I few years ago there was a craze to get grey or mottled grey dogs now white seems to be the 'in' colour.  German Shepherds are mainly white now.  I have always steered clear of a pure white dog because of deafness.  I don't know where that came from though.  I would be interested on your views on me buying a white german shepherd.

My first dog was a " white " GSD, although in reality, he was cream, fantastic boy, temperament to die for, but I know now, I was very lucky to have one with such a steady nature, as at the time, they were notorious for being overly reactive.
He had no health problems, and lived to a very fit and active 14.
I have no idea what the situation is with them now, but I would tread very carefully,and as always, only buy from health tested dogs with fantastic temperaments.
If I was ever to get another GSD, I wouldn't restrict myself by coat colour.

In the seventies when I was a small child my mother was aware of stories of people people see destroying puppies that where white as they did n o t want people to be aware there was white in their lines I do not know how true the stories are I am a child of the seventies, but white German shepherds can have some serious health issues someone I know had a white German shepherd with lupus that cost her thousands over its life time special food plus medication, this is plus normal German shepherd issues as well as the white probl ems the breed standard says white is highly undesirable for a very good reason and yes deafness is a issue with white German shepherds personally I would not give one house room, and I am not perdudice I grew up with working German shepherds mum worked a and b I n obedience

Like you, corgilover, I had heard tales of white German shepherds or Alsatians as they were called then, being culled at birth. Never knew if it was true or not.
Do see more of them about nowadays and also more people preferring very light coloured golden retrievers. I prefer a more golden GR and have a theory, rightly or wrongly, that the very light coloured ones live up to being dumb blondes, I did have one some years ago, nice friendly dog, but very scatty.

There doesn't seem to be any white as such in this country, all just cream -often even darker than the palest Golden Retrievers. The one thing that would bother me is that few GOOD breeders would have white GSDs as they would not deliberately breed for a colour seen as incorrect in the show ring -and I can't say I've seen many used for working of that colour, either. So you may struggle to find a breeder that does all the proper health testing, and doesn't just churn them out to make money of yet another "rare" colour.

If I wanted one, I'd go abroad and import the real deal -a White Herder. I.e. the FCI recognised breed, that started off the same way as here.

We have a white (we'll cream really) German shepherd now.  She's a lovely dog, has lived to the age of 11 before any health concerns have become an issue.  I have found she is very reactive when at home, not even my dad can come into my house for fear of her, yet fantastic out and about and always commented on her lovely temperament! To be fair we took her on as an adult with a fear of men. Biggest downside is the hair, she has a very soft coat that moults constantly and sticks to the carpet like Velcro!

Deafness is related to lack of pigment in the ear area.  A lot of white dogs are not truly white, and have dark pigmented eyes, lips etc which seems not to be linked with deafness.

Colour .... (Source - KC Breed Standard)

Black or black saddle with tan, or gold to light grey markings. All black, all grey, with lighter or brown markings referred to as Sables. Bi-colour: Predominantly black, may have tan or gold markings on head, chest, legs and feet; black markings may be present on toes and rear pasterns. Nose black. Light markings on chest or very pale colour on inside of legs permissible but undesirable, as are whitish nails, red-tipped tails or wishy-washy faded colours defined as lacking in pigmentation. Blues, livers, albinos, whites (i.e. almost pure white dogs with black noses) and near whites highly undesirable. Undercoat, except in all black dogs, usually grey or fawn. Colour in itself is of secondary importance having no effect on character or fitness for work. Final colour of a young dog only ascertained when outer coat has developed.

I just love all this 'highly undesirable' that crops up in many UK Breed Standards - talk about sitting on the fence.   I have no first-hand experience with 'white dogs' other than we do occasionally get a predominantly white colour Basset but 'any hound colour is acceptable' and I'm pretty certain these mainly white hounds are not carrying a deafness gene.    I do know that deafness crops up in Dallies, and white Boxers however.   With the GSD, if this is what the question is about, I'd suggest far more important (other than the dog being outright deaf!) would be to have a dog that's not a cripple!!!

Deafness is related to lack of pigment in the ear area
Is it?   Interesting.

"White" is apparently no longer the "IN" non standard colour in German Shepherds & "Blue" is now the new "White" with a high price being required for puppies.

I was reading an article about the breeders of non standard colour German Shepherds & apparently very few bother to do even a minimum of health testing & ditto the same with KC registration, ever since the non standard colours are registered as just that-non standard rather than white, blue etc

I've never seen a "grey" or mottled "grey" German Shepherd as such, I know that the Germans call GSDs with sable markings "Grey", but they are a recognised colour & not really grey as we would recognise here in the UK

White and blue GSDs are still registured as white and blue!! The only colour that I have see registured as 'colour not recognised' is liver but I think that may have changed in the last few years.

I have 2 white ( well 1 ginger and 1 cream) GSDs most of the white GSDs I have met ( I attend alot of WALCSS ralleys) have good temperments and alot are now being health tested BUT we do have a big problem with AF, DM and epilepsy after years of being breed purely for colour!!

http://www.doggenetics.co.uk/problems.html
There are a few colour genes which can occasionally cause health problems in dogs, most notably merle. .......

Have you registered any white or blue puppies in the last 6 years ?

No I haven't registured anything in the last 6 years!
But do no of at least 3 white litters born this year the last being in April they were registured as white.

Must be doing it  via hard copy, they should get picked up by the online registration as it doesn't have blue or white as an option

I have just checked litter born this year contained white pups was registured online and white was a listed option.

Hm how do you know they were registered online ? I'm surprised you have/had a non white bitch german bloodline bitch, pity about her hip score :-(

Oops that should be 2 non white german bred bitches

IMHO a dog is a dog, is a dog. The last thing anyone should be looking for in a gsd is the colour. Conformation, health testing, ability to do the job it was bred for and temperament should come above colour. Of course, if you are showing, an undesirable colour is not something you want but as the owner of a white, blue, black and black and tan shepherd, the colour was the last thing on my mind when I picked my pup (of course blue came with her white mum and in a desperate state).  Breeder told me black was rare...no it isn't...blue is rare...no it isn't...not anymore it is (blue/white/liver) non standard. Non standard colours are being churned out and labelled rare with massive price hikes. Liver is the new 'in' thing and a breeder with a male, hipscore of 27, was selling her pups £900 because she knew her lines were epilepsy clear. There are now timber wolf greys and even curly coated shepherds!

Check out a breeder in america who has brindle shepherds, pandas, isabellas and also black and white ones. Not sure if I can mention names but also breeds sled dogs and ships her pups abroad - a liver boy was sent to the uk a few years back. Her affix is a certain type of tree.

> xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml">also breeds sled dogs

Makes me wonder about the purity of the GSDs with the fancy non standard colours that just happen to apear in sled dogs.

Is it just me the link isn't working for?

Barbara, I swear I can see the head of a collie on the black and whites she has...and how come she is the only one lucky enough to 'happen across' these 'rare' anomalies which the owners are happy to sell to her that strangely all happen to be across the pond?

....probably the same way aliens and ufos only land there, superheroes from crypton turn up and even demi gods from far out galaxies feel its the only country on our planet worth visiting, not to mention cars the transform into robots.

Just as an aside, a thorough molecular genetic study was done on the Panda Shepherds  - involving the leading canine geneticists - and it was concluded that it was a novel mutation within the breed, and not due to crossbreeding.

New mutations aren't common but they DO happen (and are statistically more likely to occur within the most populous breeds, of which the GSD is probably tops on a global and historical basis).

I know because I asked the breeder/owner!
Tommee you have been doing your homework :-) it is a pity about Theias hipscore but to her changes nothing she lives life to the full at 100 miles an hour ( she is still here and always will be)

Makes me wonder about the purity of the GSDs with the fancy non standard colours that just happen to apear in sled dogs.

Reading there own page on brindle gsd they say that they traced there line back to one brindle girl ans they got there pup from her son. However they go on to say that they asked the breeder to DNA test the litter to prove there pure breed but when they tested the brindle son who sired the litter the test confirmed his mother was who they said but not his farther as it was inconclusive and they couldn't retest as his farther was dead. Both his parents were imported with is why the akc had his DNA on file. so if the brindle boys sire may not be his sire who is to say the his brindle mother's pedigree is right. But as he got his brindle from his mother they are overlooking that fact.

http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/services/public/breed/colours.aspx?id=5106

List of accepted colours for GSD registrations, last one is White.

>Must be doing it  via hard copy, they should get picked up by the online registration as it doesn't have blue or white as an option

Looking at Mariannes link it appears that you can now register blue, white, liver etc. I actually think the KC are right to extend the list, by listing them as acceptable colours they hopefully take the rarity value out of them a bit?

Personally I like traditional black and tan gsds, but in borzois and silkens we say that there is no bad colour on a good dog, I've never chosen a dog based on colour.

Just to add - at one point we in Bassets were seeing colours like Liver and White, Blenheim, and even Brindles being accepted.   Hardly correct.   The KC Registration Dept were taken to task, and stopped allowing these colours to be registered.   Not that the hounds WERE those colours, just they puppies were being registered by the breeders, out of ignorance.  Clearly what you see as accepted colours, may not be anything other than those processing the applications were not aware!!

When I had my boy, which is over twenty years ago, whites could be registered, he had a KC pedigree, I also sent off his change of owner slip to the KC and received confirmation back, so all above board.

Not that the hounds WERE those colours, just they puppies were being registered by the breeders, out of ignorance.  Clearly what you see as accepted colours, may not be anything other than those processing the applications were not aware!!

That happens in my breed all the time. Colours registered that do not and cannot exist. The ridiculous thing is, the KC have added them to the list of acceptable colours simply because so many had already been registered like that!! So if enough people had registered Green puppies, Green would be an acceptable colour once they introduced the list. NUTS. I have never understood why it isn't a simple case of ONLY allowing what is mentioned in the breed standard and nothing else.

If you try to register a kitten of a colour that the parents cannot possibly have produced due to the genetics involved, the registration WILL be rejected. Why the KC can't do the same I've never understood.

having done a little research on the "Panda" GSDs & the DNA tests were done were not complete Genome mapping, but simply compared the DNA of the parents to those of the offspring & the conclusion was that the puppies did come from the parents, there is apparently no 100% DNA profiling to prove that a dog is any particular breed(despite there being a company that claim to be able to do so). The "leading canine geneticists" were simply geneticists who did DNA testing for parentage & inherited conditions, they were not I am reliably informed experts in individual breed identification as to date there is no reliable tests.

The most populace breed in the world is the Labrador Retriever BTW & not the GSD

have a look here for information http://www.walcss.com/    white/cream gsd are no more likely to have temperament problems than any other colour or health problems.
My solid black comes from a breeder who occasionally has whites among other colours I dint go after a black I ws looking for  agood breeder, it just happened that one of the three pups available was black and I decide to have a male the other two were female. As you do for any dog just need a good responsible breederwho breeds for health and temperament and wants to improve their dogs . If you pm me I can put you in touch with whispa's breeder who will give you good advice and will know reputable breeders who you can chat with.
I am pretty sure all colours can be shown in the same way that both long and short haired can be now as long as they have a double coat. However the chances of making it very far with along or more unusual colour is still unlikely the judges tend to be rather preferring the traditional gsd That is one of the reasons there is white and longcoats society so people can show and have fun with their dogs some of home may not get a anywhere in the show ring.

<Black or black saddle with tan, or gold to light grey markings. All black, all grey, with lighter or brown markings referred to as Sables. Bi-colour: Predominantly black, may have tan or gold markings on head, chest, legs and feet; black markings may be present on toes and rear pasterns. Nose black. Light markings on chest or very pale colour on inside of legs permissible but undesirable, as are whitish nails, red-tipped tails or wishy-washy faded colours defined as lacking in pigmentation. Blues, livers, albinos, whites (i.e. almost pure white dogs with black noses) and near whites highly undesirable. Undercoat, except in all black dogs, usually grey or fawn. Colour in itself is of secondary importance having no effect on character or fitness for work. Final colour of a young dog only ascertained when outer coat has developed. >

I don't think that the KC has ever "banned" non standard colour or coat length from being shown & the UK breed standard has no disqualifying faults(unlike the FCI breed standards I believe)but the non standard colours are still highly undesirable & so should be treated like any other fault

lkj back to your question. Why do you want white ? if its just because you like the look of the dog and you aren't intending to show  what everyone thinks and whether it is a desirable colour or not and can be shown is irrelevant. if its a healthy dog from a reputable breeder who cares about her babies for life with a good temperament and  you bond together it will be your dog.
The gsd world is fraught with differences, should they be long or short haired , German or English , straight or sloped back and so on. I have my gsd because I love the breed and hes is from healthy well bred line and a breeder who cares . I love him to bits and even if black isnt popular with some what do I care

I'm pretty sure you can show a non standard coat as long as pigmentation of leathers is black. A blue gsd was shown but after complaints the requirements were changed so that only dogs with black pigment could be entered, thus making liver/blue entries impossible and greatly reducing white enties if they have liver noses. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

If you try to register a kitten of a colour that the parents cannot possibly have produced due to the genetics involved, the registration WILL be rejected. Why the KC can't do the same I've never understood.

They say they do it with labs. Guess it would bee to much work for them to extend that to all breeds

Guess it would bee to much work for them to extend that to all breeds

It shouldn't be once set up -it is computer generated. The computer will flag anything up that isn't genetically possible, when a registration application is made. The GCCF is still far behind the KC when it comes to the computer system yet they've had this for many years.

it would be great if the did do it. Would stop all the new colours that seem to be popping up in some breeds which will most likely be from a secret cross.

I've checked yesterday with a local GSD breeder/exhibitor & there are no rules under which a non standard coat colour cannot be shown in the UK, apparently under the rules for European shows are different & non standard coat colours are a disqualifying fault. There are no longer non standard coat lengths, but all dogs must have a correct undercoat as not having a correct under coat is also a disqualifying fault on the continent not only for showing but also for registration & breeding

UK:-

<Faults Any departure from the foregoing points should be considered a fault and the seriousness with which the fault should be regarded should be in exact proportion to its degree and its effect upon the health and welfare of the dog and on the dog's ability to perform its traditional work>

Europe: -

<Colours are black with reddish-brown, brown and yellow to light grey markings; single-coloured black, grey with darker shading, black saddle and mask. Unobtrusive, small white marks on chest  as well as very light colour on insides are permissible, but not desirable. The tip of the nose must be black in all colours. Dogs with lack of mask, light to piercing eye colour, as well as with light to whitish markings on the chest and the insides, pale nails and red tip of tail are considered to be lacking in pigmentation. The undercoat shows a light greyish tone. The colour white is not allowed.>

<Dogs with eliminating faults such as e.g. unsound temperament, congenital deafness or blindness, hare-lip, cleft palate, substantial dental defects or jaw anomalies, PRA,  epilepsy, cryptorchidism, monorchidism, albinism, improper coat colours or diagnosed severe hip dysplasia may not be bred.>

does the op want to show ? apart from this area any other discipline doesn't require a particular colour its still health and temperament for me

Just for anyone's interest in the BRS for this last quarter there were 135 white GSDs pups registered with the KC out of a total of 1884 pups (305 litters). Some were all white litters, others were mixed colours.

Hard to get a clear picture as it seems and awful lot of especially non standard GSD's are not KC reg.

Although I do not particularly care for whites, the biggest issue as I see it is that you can rarely find a white GSD (with mostly whites in the pedigree) without a vast amount of known epileptics in the pedigree.  A number of years ago when popularity of the colour soared, so the BYBs cashed in on the crop, and temperament and everything other aspect of the dog went out of the window just to produce the colour, and so there were a lot of nervous aggressive whites about, which is how they gained the reputation for being of bad temperament.

If someone really wants a white, the only recommendation I would give would to be to get it from a litter of standard colours that just happened to throw a white. I would not go for a pup from white lines.

There are far too many 'coloured' breeders using dogs they should never use, to produce these colours - so beware.  I know that several breeders of whites are ethical and health test....but you will still find a lot of well known epileptics in the pedigree, and that's something I just wouldn't want to gamble on.

I can confirm this. 

A lady I know bought a puppy from a small scale commercial, but health testing (all hip scored and KC registered) breeder producing long coats for the pet market. 

She had used her long coat lovely natured standard coloured dog to white bitches to get mixed litters.  She improved on temperament, but unfortunately the epilepsy was an issue.

My friends dog developed the condition and at one point he went into continuous fits and had two days in the vets under sedation.  He was a lovely dog and was on medication, but eventually was PTS at about 9.

In the seventies my mum was aware of stories of dogs having fits at shows and a story of one of these dogs of having more than fifty per cent of its pedigree of being know epileptic to people in the breed while the poor owner buying their first German shepherd did not have a clue it cab still be a problem in some lines today with people having to be care when mixing certain lines because it is still there, between hip dysplasia epilepsy elbows lupus anal fungielous von Hildebrand diease and then mixing in the white gene with its own problems you have to be so careful not even mentioning the temperament I am aware of a lot of German shepherd issues because I only lost my last one ten years ago and health wise things have not change a great deal for the better unfortunately

It would be very rare for standard colour lines to throw white in the GSD unless the lines carry white and for that to happen, there would have to be white lines in the pedigree. I don't think I've seen any whites registered for years now from standard colour bloodlines.

There was a lot of saturated breeding for white in the GSD decades ago in the UK using bloodlines going back to epileptic producers, which meant responsible breeders avoided those bloodlines. The white gene pool is very small, increasing the risk of doubling up on health issues. 

Personally, in GSD, I would only purchase from the healthiest 'non bottlenecked' health tested bloodlines with good temperament and working ability.  Given the genepool, you are more likely to get that in standard colour bloodlines and unlikely (IMO) in bloodlines bred for white or other 'strange' colours.