With the growth of dog based internet forums, social media pages etc there is a lot of opinions and advice flying around, and much of it is given quite obviously without much  knowledge or experience.  A breed based facebook page run by a pet owner has decided that all opinions are equal, and that contradiction is not allowed.   Experience, knowledge, expertise etc. are irrelevant and likely to annoy members.  So now when a member poses a question, no matter  how serious, health related, welfare related etc, every reply and opinion is to be left un-challenged and without discussion, regardless off how good or bad they are.  A blatantly wrong opinion giving very bad and possible damaging advice may not be corrected, however politely, nor an alternative view point given.  I understand the page owner wants to keep her page friendly, but this seems to me to be such a very bad idea and could have terrible consequences based on the lack of knowledge of some of the members, coupled with the willingness to post opinions based on nothing but a personal thought or feeling.

I wondered how common this kind of thing is on other pet based sites?  Have other CDers seen something like this before on other pages?  I have agreed with her that everyone should be allowed to express an opinion, but she simply does not see the point that all opinions are not equal in content or value.  IT this idea is widespread looks like there is an awful lot of bad advice spread around out these in dog cyperspace.

Well, I have never found any other dog forums, so I'm blatantly not IT orientated.  And don't "do" Facebook.

Even with that as my track record, your post is worrying.  CD has people with knowledge by the bucket load, and most folk coming here for advice would get sensible help.

I think our strength is in the fact that most people on here will know who can give the right answers to what.  I only do obedience for fun, but we have some great trainers on here, so I leave them to give the advice.  The same goes for most of our topics.  It is frightening to think that folk will be given the wrong info, say, on a health related topic.

Sometimes opinions on here can get heated, but it is right and proper that people air their views.  I don't know the answer, but can understand your concerns.

I am a member of just one forum and there is only one forum that I know has the knowledge to answer my questions and that is CD. The members here have a vast knowledge of virtually any subject and I trust the answers given.
I cannot understand anyone putting their trust and the health of their animal in the answers from people with no more knowledge or veterinary training than myself, that would defeat the object of asking for advice and could also be dangerous for my dog should I follow this advice. We can all have 'opinions' but opinions are really just guesswork, to get a true answer you need to hear it from people that have been around dogs professionally for many years, breeders, veterinary nurses / assistants, trainers and people that over the years have experienced many of the problems that I may need assistance with.
If anyone is silly enough to take on board the advice given by any well meaning but inexperienced person then I might as well go down my local pub and ask for advice there, I am sure there will be many willing to give me their opinions !!!

Sorry I will stop my rant and get off my soapbox.

> but she simply does not see the point that all opinions are not equal in content or value

It seems a bit pointless in having the page in the first place then!

If it were simply a page, bringing people together who own the same breed, full of "look how cute my dog is" type posts, then there wouldn't really be any bodies opionions that warrented being challenged.

If it is a place where people will be asking for/giving advice, then there will be stupid opionions (often bradished as facts) that could do with being challenged for the welfare of the dogs.

For many people ignorance is bliss :(

> that all opinions are equal, and that contradiction is not allowed

If all opinions are equal, then surely they can not refuse posts that are offering advice that contradicts others, if that post does not reference the one it is contradicting?

EG.

'A' posts: in my opionion dogs have 3 legs
'B' posts: dogs have 4 legs, look at this site here (inserts relevent link)/gives examples or scientific reference/in depth explanaition

'B' has made no reference to 'A' and has not stated that 'A' is wrong. 'B' has qualified thier 'opionion', with back-up evidence/facts. Allthough 'A' has not been directly challenged, readers can see which 'opionion' has more credence.

>A blatantly wrong opinion giving very bad and possible damaging advice may not be corrected, however politely, nor an alternative view point given.

How does that work? After the first post, will they only allow posts that agree with it?

ETA, the only other forum I am a memeber on is a breed-specific one. It's not very busy, but what is apparent as soon as one joins, is that there are a some memebrs with a wealth of breed-specific knowledge. 'Neewbies' will join, ask questions, get advice and be very gratefull for that advice (as I was :) ). But there is never anything stupid advised to be challenged.

Sillysue, I think that is just my point - when discussion and alternative view points are not allowed it could just become a case of the first advice is hte only advice, however good or bad it is.  IF it is something subjective and unimportant, like good places to go for a dog walk, then it doesn't matter, but if it is "my dog is doing  xxxx should I take it to the vet or wait and see what happens" then good advice could be crucial, and it seems to be a fact of this online life that many people rely on others opinions before taking action.

A recent query caused this idea on the page.  Someone wanted to know if it was OK to wash their 7 week old pups - first time litter.  A whole string of opinions followed from pet owners who have never had a litter and have no clue how much mess they can create if allowed, all assuring the poster that untold damage could result from bathing the pups - one even going so far to cite the possibility of an upper respiratory infection likely to occur from bathing at that age.  It is very hard to phrase a useful response to the poster without contradicting the others who have written - and with 20+ years puppy experience behind me I have seen  and dealt with a few mucky pups!  We did have a couple of pious replies from other breeders (one of them has bred 1 litter only) assuring the OP that their puppies had never, ever been allowed to get dirty or needed a bath, and suggesting that much rubbing with baby wipes would clean them up.  OK, not a life or death situation, but these pups obviously needs a nice warm wash and dry, before skin irritations etc could develop.

Think I may have a "wander" around a few pet based forum and see how common the "all opinions are equal" idea is.

Yes, I think it's a bit of a problem.  However most fora have a rating system so you can make some judgement about the expertise of the person giving the opinion.  I always recommend this site to people as one of the most knowledgable.  It's especially useful when you encounter somone in the park who mentions they intend to breed their X-breed 8 year old bitch because their brother had a lovely dog to use . . . . I don't get into arguments with them, I just suggest they visit this site as there is lots & lots of useful information here . . . .

I had a similar situation yesterday on one of my breed facebook sites.  Someone had come down to find their dogs had eaten a whole christmas cake and nibbled a second.  I wrote about the possibility of raisin toxicity - which although extremely rare is also often fatal.  I thought they should take the dogs to the vet to make them sick.  As they hadn't eaten anything corrosive making them sick was unlikely to cause a problem.  But then several other people piled in and said no need to take them to the vet - just keep an eye on them.  In fact, that's what the vet said when they finally got hold of him!  Unfortunately once the dogs are showing symptoms there is usually irreversible kidney damage.

Fortunately the dogs were indeed OK - but I did feel a bit frustrated as even the vet didn't seem to think it was a potential emergency.

Another US based breed site commonly advocates crating young pups nearly all day, and also using shock collars on a very sensitive breed.  Unfortunately if an inexperienced owner starts using a site like this then they soon start to feel this is normal and follow the advice.

"Another US based breed site commonly advocates crating young pups nearly all day, and also using shock collars on a very sensitive breed.  Unfortunately if an inexperienced owner starts using a site like this then they soon start to feel this is normal and follow the advice. "

omg thats shocking! Mind I wasnt happy with the rasin one either. As you say by the time the dogs is showing symptons its proberly too late or at least thats what my vet told me when my flat coat ate a whole packet of chocolate muffins so we took the route of making her sick
To go back to the original post surley the whole point of a discussion is to have differeing opinons and hopefully have people with knowledge and experience to learn from I know very little against many of the people on here but thats the beauty of reading listening and LEARNING for knowledgeable people

It might be worth pointing out, whether as an answer to a post or as a word in the page owner's ear, that it is actually illegal to give health/medical advice if they're not qualified vets, and she could get into serious trouble ...

There are two types of forum that worry me, the first as you describe where no contradiction is allowed no matter how wrong a post may be or as you say verging on the harmful and then you get those sites where you can say what you like but if it happens to be a different opinion to the majority you are so bullied that you leave never to return, I don't mean disagreeing with your ideas or practices I mean real harassment. 

> it is actually illegal to give health/medical advice if they're not qualified vets, and she could get into serious trouble ...

Hang on, doesn't that apply to most of us lot too?

Most people giving health advice do advise the poster to take their dog to a vet if they are unsure though.

Hang on, doesn't that apply to most of us lot too?

Yes it does, however I have never seen an answer to a serious question regarding health where the OP has been advised that ' my answer is right and you do not need to speak to a vet'  in fact in any response to a serious health issue the OP is advised that it could be this or that, but 'go to your vet to be sure'
This is why I trust this forum, you offer good trustworthy advice

Have spent a little while looking at other similar FB sites, and none seem to be quite as bad as the one I mentioned is becoming, but some of the online forum seem very anti anything other than very basic discussion, otherwise posters seem to pile in quash any reasonable debate.  Thank heaven for CD!

I don't do Facebook either, just don't get it, I have been a member of several breed specific websites over the years mainly US based and there was several where you were set upon if you dared to try and question/correct what had been said by others, they didn't want the boat rocked and they would OOH and AAH over dogs of very poor quality that someone planned to breed from and wish them luck etc., I and others would get banned for daring to say they were not of breed quality and why.

Surely folk will realise that there is a problem with this persons site if no one is allowed to contradict some obviously wrong info, personally I would leave her to get on with it rather than get mad at the comments you can do nothing about.