I've just had a litter of 6 SWD's, 3 of which are natural bobtails. I can't wait to see how they will tell me whether they are true bobtails or not. I am thinking of going to the World Dog show next year with a cream bitch of mine and she was also born bobtailed.

That is an interesting thought. I wonder what would happen with one of Bruce Cattanagh's bobtailed boxers were it to be exhibited in a country where docked dogs can't be shown?

It is a shame, but I think you are right, I have seen very few quality pups with tails in the customarily docked breeds, when I have asked the owners, they have usually been rescuews, or from a novice breeder who thought docking was ilegal, or didn't want to pay the price to dock. Makes one wonder what other money saving measures went into rearing the litter :(

I do have a friend who used to breed Welsh springers, and showed in a small way, that liked them to keep their tails!

I keep tails on my schipperkes and have enjoyed a little success at open level with a few BPIB, BPAVNSC and Group 1 - 3 placings with my most memorable being a 1st and 2nd for my brother/sister puppies from last yrs matings under Ann Arch earlier this yr. She gave my undocked puppy dog BPIB until it was pointed out to her that my docked dog who went BOB was also still only a puppy so automatically claimed the prize.

I have never experienced any problems from fellow breeders many of whom are very pro docking but still congratulate me on the quality of my undocked dogs that are shown. I breed to the breed Standard and aim to produce the best puppies that I can in temperament and conformation - it just so happens that I chose to leave tails on, not to cut costs but because I would not want to dock my puppies. All my puppies leave here microchipped, with health certificates, Endorsements on their pedigrees, the usual fully wormed, insurance, food return to breeder and holiday boarding or training for good measure.


MY latest litter are 19 days old their father is sired by one of only 2 Am Ch showing here at present and their mother although not shown is the granddaughter of our late breed record holder, which I think shows an effort on my part to breed quality puppies (as much as you can with nature involved lol). The one thing I have learned with this litter is that this particular combination have produced puppies with short tails, each pup has the same length of tail to it's sibling something I had not seen in my other litters, so following my previous experience with tails of this breed a shorter tail should have a nicer curl rather than a corkscrew twist that seems to go with the longer tail lenght, something that I personally wish to avoid.

There are some of us out there who wish to compete on a fair footing with quality animals that have been well breed and raised in a family home environment with as much socialised as we can just like any docked puppies.

My comments referedto pet dogs I had met. A friend of mine always left tails on her Welsh Springers, and even managed to win some with them. It just seems that few people in the showring will chance not docking if they are keen to win, due to the fact that many judges, despite KC edict to the contrary, will be prejudiced against them. I do admire the folk who choose to not dock, and show their dogs! I have seen tailed spaniels, Wheatens, and Vallhunds and Schips in the ring, and sometimes they have won :)

An undocked Swedish Vallhund went BIS at their club show I believe a few weeks ago so they are getting noticed! My undocked Schipperke has qualified for Crufts as has his sister.

Thanks for the admiration Brainless I breed and show my schips fully tailed with 9 BPIB awards at open level with 1 bitch going on to get a group 4 placing.

I think it is getting easier for those of us who chose to keep tails to achieve placings at shows and many people outside the breed are starting to comment on how they like/dislike a tail on the schip with more positive comments as time goes by, including several judges who are very encouraging.

The thing that has me confused re Vallhunds and Schips is that I feel they look nicest with a neat tightly curled tail, but in the new KC description of desired tail it doesn't want a curly tail, or have I got it wrong. I am biased to the tight tail looking nicer as I have elkhounds :) I always feel i have the best of both worlds, a tail and neat appearance, weithout getting by leggs flailed, or walls covered in mud and blood from over waggy long tails. I used to have a BSD!

Hi Brainless,

LOL... My flatcoat's tail does all of the above. I have the bruised knees, walls covered in mud and occasionally blood on the cupboard doors if he gets really excited! The tip of his tail is thin on hair due to his over-enthusiastic wagging. Not to mention the dents in the fridge door!! :rolleyes: Still, it's a beautiful tail.

Monty's Mum

I know the Schip standard calls for a curled tail not so sure about vals though.

Our breed club chairman has advised me that due to some breeders keeping tails in the days before I stated in schips they had decided on a breed standard almost 6 yrs ago now.

They had opted to go for the 'Spitz type tail' as opposed to the prefered hanging tail being considered in some Eurooean countries at present. Seems these countries are going to leave the decision for 10 yrs to see how the breed develops as far as tail carriage is concerned. Everyone I've spoken to within the breed who have kept tails in the past say that they have only prodcued puppies with the 'spitz type tails'

Hi we have had a few vallhunds winning well with tails one even has 2CC's, I have been in the breed for some 25 years and have noticed a change in that time, but still a lot of breeders have tails docked, I am showing a tailed bitch of 19 months and she has won several classes.
the society is trying to get the kennel club to change the wording for our tail status to include any type of tail.

Welcome to the forum :-)

Leigh where do people find all these old posts this one is over a year? Do they search for a word, (tail) or what. Ja:)kie

Think they might Jackie :rolleyes:
Maybe it is like old magazines on the hairdressers table :D

Thats OK then, thought there may be a way of scrolling past the end of the page that I had not yet found. Ja:)kie

Welcome to the forum Jusjokin :-) Leigh

Welcome to the forum Markey :-) Leigh