is as clear cut as is often claimed. No surgery is without risks and potential side effects. And I certainly wouldn't spay a bitch before her first season and full maturity. For me the evidence of benefit and safety is just not convincing enough yet. The trouble with medicine (human & veterinary) is that certain treatments and procedures go though phases where they are THE thing to do. Lots of papers are written to support them. For instance how many people born in the 50's still have their tonsils? Then some brave person sticks their head above the parapet and says that procedure / treatment X maybe isn't such a good idea after all - and before you know it the consensus turns round to say it was actually a rotten idea.

Thanks for all your replies.  The rational part of me is saying that the wise thing to do would be to get her spayed after the first season.  I forgot to say that Molly is a working cocker.  The thought of having a regular three weeks without proper walks doesn't bear thinking about: she would go insane, and so would I.  Plus I don't want to risk any accidents.  But the irrational part of me doesn't want to take my baby in for a major op.  My parents' dog died a few weeks after I got Molly and since then I guess I have been being a bit overprotective and worried about losing her.  I don't know about Molly, but they will probably have to sedate me when she goes in for the op.. :-)

I dont know whether it is true, but it seems very likely, that a dog who is well exercised and sensible weight and toned will keep better toned muscles generally, and that this includes the bladder etc. Seems sensible.

Lindsay