Hi, can anyone help me in answering this question (if there is a definite answer) out of interest. I have read numerous articles and books containing info on bandogs and have seen many different opinions on whether to cross a Neo bitch with a pitt dog or vice versa. Are there any major differences in the outcome of such breeding ?

Cheers in advance

Regards

GT

As pits and their crosses are banned in the UK, the outcome would be the same - you would have an illegal dog which was likely to be seized at anytime.

Thats why I said out of interest ! I am curious, not intending to do any breeding.

Any crosses are a gamble. It doesn't matter which of the two breeds is the sire and which the dam - no two puppies in the resulting litter will be alike.

Edited to add: Of course, anyone who mates a large-breed dog with a smaller-breed bitch deserves to be shot.

Thanks for the reply

There were "Bandog" puppies for sale recently in a nation countrysports newspaper. They were Presa Canario X Cane Corso.
Dawn.

The stupid idiots these could be dangerous dogs when grown this makes me so mad i dont what any breed that i own to get in to any trouble, as the corso is a great breed if bred well and sold to people that will rear them as you advise.

why are pitbulls illegal in the uk??

Because the government passed a law banning them.

i agree i seen this add in ex+mart the man was a dog protection trainer advertising a better guard dog he also advertised with a photo of my c.c. grandparent,both these breeds are pretty new to uk and from what i know of mine and read of the other neither needs to be crossed with anything for improvement if theres a problem its more to do with the lines they came from and therefor a good breeder in my eyes would have tried harder to breed to right type to correct and not another breed. lets just hope the pups go to right homes and raised properly and not let down the side.

Isn't it amazing the things people will do for a quick buck!!not talking about the poster just others that have bred.I read a judges critique of the presa canarios and he said he felt lucky to get out of the ring,(this was abroad).Pit bulls were beautiful animals and most very well natured and good with kids but it's the old story of a few wasting it for the masses.

ons shouldnt forget there protective of owners,its not in there genes to let a stanger walk staight up to them and touch them this is where socialisation comes into play and is very important,even so there will be some who are over protective still but then its important you know how to aproach such dogs and if done correctly there shouldnt be a problem but at a show there isnt the time so they can look bad in them few short moments,in uk there are a few working breeds which some judges will not lay hands on especially the opening of mouth,relax im sure they werent that bad. hope not lol

HI I am knew to the board, just posting with regards to the comment you have made, I don't wish to offend you, but that is a terrible comment for any judge to make, regarding any breed, it is comments like that which precede a breed, comments like that which eventually got a breed banned in England,

I read a judges critique of the presa canarios and he said he felt lucky to get out of the ring,(this was abroad)

I can tell you for a fact, that judge has not been any where near the show presa canario, I have, I have been to the Dogo (presa) Canario show's in Santa Cruz in Tenerife, main land Spain in Barcelona, Grand Canaria etc,video footage of over 10 different shows around the world, I have 10 presa canarios of my own, from top champion line's, any one ,men, women or children, can walk in and out with any of them, how is that for 10 out of 10, and before you go poo fooing the claim, I can 100% put my money where my mouth is, I personally own the dogs, any of you are welcome to come along and visit to see them, all are 100% well behaved, and very laid back, that mentioned judge has been no where near the show dogs fact!! I have as mentioned spent a few years around this breed, whilst at the show's you can see a good few hundred dogs, all with in a few feet of each other, I have never seen a display of aggression while at the show's once, not towards passers by or any handler, these events are family run, there are small children running around every where, you have total strangers walking up and talking to any presa owner, and stroking their dogs, you mention the irresponsible breeder above, it is more down to irresponsible comments which sell more breeds, people out there hang onto every word some people speak, and when they think that a judge was afraid for his own safety, well we all know how this rubbish gets added to, total rott, we all know the phrase, it is not the dog but the owner, how true this statement is, you can take virtually any breed and add aggression, take my word for it, as an experienced dog man, whom has spent his life around these types of dogs, RESCUING THEM, the presa canario, is no more dangerous than the rotty, bullmastiff,German Shepard, or any of the other heavy working breeds, one thing I will say in the favour of the show presa, is out of all those breeds, they are the least demanding and the most layed back, on a par with the Bullmastiff, another breed I have owned for the last 20 years, some time's we should all think before posting, ............sorry if I have offended any of you, but this is another breed, with a real soft family heart, which is being branded, due to those dogs having been cross bred back to other breeds to produce an aggressive dog, the real show presa canario, which has recently been renamed as the Dogo Canario, is a safe and very trustworthy breed of dog...........kind regards mastini

hi mastini thanks for your comments in the uk we have to many people easily frightened by a dogs looks ect and there comments sometimes sound terrible for the breeds involved,working breeds can all be as dangerous as the next, breeding and handling is very important for all dogs not just working class im glad you got it in order with yours welldone and please post again sometime. good luck and health allround.

hi again all i thought i would write what i read from a new book i recentelly purchased please give your opinons. title+author dogs their selection keeping+breeding(published before 1913) by franc townend barton. dogs,like human beings are of variable tempermant,but there is one difference which stands so prominently out between the two,and that is the purely objective nature in the development of a dogs disposition,wheras the dispositon of man is mainly of a subjective acquirement.in other words,dogs acquire their vices and virtues by object lessons,whereas the human subject acquires his training through association with fellow subjects.if mans mental and moral training is characterised by the highest degree of intellectual thought,it is only reasonable to assume that the pupil of such a masters mind will imbibe and follow out the greatness of his preceptor,which is usally the case,or,at any rate,the exceptions are not sufficientaly numerous to disturb these reconised principles of training,in which tempermant becomes more or less submerged. that heredity plays a very important part in the development of tempermant seems to us to be an incontrovertible fact,and it matters little whether the inheritance be paternal or maternal.every sportsman knows perfectly well the necessity for the selection of a gundog from parents whose qualifications have been of an undeniable character.he is well enough aware that,in the training of a puppy,his sucess is,in a great measure,secured if he has taken the precaution to purchase it from the owner of dogs particularly clever at their work.it is quite useless to attempt to make anything of a young dog,so far as real working abilities are concerned,bred from either a sire or dam with a dour or sulky tempermant.the predisposition to development ot the same tempermant will,in 80 per cent of instances,be inherent,and no power on earth can abolish it. a dogs tempermant may be classified as good,bad or indifferent,precisely in the same manner in which these terms are applicable to men and women.a dog with a good tempermant is one which responds immediately to its masters or mistresses commands,and when rebuked,accepts the rebuke without sulking.freedom from the vicious pratices of snapping at other dogs,barking after horses and carriages,chasing other dogs,fighting ect,is indicative of a good tempermant.in addition,a sour-tempered dog may be fractious to a degree,and disregard all commands.an indifferent tempermant may be the outcome of bad training,in other words a dog may have possessed of a good temper,but reduced to indifference through unskillful handling.it is difficult to define exactly an indifferent tempermant.to say that it is good,yet bad seems illogical.netherless,the indifferent tempermant is a medley of the good and the bad.once a dogs tempermant has become thoroughly established,no matter for better or for worse,no further training can materially change it,although,perhaps,the sense of fear under an oppressive hand may,for a time,keep any bad qualities in their latent condition.but directly such power is removed the original tempermant will soon reassert itself. sorry about that if its a touch to long got carried away lol. good luck and health.

think possibly you got the wrong end of the stick after reading my posting,I actually admire that type of breed as I did the pit bulls but i was writing what a judge 's personal experience or opinion was,the same thing could be said about some akitas in the ring and i have witnessed it on ringside,so no offence was intended towards your breed but I still think that there are people out there selling these dogs and crosses of them to the wrong people and they don't give a monkeys about what happens to the dog or who it will come into contact with and can i just reiterate that there are probably nasty,bad bitey or nippy dogs in all breeds,right down to a wee jack russell,sandra.

But BANDOGS are legal in the UK with conditions arent they ?

What is a Mastaff (BullMastiff Bitch x Male Staffordshire Bull Terrier)

A pitbull or a Bandog ?

Does anyone here know ?

Talisman

I'm sure Andy or one of our other bandog 'experts' willl be along to help out any minute but as far as I know...

The american Bull Terrier and the American Pit Bull Terrier are actually 2 different dogs with subtle differences (I think)

It's specifically the Pit Bull that has been banned in the uk - and any pit bull cross.

I think there is a clause that give the powers that be the autority to seize any dog they consider to be of this 'type' and there's a chance the Mastaff would come under this category, as would a lot of staff crosses as they have that 'look' about them. Personally I love both those breeds and could imagine an attractive and powerful dog as a result of crossing them BUT I don't see the need to as they stand as fine animals alone. There could also be many 'unsuccessful' results of such a meeting and who knows what problems (health wise) the pups could have :(

If all dogs were properly bred, trained, socialised and handled then I don't think the DDA would ever have happened.

i dont think there is any such breed called american bullterreir

They are refered to being "The British Pitbull" by some people, but they are bandogs.

how do yo know all this info on them ? Why are they refered to as the British pitbull ? Do you know ?
Has someone managed to find a legal loop-hole here ?

sincerely

Talis

ps. Kerioak, thankyou for your input, we all look forward to your next syllabul and description of your family bloodline.

You asked a question:
What is a Mastaff (BullMastiff Bitch x Male Staffordshire Bull Terrier) ?

I answered it according to the second description from the OED
Mongrel:n. 2. any other animal or plant resulting from the crossing of different breeds or types

I happen to like certain strains of bandog, but they are not for everybody, do some reading up on them, heres some links-
http://www.allamericankennels.com/moreinfo.html

http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/americanbandoggemastiff.htm

http://www.moloss.com/001/breed/b/b001/

http://www.uwsp.edu/psych/dog/LA/distano5.htm

If you dont know enough about bandogs you should not even consider owning one.
Dean.

Mongrel !

G, I have been doing a lot of research and asking a lot of questions recently and it seems the most favourite BANDOG is the Mastaff which I soon hope to buying one of early next year. I am in England where pitbulls are illegal. Although the pitbull is incapable of taking on the size of a Bandog, The bandog would much rather play than fight. On top of this, they dont drool and have the same health problems Neo crosses have. It is common opinion that a Mastaff would treat a pitbull like nothing more than an annoying child in need of a spank. Its the fact they are devoted family dogs that makes me want one, plus the fact it looks highly possible they are soon to be a recognised breed.

cheers.
talisman

Talisman, if your interest is in the dog as a family dog, why all the macho talk, sorry I don't believe you. There are many breeds that are good family dogs and what they would do with a pitbull does not enter most peoples minds. Do you really want a dog and something to boost your ego.

Edited as Jackie changed her post :)

Sorry miss read. Will delete edit. What is a Mastaff? Take it a Staffie Mastiff cross, no cant be they would not be recognised surely. Will go and have a search.

I really can't imagine a Mastaff being recognised by the kc when they won't recognise the JRT! Let me know if you find out anything ;)

Hello

I cant see them being recognised as sometimes they are refered to as being "The British Pitbull", so it aint never going to happen, well i dont think it will anyway, and im sure others here agree.
There are breeders i know of that have been fighting for years to get their dogs some recognition, its a hard, long drawn out process.
And there are so many concerns going on with the AmBull, this is just another *breed* that mps and the police can lobby about getting added to the dda.
Dean

talisman im really sorry but i think you have been seriously been misinformed about bandogs.
firstly a bandog is not just a mastiff crossed with a bull type dog.but its more than that.they have a purpose.like to guard protect etc
the guy selling mastaffs and calling them an english pitbull is ridiculous.anyone who knows there bull breeds can tell you no bullmastiff/mastiff cross with a staff is a pitbull.it may resemble a pitbull.but a pitbull isnt a pitbull by the way it looks its a pitbull in what it can do.most true pitbulls look like crappy crosses and some look like great awesome dogs depending on the line and look like american staffs(show version of the pitbull)
saying a bandog doesnt drool or have other problems that mastiffs have is wrong.who ever told you that is also wrong in my opinion.they generally have less health problems and drool generally less or none.but they can still have just as much problems and drool as much depending what type of bandog.what the sire and dam is etc.unless the bandog is in its 5-6 or more generation of even standard type you cant know what the dog will end up like if only n its 1st or 2nd generation cross.
also a bandog would never be able to as you say kill a pitbull is wrong.you cant predict that one type of dog can kill another.i am against dog fighting but generall if not all the time a pitbull would kill a bandog-thats what theyhave been bred for over 300 years to do.only if the bandog has a massive size difference would a bandog kill a pitbull.
these 1st generation crosses of bandogs are a gamble in getting.you dont know what you are getting.
i think you need to do a bit more research before you even think about getting one mate.no offence.

ps it would never be recognised by the uk kc.who ever told you that is joking with you trust me.was it the same guy who told you a bullmastiff crossed with a sataffy is a pitbull,if so dont believe him mate

A Bandog is a Pit Bull stud bred to a Neopolitan Mastiff bitch. Some people will breed a Pit bull with any type of Mastiff, or an American Bulldog with a Mastiff. Most reputable breeders breed a Pit Bull with a Neo Mastiff.........

Most reputable breeders breed a Pit Bull with a Neo Mastiff

Is that an Oxymoron Jeangenie ?

:p

I was wondering if I dare point that out without getting leapt upon!!!
:D

I have to say that often these dogs are purchased to boost the ego of the owner (smaller the P****, the bigger the dog ;) ) I have one living next door and tho its always touted as a real softy and good with children it recently bit the owners friend on the hand - only a few broken bones and infection so he got off lightly :rolleyes: The dog is a victim of ego buying, ignored except when needed to boost owners ego and any transgressions, however minor, are treated very harshly. The fact that this dog hasn't done more damage is a testament to his innate good nature which has been severely tested. Its a pity that the 'reputable' breeders who so carefully ;) plan and breed these dogs don't put in as much effort when weeding out the saddos who only want something big on a lead to show off, or wouldn't that be so lucrative?

Have to say they that it is commonly said the IBT are largely a replacement for the Am Pitbull and are call so by the sort of person who use this breed or other large bull type dog as a ego boost. The sad ones who need that sort of support to their personality probable do no harm, but those who have them for what is erroneously called personnel protection dogs make me very cross, how dare people use a dog a weapon and a threat. As to those who wish to use them for fighting - well I had better not get into that.

I think you're being naive if you think that the owners who have these dogs for an ego boost are probably doing no harm. They are precisely the ones doing the harm. Often they want the dog to look aggressive and encourage shows of aggression from the dog, then when it becomes unmanageable the dog suffers, either with a beating or worse. Once the novelty wears off, or the dog becomes too much to handle, the best it can hope for is loneliness and boredom.

The one next door to me is brought out for showing off perhaps once a month, the rest of the time it is left alone in a yard and sad to say, probably better off for it.

Think that would be classed as a personal protection dog, in other word the owner can't talk for himself or is involved in some unsavoury pastime and needs the dog to front up for them, being unable to do so for themselves. They are totaly unable to look after themselves let alone a dog and I agree that is far from harmless.

You are wrong in this case Jackie H.  The dog is a P**** extension, as is his car (Very flash, Boombox, special lights, specially 'tuned' to sound like a racing car and complete with 'dump' stick :rolleyes: ) the dog is an accessory to complete the 'look'.  Since he never takes it out of the yard (15' x 4') how does it protect him?  This guy is compensating in a very big way and the dog has suffered for it.  As for unsavoury pastimes ~ he spends most of his spare time playing with his car, or driving it around.

...and when he's not doing that he's probably playing with his p****!

Know the type well - there's a couple of them around here :rolleyes:

jackie you dont have a clue.yes i agree that this type of dog will attract the wrong crowd,but most tough dogs do.if it aint one it will be the other.but dont tar the sincere ones.
ps im more than capable of handling myself without my dog and it aint a pr*ck extension for me.i dont need the dog for that.
anyway i think a small person would not be able to handle these type of high strung dogs.

ps jackie you dont know what persona;l protection is or anything about it.so dont judge or criticise on thing you dont know or even have a clue about.a welll trained pp dog is no threat to any1.

a bandog isnt a pitbull sire bred to neo mastiff bitch.thats is just 1 method iof bandog -made famous by a vet called swinford who is seriously over rated.
a bandog is any mastiff type dog(oem,rottie,neo,canecorso) crossed with any bull type dog(ambull,pitbull,staff,eng bullterrier etc)