As I've mentioned before on here, for my next dog, once Daisy is gone, I would like a HWV.
I'm still trawling through breeders, there are a few I like the look off, but haven't settled on one specific breeder yet.
What I'm wondering is, is it too early to be looking to get on a list, given that Daisy is still hale and hearty?, she will be nine in a few months, but being an SBT, they're not known for their longevity.
I'm actually getting a bit paranoid at the prospect of being dug less for a year or possibly more, hence why I'm wondering if I shouldn't be looking to get on a list now, so hopefully I won't have quite so long to wait.
I'm not even sure if its ok to be on someone's list and not actually be in a postion to have a puppy !.

I don't think you should go on a waiting list if you're not ready to take a puppy, but you could make contact with breeders and get to know them and their dogs, decide on a breeder and keep in touch and then when you do want a puppy hopefully you'll be 'fast tracked' up the list. I know when it comes to puppy waiting lists that some people will have to wait a long time and others will be able to just say they interested when the litter is actually born as everyone would rather their pups went to someone they actually knew.

I do understand your fear of being dogless, I would hate that. Could you possibly foster or even adopt a rescue dog when the time comes, and while waiting for your pup, say a rescue a vizsla that was good with other dogs so it wouldn't spoil your plans.

I would say its best to get your research done and pick a breeder now. Once you go through the necessaries and they agree to let you have a pup (providing your circumstances dont significantly change) then you can be waiting in the wings. I'm sure if you explain the situation they will understnad that you may not be ready to take a pup straight away but can inform them as soon as you are so you are ready to take a pup from their next available litter.
Like you say, you could be dogless for a long time whilst doing your research etc. Already starting now shows commitment and patience and taking time to select the right breeder, and, it will allow you to form a bond with breeder and the dam/sire of the pups before your pup has even been conceived!! =)

I have someone interested in a pup from me, but not from this ltter. I know that they aren't ready for one but they have shown an interest for the future. I keep in touch semi regularly (in other words not every week) and know that if things change they will let me know. BUT it also lets me know to contact them next time before anyone else, just to see if they are still interested. so, IMHO, I am happy to have them contact me now, and feel that you shouldn't be scared to contact any breeder about an enquiry for the future.

Thanks guys, very helpful advice :)
I'll continue my research and eventually phone a few breeders for a chat to make my final choice, providing I pass muster of course, and hopefully they will keep me in mind .

When I first started looking for a HWV there weren't that many around, and even fewer that I really liked.  I was thinking I'd be ready for a puppy in about 6 months...

It soon became apparent that the breeder was key and, although the parents were very important, I started to realise how much the general dog husbandry and puppy rearing stage really mattered to me.

I could have had a dog to meet to meet my timescale from another breeder but decided to wait for my chosen breeder and joined a list that was likely to be app 14 months.  In the end there was a change as the breeder did have an earlier mating and a space became available on that list instead.

Have you been to look at our breed in the ring lately?  We're currently being judged by a lot of breed specialists (breeders in most cases) which really affects the entry (and isn't the best for our breed as a whole at this early stage of CC's - but that's another story!) however if you can get to a show with a good all round gundog judge you'll see we still have quite a variance in coat, colour and size.  Once you get your eye in you'll soon notice that some breeding stands out a mile and you may find that there are dogs which appeal to you and others which do not.  Many bitches in this breed can go 10-11 months between seasons so breeders will start planning matings a long time in advance, added to which we appear to be a fairly breed loyal bunch and existing owners often return to the breeder and book dogs years in advance!

I guess what I'm saying is get yourself out there now - you'll need some time to see the dogs and meet a few before deciding what you like and then you could be looking at matings that are still some years away.  Luckily we don't have a split between show and working dogs but not everyone will hip score and even a few Breed Club members still don't!  The advantage of starting your research early is that you can spend a bit of time looking at the dogs and breeders who've consistently done well in the ring (and field) and have a good look at the hip scores behind the ones you like.  There is a v good online resource to help you - here - and you can check the coi of each mating too.

Incidentally I know a breeder who had a lady on her list for a couple of years who was in exactly the same situation as you.  She was keen to have a puppy but until she was ready she simply moved from list to list :)

Cheers D a B, I was at the SKC a few weeks ago but sadly missed the HWV judging, but I caught them at the previous one, Id also hoped to go to the Border Union Show this coming weekend, but looks like I won't make it after all.
There are three breeders so far I like the look of, perhaps I should just bite the bullet, get in touch, and see what they say.
I plan to try my hand at Gundog training with a view to be on a picking up team, there's a very good trainer just a half mile from me, but never having been involved with shooting or even knowing anyone involved, that may not pan out, but I'd also like to get back into agility.
Would you mind if I e mailed you with my choices of breeders and get your view ? I know one of them is the breeder of your dogs and an excellent breeder, but I don't know about the other two.

In response to Chaumsongs idea of fostering, yes it is a possibility, but at the moment the OH isn't keen on the idea, he thinks he'd get to attached and not want to give them back , but once we're actually dug less, he may change his mind.

Iv been looking for a puppy for nearly 2 years now I spent a good 6 months looking into lines and breeders then contacted a select few and to date have been on various waiting lists for about 18 months now. Iv only taken so long as I wanted to see what was been produced, travel and see a few of the dogs in the lines and get a bit hands on with what they are actually like. For the right dog you may have to wait, but it will be worth it in the end.

For me I want a few things- like a long line of health tested dogs, stock that's done we'll in the ring and a good temperament, and new lines. If I had to wait 4 years for the right puppy I would, For me to rush into any litter would be wrong personally and I would enviably kick myself for doing it.

> and I would enviably kick myself for doing it.

I feel just the same, I'm determined to get the right dog, but I just don't know how long my resolve will last when I don't have a dog at all, hence trying to get everything in place before hand as far as is possible.
I've even given my dog owning friends strict instructions that under no circumstances have they to let me go off half cocked and get the first dog that comes my way lol.
I'll be relying on you guys too, if it looks like I'm weakening, just post , DON't DO IT !

> I feel just the same, I'm determined to get the right dog

What is the main obstacle against getting a puppy while you still have your present one? Could it be worked around?

Not really Sue, Daisy is dog aggressive, and while she would probably accept a puppy once she got used to the idea, I don't want my next dog to inherit her behaviour.
I want to be able to commit 100% to a new puppy and not feel guilty that I've left Daisy behind while we're socialising.

I'm not sure i'm on any official list of such,but I've been waiting for a puppy from a particular bitch I love for about 18 months now give or take and still have to wait until next Spring for the next litter! Last litter was only small and other people had preference over me, so I missed out. But next time I hope i'm lucky!

I don't think you can ever contact a breeder to early, and it really does help to build up some kind of relationship with them in the mean time. I think any good breeder would only be to happy to have you wait for one of their puppies.

> Not really Sue, Daisy is dog aggressive, and while she would probably accept a puppy once she got used to the idea, I don't want my next dog to inherit her behaviour.
>  I want to be able to commit 100% to a new puppy and not feel guilty that I've left Daisy behind while we're socialising.

The new pup wouldn't necessarily inherit that - you are aware of it, and that's the first step.

I know you take her everywhere, but even without a new pup there may come a time when she has to be left at home.... When she is in her dotage and can't walk far, when you know taking her with you would tire her out too much.  Will you then stop going out, because she won't; or leave her sleeping beside the fire?

If she is happy to do that then you won't lose anything by taking the puppy out instead, and if she and the puppy form even a tiny bond, then if you have to go out leaving both at home, they will have company in one another.

Funny, I was just having that same discussion with a friend last night.
Her BT Bruce was a little git with other dogs, but now he's reached 15, it's doubtful he'd even notice if she brought a puppy in.
So if Daisy does get old and doddery, it is a possibility.

I had a couple on my waiting list for a litter when they were ready, in the end they had a pup from not the litter I had, nor the next but the litter after that.

I have a nice couple who are still waiting on finding the right house after a move fell through.

I am likely to let them know of other litters from good breeders when they are ready if it suits them better.

In our breed it's about getting new people into the breed and ownership, not about selling ones own stock.

I thought this interesting on this topic: http://rufflyspeaking.net/puppy-buyer-ettiquette/

Thanks for that Barbara :) I certainly wont be a Horace lol.

At the moment I have two breeders Im interested in, but obviously that might change as I garner more information. Pretty sure one of them wont change and Id consider them my " gold standard " the other, I don't know quite as much about, so they may or may not be as good.
Im certainly learning a lot about the different lines, when I go to sleep at night, Im counting hip scores rather than sheep !.

Thanks Brainless, I really enjoyed that! :-)

I think the most true bit was that those in a breed (decent breeders that belong to breed clubs health test etc) all know each other. 

Also we also are generally aware of the bad ones, as most of us have some contact involvement in rescue where the results of their irresponsible selling often end up.  Certainly 100% true in our breed.

We will also warn others if we get scams or very unsuitable enquirer, in case they change their story to suit.

That's so true Barbara. Recently somebody has been trying to buy a pup in my breed. The same person tried about 3 years ago and was turned down then by everyone, as she clearly was not suitable and also kept lying to breeders (which we found out by speaking to each other and realising the different stories given). She eventually found a pup from a breeder who didn't care who they sold to, so now wants to breed from it. Every single show breeder in the UK was contacted and every single one said no -and of course we all compared notes and knew exactly what had been said etc.  Huge advantage in a smaller breed.

Sadly it doesn't always work, and a friend of mine sold a bitch that is being used as a puppy machine, for unregistered back to back litters in the North East.  The first one at 17 months.  I feel very sad as I bred two of the grandparents of that poor bitch.

The worst thing is that the bitch has one grandfather who it now turns out was a prcd-PRA carrier, and there are several carriers in the pedigree of the male she is using.  Of course they haven't been DNA tested (the test first became available Oct '08).

So there is a good chance both parents of these unregistered pups could be carriers and producing affected pups.  Fortunately it is a late onset issue, but one that can now be avoided with responsible breeding.

> I thought this interesting on this topic: [url=undefined]http://rufflyspeaking.net/puppy-buyer-ettiquette/[/url]

There are some excellent articles on that site.

Breeder etiquette, too -
http://rufflyspeaking.net/breeder-ettiquette

Comes up " page not found " :(

Try this
http://rufflyspeaking.net/breeder-etiquette/

When Im making intial contact with a breeder, would it be bad form to enquire the average age previous dogs have gotten to, and what they died from ?.
Im not looking for specifics really. just want to get an idea as to the longevity and if they are perticularly prone to cancer within certain lines.
Im not even sure how to ask that question delicatly lol.

This is an entirely appropriate question as long as the breeder is in contact with the vast majority of the dogs they have bred.It's easy to say " oh no I've never known any of my breeding dying of ....." but this is only relevant and useful if they are in contact with most of their breeding and are sure that an owner would inform them of a death/illness.

It's quite useful to ask breeders how many are still alive of older litters and to enquire the age of their own dogs plus the ages that their foundation stock died and what of. Remember if a dog is elderly then there might not actually be a reason for death other than old age.

Myself, I keep a record of all dogs I bred and  their date of death and cause plus any other that have had serious illness. The longer you breed the more this record becomes relevant and informative and also puts deaths and their causes into perspective. A pattern of causes  may emerge over years or it may be that every death is from a different cause. When I first began breeding I knew that one day I would get the call that a "puppy" I had bred had died but it seemed years off. Well it was years off but over the years, now the first litter is elderly and subsequent litters are aging I do get those calls once in a while. It's an honour to be included in decisions regarding  a dog I bred last days, to support their owners and shed tears with them.

Diane

Forgot to add..............the question is only worth asking if you can feel that you trust  the breeder you are asking the questions of !

Thanks Diane, I hadn't thought of asking how many of the older litters are alive.
It seems every day a new question pops into my head.