i have x bred bitch she is suposed to have mix of two gundog breeds,milly was at fun show 2 weeks after we got here,i put milly in cross bred class the judge and steward both asked me if she was in wrong class,milly came to show last weekend with us i had few people ask me if she was pure bred gundog breed the same at ring craft last night and same in park today she is more of one breed you really can not see the x in her i am taking her puppy to vet on friday for jabs so thinking about asking vet to look at milly and see what vet thinks

is their anyway we can get her dna tested i have used dna in my horses when i use to bred

Assuming you rescued her it is possible they thought her a cross when in fact she is a pure breed. Can happen.

DNA - think you can only use that to say if a particular dog is her dam and or sire.

Well going on what Nova has said, my Rottie was down as a male Rottie in rescue!!!!
As she has now been spayed, she deffinatly a bitch!!!!!
Lea :) :)
(oh and my Rottie cross was supposedly a rhodesian ridgeback x boirder collie!!!! She grew up to be a Rottie cross....something!!!!)
Lea :) :)

There are lots of sites offering to do dna tests to discover the 'likely' mix of your cross breed dog.
I found them when I was looking for alternatives for the optigen testing (There isn't, I'm sending tests to Optigen, but through a collecting day)

I've a feeling the tests were about £100 but obviously I have no idea how accurate they are. Google dna testing for dogs and quite a lot will pop up :-)

> I've a feeling the tests were about £100 but obviously I have no idea how accurate they are. Google dna testing for dogs and quite a lot will pop up :-)

Probably more useful from the OP's point of view and not much more expensive, would be to go down the KC's new route of registering unregistered dogs - I think you need 3 championship judges to certify it is the breed claimed, and a fee of £100 or so.

I have heard some wildly varied results from DNA testing cross-breeds, and at least some of it must go on colour gene identification. I recall watching a video on YouTube where someone in the USA tested their black & white Champion American Staffordshire Bull Terrier and the results came back as Border Collie and something else!

Why bother really as the cost I presume would be expensive to to answer a question that has no real value other than to satisfy curiosity ? :-)

thanks everyone we got milly from chap in ireland,he had few gundogs its more for curisrty as thats about 6 people now that has said and thought she is pure bred,she has colouring,face etc of one but height of x she is suposed to be ,she had puppy after few weeks of having her is is deff one gundog bred,i will give kc call and have chat with them,milly was bought as company for my show pointer,i am planning to get her trained to gun and show her

I don't think it's wildly expensive to get a DNA test but I'm not sure. Why not put a pic on flickr or one of the other sharing sites so we can see it, one of my favourite games is 'guess the breed or crossbreed'. :-)

There's no reason why it won't be a cross, just that it looks more like one parent than the other.  I don[t trust those DNA testing companies that supposedly tell you what breeds are in your dogs, some American people have posted what it's quoted and they look nothing like any of the breeds and don't have any of the characteristics mentioned.

i am taking her puppy to vet on friday for jabs so thinking about asking vet to look at milly and see what vet thinks

A vet would be the last person I'd ask!! They usually know nothing about breeds. I had a vet TELL me my two crossbreeds were definitely both Belgian Shepherds! (Never mind the fact they are bigger, heavier, brindle in colour and have floppy ears -plus the fact I owned the Golden Retriever father!!) Another vet told the owner of a littermate of these two that they had been conned as their dog was in fact a Labrador.

Why not put a pic on flickr or one of the other sharing sites so we can see it, one of my favourite games is 'guess the breed or crossbreed'. :-)

Agree -and there are various judges here on CD who might just be able to have a look then. Be nice to see  a pic in any event! :)

I agree with Goldmali , the vet would be the last person to ask ! A picture would be great ....

Same here.  I agree with Goldmali about a vet and knowledge of actual canine breeds.

We all had a laugh on here when I told about an outing from work where a gang of us went to the Wildfowl and Wetlands Trust at Slimbridge.

I was thrilled to look into the distance and see a foxy looking dog.  I said OMG there's a Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever.  Every vet in the group said "A WHAT?"

The trust were thrilled with their 2 new Tollers.

the easiest thing to do would be to visit an experienced breeder of the gundog breed you think she might be and ask her opinion - I sometimes go out to verify dogs for  our breed rescue and you'ld be amazed at how many black long haired GSD owners have been told that they 'definitely ' have a Groenendael ( and yes by their vets too  ) - you need to have your girl looked at by knowledgeable breed folk - !

Yvonne

Sometimes a cross-bred pup can look so much like one of its parents that it is mistaken for the parent of that breed.

Years ago, my sister bought a cross - GSD/labrador.   He was a lovely boy, and looked so much like the labrador that a breeder of labs was insistent that he couldn't be a cross.   However my sister knew that he was a cross - because her friend owned the mother ....who was the GSD!!

Groveclydpoint, it's worth remembering too that puppies could be sired by two different dogs so even if the rescue or previous owner thought they knew the father, there might be another one in the mix :)

Have seen this with a few crosses too, they look so like 1 parent you would doubt they were a cross if you had not seen positive proof.  Years ago I say a Golden Retreiver x Border collie litter and at 6 weeks you would have sworn that 4 of them were heinz 57 (little discernable sign of either parent, brownish, tapered head) and 2 who looked 100% like Mum (Goldies)  Apparently as they grew 1 continued to look like Mum and people often insisted she could not be a cross, the other lookied like a "mini" Goldie - stayed sort of springer size, smaller than either parent, and the brownish coloured ones all grew fairly even, to about Border Collie size with gorgeous coats but not much look of either parent.

They can also look like a differnt breed altogether - a few months ago I met what appeard to be a rather nice Buff American Cocker pup - it's owner had been sold it as a "Cavachon" - Cavalier x Bichon I think (or it may have been Cav x Poodle, can't 100 remember).  HAd anyone asked me ot give an opinion I would have been quite sure it was a Yankee.

my small aniaml vet has gundogs,milly is german shorthair pointer x springer,we took her to ring craft on monday night with hector for companay a lady with gsp puppy come up to husband and said thats lovely gsp she was shocked when he said she is cross ,same happend in park yest a chap with gsp said same

can i put picts up on here??? if anyone is at same shows as me i will have milly and her dalek in car so anyone is welcome to have look at milly moo,its

milly is great girl can not wait to get her trained for gun and do companion shows,the puppy looks like springer but someone said he looks gps but both are just my pets and love them to bits

Think people pick up on one or two features and then make their decision - lost count of the number of times my hounds have been called GSDs and they look nothing like a GSD apart from the fact they have prick ears.

In the case of cross breeds people will go with the over all look they are not after all looking for a good typical example of the breed just a handle and most crosses will resemble one or other of the parents not many are a true mix when it comes to looks.

Is she the girl that I saw with her pup at Magnum a few weeks ago?  I would hazard a guess that she is not a full bred, there is some inkling of springer in her, and her pup is gorgeous and very much a springer type, very little pointer in her at all, ... sorry, maybe not what you wanted to hear.. Dalek is absolutely adorable, :-)

If I had not known from you that she was a cross, I would have assumed it... :-(

That said, they are both lovely, enjoy them,

yes thats milly i had at magam,thank u thats dalek 8 weeks now he going for his jabs on friday he so big now

are u going to waverly gundog on sund??? entered hector for that and gbas x

> are u going to waverly gundog on sund??? entered hector for that and gbas

Not at Waverly, its West of England Lab club Champ show this weekend, Not going but dog sitting for someone who is, but I will be at GBAS.. good luck for Sunday

thank u ,realy looking forward to gbas not sure how hector will be benched could not affored to enter milly for nfc x

In some ways we would love to know what mix Bramble is, it might explain his characteristics :)  We've had all sorts of suggestions over the years - GSD, husky, elkhound, corgi, whippet (LOL) - but somehow we don't really want to know :) He's unique and I'd rather he stayed that way :) :) :)

Daisy, point us to a photo so we can add to the suggestions, you never will know but it is fun to try.

Jackie, I've put a link to him in my profile - he's at least thirteen now so not quite in his prime :)

I can see why people suggest Corgi, and I will say almost certainly some type of Spitz breed, as his colouring looks to be a(w) - a gene which is mainly only present in Spitz breeds (and Schnauzers).

I'm guessing at quite a large portion of GSD. But the head and especially the ears look very Corgi. Difficult to get an idea of scale from a video.

Aw, what lovely colouring! I'd go with a shepherd mix myself. :-)

He's about 19kg - so medium collie size ? He was half the size of my friend's GSD :) :) When he was young he could run very fast - easily keep up with a whippet for a short time :)

Would say very much GSD and possibly  Border Collie but there would seem to be a lot in there. Can't myself see much in the way of spitz but there might be somewhere.

It is surprising how difficult it is to decide on the breeds even in a crossbreed and with a mongrel it is even more difficult, not that it matters two hoots they are dogs and we all love them to bits.

Wow for some reason I just don't see GSD much....
Ears are very wide & very rounded at the tips. (Pembroke Corgis have that feature).
Hind legs have not much angulation at all, they are quite moderate with slightly straight stifles.
Colouring is not quite GSD, as I said before it is more like wolf-sable (but redder, that can be due to modifying genes) - one way to find this out is if the hairs on the back are banded, or just one colour. If they are banded then it is the a(w) gene. If not then we are looking at a(y) a(t) or a.
Leg length also suggests a smaller dog than a GSD but not as short as a Corgi.
Tail looks straight and low with a bush, but with a hint of a lateral curl... i.e. not curly spitz.

A lot of new work has been done lately with regard to the colour genes in dogs, especially in the spitz types, hounds and GSDs, and certain colour patterns are limited to only a few breeds and their ancestors. For a dog to have the Wolf Grey a(w) colouring it must have had Spitz ancestry (includes Keeshonds, Elkies, Vallhunds, Sibes - the oldest colour gene known in dogs).

I love the work being done by Dr Sheila Schmutz on dog colour genetics - I think it will solve a lot of mysteries :)
http://homepage.usask.ca/~schmutz/dogcolors.html

I hope you won't be offended Daisy, but he reminds me very much of London, the Littlest Hobo dog :)
Gorgeous :)

My first instinct on seeing that video was australian cattle dog

Strange how we view things differently, it was the ears and tail set that made me decide there was no spitz. Thing is if there are loads of different breeds then it is very difficult and what ever you think of you will see it. Now someone has said Australian then I can see GSD/Aus but who known and to be fair who cares, I think this dog is loved for being himself.

Reminds me of a dog I knew as a child that was a GSD/Collie cross and very much like this one.

GSD/Australian cattle dog . At a distance on the first clip...really very Australian cattle dog.

Bearing in mind his age ( pre wacky crosses)  just as likely to be the cross that was very common a decade ago GSD/ Collie

>Colouring is not quite GSD, as I said before it is more like wolf-sable (but redder, that can be due to modifying genes) - one way to find this out is if the hairs on > the back are banded, or just one colour. If they are banded then it is the a(w) gene. If not then we are looking at a(y) a(t) or a.

Yes - some of the coarse hairs on his back are light with very dark tips. He has a thick double coat - the soft coat is very light coloured.

> Leg length also suggests a smaller dog than a GSD but not as short as a Corgi.

His legs are a little on the short side :)

> Tail looks straight and low with a bush, but with a hint of a lateral curl... i.e. not curly spitz.

He does carry his tail up towards his back at times - just depends if he is concentrating on something or not :)

> just as likely to be the cross that was very common a decade ago GSD/ Collie

That was one of our earliest thoughts :) But he doesn't resemble a collie very much apart from he is the sort of dog that is always on the go and is very intelligent :)

> and to be fair who cares, I think this dog is loved for being himself.

Definitely :) If we could find another just like him, we'd have two :) :) :)

As soon as I saw him an Australian Cattle Dog came to mind :-) :-)

> My first instinct on seeing that video was australian cattle dog

Funnily enough ditto, that and GSD.

As for the lack of size and angulation, most GSD crosses I see return to the moderate canine template, and the large ear size seem to go with GSD crosses.