If anyone uses RC Sensible have you noticed a change in formula / quality recently?  We have fed this for several years but the last couple of bags smell slightly different, you can actually see flecks of yellow cornmeal in the kibble which you did not before.  And all of our dogs are refusing to eat it, or just pick at it.  The ones that have ate small quantities it made them immensely thirsty afterwards.  Have stopped feeding it now and sent a sample to RC but wondered if anyone else has noticed a difference.

Thanks for the heads-up on this.  I bought a new 4kg bag of RC Sensible yesterday - there's a slight change to the design on the packaging from the bag I'm coming to the end of, it's now supposed to last for 21 days (instead of 18), and reading the very small ingredients list on the back some of the amounts of ingredients have been altered. 

I haven't opened the bag yet, so don't know whether it will prove palatable or have other adverse results.  I'll let you know if I get the same as you.
It seems rather perverse to tinker with a recipe which is supposed to be for sensitive digestions.

I was just about to order, but think I will hang on till after Crufts and call at the RC stand for a chat first. Thanks for the letting us know.
I did a while ago get a batch where the kibble was all sort of stuck together in clumps I telephoned RC and it was replaced immediately, and they sent me a pre-paid bag to send back to them for investigation.
I have always be very happy with the food, and raised a litter on the starter and puppy food, all were very happy healthy pups with glossy coats.
Let us know if you find out if this was just a one off.

Can you say what ingredients have changed, so I can compare with the bags I have ???

Thanks for the note Merrypaws about the slight change in ingredients.  Noticed somewhat different bag design but did not look at the ingredients.  Now I only have the new bags.  RC have been extremely helpful by the way.  What is the change in ingredients?

Hi Harkback, Dorcas,

The current pack gives:
Analysis:  "Protein 25%, Fat 18%, Ash 5.4%, Fibre 1%, Vitamin A 20000 IU/kg, Vit D3 1000 IU/kg, Vit E 600 IU/kg Copper 20mg/kg"
Ingredients: "rice, dehydrated poultry meat, animal fats, hydrolysed animal proteins, beet pulp, vegetable protein isolate, maize gluten, vegetable oils (soya and borage), minerals, fish oil, fructo-oligo-saccharides, yeast extract (source of manno-oligo-saccharides), egg powder"
Preservative: potassium sorbate; Antioxidents: propyl gallate, BHA

The new pack:
Analysis: Protein 25% (no change), Fat 18% (no change), Crude Ash 5.7% (0.3% higher); Crude Fibres 1.2% (0.2% higher), Vitamin A 17600 IU/kg (2400 iu lower), Vitamin D3 1000 IU/kg, E1 (iron) 49 mg/kg, E2 (iodine) 3.8 mg/kg, E4 (Copper) 9mg/kg (11 mg less), E5 (manganese) 64 mg/kg, E6 (zinc) 209 mg/kg, E8 (selenium) 0.09 mg/kg (the Vitamins are listed on the new pack under "Additives", and the preservatives and antioxidents are not specified). Also listed under Analytical Constituents: fructo-oligo-saccharides 3.4 g/kg, manno-oligo-saccharides 0.5g/kg,
Omega 6 fatty acids 37.2 g/kg.

Ingredients: "rice, dehydrated poultry meat, animal fats, maize gluten, hydrolysed animal proteins, beet pulp, soya oil, vegetable protein isolate, minerals, fish oil, fructo-oligo-saccharides, hydrolysed yeast (source of manno-oligo-saccharides), borage oil."

Ingredient differences - more maize gluten (4th not 6th item on list), vegetable oils listed separately (lots more soya than borage), no egg powder.

The analysis for Republic of South Africa is given as grams per kilogram: 
old pack crude protein (min) 230, moisture (max) 95, crude fat (min) 160, crude fibre (max) 20, crude ash (max) 59
new pack crude protein (min) 230, moisture (max) 110, crude fat (min) 160, crude fibre (max) 22, crude ash (max) 62.7

I'm not a nutritionist, so am unsure of the implications of most of these changes, but for me the increase in maize gluten is something to be aware of, together with the fact that the same 4 kg back is supposed to last an extra 3 days. 

The feeding guide is different, too, it recommends feeding much less, e.g  for a 16 kg dog the
old recommendation was 240-265g (215 g for over-7s),
new recommendation is 186-245g (no listing for older dogs).

I expect to open the new pack later this week, so will see more then.

Hi Dorcas,
I've put a long detail in reply to Harkback (don't know how to reply to more than one post at a time).

> Hi Dorcas,
> I've put a long detail in reply to Harkback (don't know how to reply to more than one post at a time).

THANK YOU!  I just had looked at the bags of the food here and noticed Soya Oil listed seperately, in fact I don't recall it being listed at all when I started using this feed a few years ago.  I would not by choice feed anything with Soya in it and it must have changed in the interim and I just do not think to check for formula changes. 

Interesting the point about maize.  That was something I mentioned that the old kibble you could not "see" the maize in it but now it appears as yellow flecks.  One dog I have always given the kibble soaked and it used to hold its form even when wet but now with only a small amount of water it turns to mush quickly.  3 weeks on I have tried re-offering all my lot the kibble after a break from it and they will NOT touch it.

Now NO egg powder...that would help to retain firmer stools maybe?  That is a large change in a formula to completely take out an ingredient.

Significant change in moisture and ash too, higher levels.

Yes, you mentioned the maize in your first post, now there is significantly more.  Soya and maize are both I think cheaper ingredients, and can be GM.  Since the quantities are not specified, it's difficult to know what exactly they've done with it, but from the way your dogs are reacting it can't be good, their noses are so much better than ours they can sniff out the differences.

Egg should make stools firmer, but since it is the last ingredient in the old formulation it's difficult to know if the quantity was significant.

I'm not sure why the Vitamin E has been broken down into E1, E2 etc, and is now quoted in mg/kg instead of IU.  I haven't yet tried to find a calculator to do the conversion.  At least, I'm assuming the E1 etc is the vitamin, although each one is followed by a mineral name so I'm not sure what's going on.

Also I don't like that the preservatives and antioxidents are not specified.

I suppose the increased maize content is the reason for the lower feeding quantities.  I rather think I may be looking for another food/feeding regime.

Thanks to you, Harkback, for the notice of this.  I took the opportunity to introduce the new formulation gradually, just like starting a new food.  I've been doing this for a week now, the lad is one that eats as though food was going out of fashion, so not the fastidious eater at all.  Dry kibble accepted from hand;  gradual mixing of new food into old;  no apparent problems.  Poos right amount, consistency and frequency. 

All looked fine until this evening, when 90 minutes after emptying his dish (and doing the usual look underneath to see if there's more!) it all came back up the way it went down.  No signs of distress, nothing else out of the ordinary.  I'll try him with the new kibble again tomorrow and update on what happens.

> All looked fine until this evening, when 90 minutes after emptying his dish (and doing the usual look underneath to see if there's more!) it all came back up the way it went down

>

Yes that is how it started with my lot also!  I spoke to someone else who has had the same problem with her dogs, she feeds some on RC Sensible and some on another brand breed specific food.  The ones on the other feed have been fine but the ones on Sensible throwing up undigested food, excessive thirst, etc.  She switched all onto the other brand and immediately back to normal.

Interesting to read about your friend's experience with it.  Are you still feeding yours on RC Sensible or did you change, too?

After the first day mine has kept it all down.  He's fed once a day, which is why it's a bit slow spotting what's going on.  He is not reluctant to eat it, (but then I wouldn't rate him as a gourmet lol!).  He doesn't seem to be drinking noticeably more than normal.  There's a slight increase in mucus over his poos, which are otherwise normal, except that they contain quite obvious (small) bits of completely undigested maize - I'm thinking that the mucus may be a response to irritation of the gut by the fragments of maize.  Not sure that this has any scientific validity, it's just MHO.

(I do have a life, honestly, beyond poo inspections!)

I feel a lot less confident about feeding him this stuff now, so I'll probably be looking for an alternative diet for him.