I am buying an airedale from Slovenia and will be bringing it back to Greece by air from Vienna. It will be microchipped, have a passport, be up to date on vaccines, have a fit to fly certificate from the vet plus a declaration stating that it has not been in contact with wild animals....however, it will not have had the rabies vaccine as this can't be administered until 12 weeks. Plus you need to wait 3 weeks after the rabies vaccine has been given to see if it has taken effect.
I have asked the airline(who accept puppies on flights from 10 weeks,) the vet, the airport...nobody seems to know if I can bring the puppy without the rabies shot. Obviously I don't want to arrive at the airport to be told the puppy can't travel. I am hoping that as everyone seems so ignorant of the rule concerning puppies under 4 months and the rabies shot, I won't have any problems but I would love to hear if anyone has brought a puppy of this age by air into Greece or any other european country, and whether they experienced any problems.

I am bringing a pup from France to Ireland and have been told it must have the rabies shot so I have to wait until he's 4 months to bring him in.

used to be able to move pups under 3 months within some EU countries without Rabies vaccine except to those countries like ours that required titre tests.

Since January the rules have been required to be harmonised so it's likely you cannot move a puppy under 3 months and 3 weeks of age, but you need to check with the Greek Authorities, equivalent of DEFRA through.

yes agree with Barbara the only way to know what you can and cant do is to ask the Greek authorities.... now though you shouldn't need to 'see if it's taken effect' as no titre test within EU is required so 12 week injection and 21 day wait should be all you need do - pup can then travel on a pet passport....

> so 12 week injection and 21 day wait

It's 3 MONTHS injection and 3 weeks wait.

it may be 3 months, but in effect it's done at 12 weeks, and it's 21 days... which is actually 3 weeks.... 7 days to the week and all ;-)

It is very important that the Rabies vaccine is applied as licensed, as if it is licensed from 3 months (which is closer to 13 weeks) then vaccinating at 12 weeks will invalidate the passport, as not complying with regulations.

http://www.defra.gov.uk/wildlife-pets/pets/travel/pets/
"Dogs, cats and ferrets
The UK does not allow  dogs, cats and ferrets that have not been vaccinated against rabies to enter the UK. Once they have reached the minimum age for vaccination (as stated on the vaccine manufacturer's datasheet) they must be prepared in accordance with all the requirements explained on these web pages, taking account of the required order of preparation."

For example: http://www.noahcompendium.co.uk/Virbac_Limited/documents/S4862.html

Primary course and booster vaccination:

Dogs & cats

Primary vaccination age*
3 months or older

Booster vaccination
every 3 years

Route of administration
intramuscularly or subcutaneously


* Primary vaccination may be administered at an earlier age (minimum in dogs and cats of 4 weeks of age), but then a repeat vaccination must be given at the age of 3 months.

http://www.defra.gov.uk/wildlife-pets/pets/travel/pets/pet-owners/#a
".....If the vaccination is in two parts the 21 day wait will be from the date of the second vaccination...."

So it's 21 days then ;-)

and nearer 13 weeks is in fact (of course) 12 weeks! It may be technically slightly more than 12 weeks, but it's not 13 weeks ;-)

you will find that having the vaccination at 12 weeks doesn't actually matter......... as long as the dog is 'over' 12 weeks then it's fine :-)

Bizarrely the Defra rules talk about vaccination in parts, if it's 2 parts then its from the second, which concerned me as my pup was given two vaccinations.  I confirmed with both the German vet and my own vet that they would count from the first vaccination as it was two separate vaccinations rather than in two parts, and although the P&O customs in Belgium looked at the dates, they were ok with the 21 days from the original vaccination and the customs in UK didn't even quibble...
he had his vaccination at 12 weeks..... and came into the UK just over the 21 days to fit in with my travelling companion and we came into UK 5th January :-)

> as long as the dog is 'over' 12 weeks then it's fine :-)
>
>

No the dog has to be over 3 MONTHS WHICH DEPENDING ON WHICH MONTH A PUPPY IS BORN (FEBRUARY AND LEAP YEARS ETC) it will be at least 90 days old (say born December making it 3 months March, it will be 12 weeks and 6/7 days, so 13 weeks give or take a day.

You were lucky, but next time you travel you might not be.

The people checking are not infallible, which is why recently a rabid puppy was imported into Holland from Morocco via Spain, with incorrectly issued Pet Passport.

the pup and two other dogs had to be destroyed and around 48 people who had been in contact with ti had to be treated (and we know that if treatment is late it may be ineffective and there is no cure for Rabies).

No, I followed everything perfectly which is why I was allowed to travel - luck had nothing to do with it :-)

Not if the vaccine was licensed from 3 months, unless the pup was over 3 calender months of age when vaccinated..

In my experience of DEFRA - which was MAFF back then - you can't believe a thing you're told and you won't get anything in writing from them either.

I imported some small animals under the Balai Directive and was happy to follow it to the letter, except that I didn't get the "letter" from MAFF despite asking for it in writing many times. This put the animals, myself, my own animals at home and anyone else in contact at risk.

The second time I imported it was even worse, they claimed I hadn't done it correctly (despite asking so many many many!!!!!!!!!!! times for the correct procedure to be laid out for me to follow!) so I went by what they had reluctantly told me to do the first time. This resulted in a call a few days afterwards from the head of the department warning me that I had broken the rules and my pets at home and those I had imported were all at risk of seizure!

I had never sweated blood before but I lost about 8 pints of it over a 5 hour period that afternoon when I was being bucked about between departments on the phone and speaking to so many people who all contradicted themselves.... I really thought I would lose my beloved cats as well as my small animals and be faced with fines, imprisonment, the whole works - despite trying my darndest to do what was right in the first place. I was treated appallingly by the department and I will never trust them again, not even now they are DEFRA... sounds like same name, same strife!

Not surprised to see it's just as hard to get an answer out of them now as it was back then -

....and just so you know, the small animals I brought in were species that CAN'T even carry rabies, they are known as terminal vectors, which means that even if infected, their fast metabolisms mean they die of it very quickly, usually too fast to pass it on and their bite is what is called a "dry bite" which doesn't spread it even if they DID bite, as there is no saliva... that includes rabbits, mice, hamsters, gerbils and fancy rats... and my imports came from the very best properly vetted breeders from show stock with full ancestry to 8 generations (why else would I go that trouble otherwise!).

It's pointless having any 'discussions' with you (Brainless)... so I'm leaving it here.

>nd nearer 13 weeks is in fact (of course) 12 weeks! It may be technically slightly more than 12 weeks, but it's not 13 weeks ;-) you will find that having the vaccination at 12 weeks doesn't actually matter......... as long as the dog is 'over' 12 weeks then it's fine :-)

Not true; three months means three calendar months, not 12 weeks. And they do check; a client had terrible trouble getting through customs because the official checked all the vaccination dates in the passport, and one had been entered wrongly from 8 years back! They were held up at Dover for over a day while their (previous) vet was contacted to confirm whether the details were in fact correct.

Annoying, but reassuring to know that some customs officials do their job properly.

I do wish people would actually read the posts :-(  

3 months is actually less than 13 weeks, it is greater (but still classified as 12 weeks) depending on the months involved, but the age is still 12 weeks ....  ie they don't have to be 13 weeks of age.... my post wasn't intended to encourage people to have their pups vaccinnated as soon as pups hit the 12 week mark but as an 'indication' of when they can have the vaccinnation... they should, of course, consult their vet....

It's very like the 4 month rule for attendance at agility events... people say 16 weeks, which it's not, however 3 months is pretty much 12 weeks... by four months it's much nearer to 17 weeks ... as of course by 12 months it's 52 weeks.....

You will find that my boy's passport is very much accurate (German vets do tend to be sticklers for everything).  I am more than happy for anyone 'official' to check my passports... they have already been thoroughly checked twice on entry & by the vets on both sides of the border .... all is in order :-)  He came in at just under 4 months having had two vaccinnations (only the first actually required by UK law, the second perhaps should be!)

Penny - if the regulation states 3 months then it is far safer for people to stick to the three calendar month rule rather than assume that dead on 12 weeks will be fine.

And if we're going to be really picky - as you do seem to want to be - then some blocks of 3 calendar months will be just over 13 weeks!

not sure why you're 'picking' on me for wanting to be 'really picky' as it's others... but I really do give up!  I'm irritated by supporting people and getting picky folk being ultra pedantic and then accusing me of 'cheating' my way through customs.... so that's finally it!

A year is ...
365 days ÷ 4 = 91.25 days ÷ 7 = 13.03 weeks
or 52 weeks ÷ 4 = 13 weeks
or 12 months ÷4 = 13 weeks

It would seem that 12 weeks is NOT a quarter of a year/3 months

> 3 months is actually less than 13 weeks,

I have stated all along that it was 3 MONTHS, you mentioned weeks and said it was 12, I pointed out that a 3 month old puppy would be a minimum of 90 days old if you had February (a short month) in the equation which is 12 weeks and 6 days, but that in most cases it would be 13 weeks +
not 12.

So lets not muddy the waters with weeks, it's 3 CALENDER MONTHS, easy.

No-one is being picky but it is ultra important to give the right information, just because you managed to get through someone else on advice of assuming 3 months meant 12 weeks could find themselves with a lot of trouble.

No-one is accusing you of cheating, but you stated

"he had his vaccination at 12 weeks..... and came into the UK just over the 21 days to fit in with my travelling companion and we came into UK 5th January"

That means if your pup was not over 3 calender months of age but in fact 12 weeks as you say then his passport was incorrect and careful checking would have meant he was denied entry.

If he was over 3 months old why say 12 weeks to confuse the issue.  Why not say 3 months, which except with February in a non leap year in the equation is always 13 weeks plus.

To be honest except with unweaned puppies still with Mum who counts ages in weeks?  It's months and then years.