thanks for the advise earlier. I have actually got 2 retrievers, a 3yr old male and a 10month old bitch. Ihope to breed them, has anyone got any fors and againsts. They have the same GGG grandparents and similar breeding lines but not same parents

when are you thinking of breeding them ?

Are you planning ahead here or were you planning to mate them on her next season ? Has she had a season yet and if so when ?

SaraW

No she hasnt had her first seson yet. And wont be breeding till her 2nd season or till she is two. But i would like Woody my other retriever to mate other bitches as he is a hansome guy and bombproof a big baby

phewwwwwwww - had a horrible feeling you were planning on breeding her on her first season :rolleyes: It shows how easy it is to read what you want into messages ;) That's why I thought I'd ask the question - didn't want you getting jumped on because we presumed that :)

Firstly has your dog been hip scored ? Also he would need eye testing before being used at stud. A yearly eye test is advised.

Do you show him at all ? He may be lovely but is he a good example of the breed?

SaraW :)

I like the name Woody - I had a GSD called that and I now own two GR's :)

Hes not had tests yet. But thats priority!!!! Wouldnt breed if didnt have them. Meg (my bitch pup) needs them as well. So i know i have alot to do befor i start. Regarding showing i would like to but its realy hard to find shows in Yorkshire. Ive been on alot of sites and looked at other Goldies that have won alot of shows and i know i might be biased but hes just as handsome.

Without wishing to rain on your parade, but when I first started in my breed they all looked the same, and I thought mine looked just as good as the others, whereas in fact I had a decent one, but not a top drawer one.

It takes a while to get an eye for the finer points. Your dog may not be the best potential mate for your bitch, on the other hand he may be?

If you are not going to work or show, then getting advice from the breeders and/or stud owners of your dog and bitch is vital. They will have much needed information on those common ancestors. They may have been excelent examples, or they may have had faults that your dog and bitch both have, and if you breed them together you have a higher chance of fixing those faults in the offspring.

There are lots of shows up and down the country every week.

The best source of information as to where and when they are held, as well as show results and judges critiques is one of the weekly canine papers which can be ordered from your newsagent. They are Our Dogs and Dog World, and both have a section showing the current weeks shows and their venues.

In the next 18 months I suggest you visit some of these, especially Gundog ones. Also if you contact the Kennel Club they will tell you where your nearest Ring training classes are. There you will learn how to show your dogs, and after you have got the idea, then you can enter some local Open shows, and go from there!

It is never too late to start showing the dogs. Quite a few folk start with an older dog, they are initially at a slight disadvantage experience wise, but you soon learn. You will also need to leqarn about coat presentation, as Goldens are trimmed for show, not a lot but it makes a difference.

Surely if Ive got both pedigrees of my dogs, and are in contact with my breeders. The qualities of my dogs should be passed on to the litter betwwn them or are you meaning other qualities or not as the case maybe

The qualities that are passed on to puppies are not just those of the parents. Very ofte as with Human children the pups can take after earlier generations. This is fine if these earlier dogs have the desired qualities. We all carry good and bad traits, some hidden. That is where the pedigree comes in. To a knowledgeable person this is not just a collection of names but a living breathing history of the dog.

Just for arguments sake lets say that one of the Grandparents had a none too good bite, and this is a common ancestor to the two dogs, even with both parents having good mouths, you may suddenly find you have several pups with bad mouths, even worse than the ancestor.

As we all hav e to gain experience, and as dogs are living breathing sentient beings, learning purely by trial and error is not enough, as your decisions can effect the pups, and impact on their new owners too. Thsi is why Novice breeders hould work closely with an ethical experienced breeder to gain knowledge.

Of course despite ones best efforts puppies with health problems and faulty conformation and temperament will still be produced, but these should be unfortunate rarities.

Have you any suggestions please, all I can say is that both dogs have similar breed lines mainly Liiling Lines which other breeders around Yorkshire have and are still using.

I would start with the breed standard, then book written by a UK breed expert, there is a recent one by the top judge and breeder Valerie Foss. If you join your breed club, and ask to buy old year books you will probably find photos of the dogs in the pedigrees in breeder adverts. This will give information on their show records winning progeny, health status, how long they lived (look at Obituary adverts, if you are going to breed within a line then you want to be sure that they have the traits you admire, as even within the standard there is room for different styles of dog, all still excellent specimins, some will appeal more than others.

I did this for about a year before I was able to start showing my bitch, and now have quite a collection of old books. I wrote to the owners of dogs close up in the pedigrees, and they all sent me photos and told me about the dogs.

After that i went with the advice of my breeder with my first litter, but happy that I wasn't just blindly following advice. I would generally advise in a first litter, when you haven't yet decided exactly what style of dog you are hoping to produce to not mate your bitch too close, a fairly open pedigree with several compatible lines will give you the choice of line direction for the future. Will you later prefer the dogs in Mums lines, or Dads, but that is personal choice.

Thankyou, But on my pedigree certs ive not many people to contact. Any suggestions.

Another thing you could do if they are still running it is to take the Animal Care College's Dog Breeding Certificate. This teaches a lot about breeding, record keeping, the points of the breeds etc etc.

Christine

This is where the breed club year books come in, you will learn from the adverts who owns/owned the dogs in questiuon, and there is usually a members list in the back of the books or on the adverts. ;D

Woodymeg

You mentioned in a post you are in contact with your dogs breeders - they will be the best people to advise you really.
Also if they didn't come from Mrs Wood (Lilling) direct but have alot of her dogs in the pedigrees she may be happy to advise you :)

Let me know if you need a contact as I will email you a site with her details on :)

SaraW

Yes both of my dogs parents are from Lillings and Yes it was Mrs Wood, I would appreciate any contact details you have. Thanks

sent you an email :)

Thanks thats great, do you know of anyone who has any retrievers from Mrs Wood or got the Lilling Line in them

This website may be useful: http://www.k9data.com/ (hope the link works!). It's a database of Golden Retriever pedigrees. It may help in your research.

Sarah