Hi, i keep seeing people write about feeding their dogs a raw diet !! I have never heard of this before, cant see how as it seems to be so popular on here. And to be honest I really can not see why you would feed a dog raw chicken etc Its seem disgusting and I cant see that they would eat it !! dont mean to sound like i am judging any1 who does it, i just dont no anything about it. So please clear up my confusion and tell me some facts on it, or some advice :) Have i just been asleep for decades :)

I was advised to try my hyper 9 month old on raw food by a friend who had  raw fed his for 12 years.
I follow the same basic diet in that they get a chicken carcase each for breakfast (We are lucky enough to have a poultry packers in the nearest town. They cut the breasts, legs and wings off chickens and I buy the body that is left) I get a box of 50 for £5.
Supper consists of approximately a pound of mince each. This is not mince that you would buy for yourself. The stuff I buy is coarse minced with bone and sometimes liver or heart mixed in. There is a large range of flavours - mine seem to prefer beef and liver, but quite honestly I don't think they care too much :) I buy the meat from raw to go and they are excellent. You can buy packs from some of the larger pet stores if you wanted to try your dog with it. Most of them have a freezer in the corner with frozen blocks in. They also do packs of freeflow mince and bags of tripe.
The difference in my dogs is noticeable. The lunatic is a lot calmer and easier to deal with. Their coats are really glossy and the poos are very firm and easy to clear up.
I have just reared a litter of puppies and they ate their first raw meat at 3 weeks old and were chewing on a chicken wing at 4 weeks old. I think most dogs are like mine and really enjoy raw meat. I assume you have a lurcher - I would almost guarantee that if he/she caught a rabbit it would be eaten very quickly if you didn't recover it in time :)

>And to be honest I really can not see why you would feed a dog raw chicken etc Its seem disgusting and I cant see that they would eat it !!

The concept of feeding domestic dogs a diet of raw food was popularised by an Australian vet (yes, really!) who pointed out that it's not natural for dogs to cook their food - they hunt it, kill it and eat it, fresh and raw! So he (google Ian Billinghurst) based the diet on that premise; Bones And Raw Food, also known as Biologically Appropriate Raw Feeding. Basically it means feeding animals what their species evolved to eat.

Dogs eat it because they adore raw meat!

where have you been?  LOL  its very widely fed now. I swopped my lot over earlier this year and whilst I still use a grain free kibble as a back up it is very rare that I actually use it.  My lot love their raw and are queuing up by the kitchen waiting for it, something they never did on kibble.

Hi

If you're interested in some background reading:   I like Tom Lonsdale and Kymythy Schultze for good common sense advice

Lol! Well you wouldn't think twice about a horse eating grass, a snake eating chicks from the petshop, a lizard eating crickets, a farm cat hunting and eating rodents and birds... So whats so wierd about a dog eating meat and chewing on bones?! It is the natural way. We humans are advised to avoid eating processed foods and so many people try and do the same for their dogs :)  

I raw feed all three of mine and I have one toy breed one gundog and a gsd It would take a lot for me to change.
To answer someof your questions raw is not disgusting to your dog its natural. Their digestion is made to deal with raw meat and bone do not forget the bones most important for vitamins and minerals  as well as helping teeth and muscles with the chewing and aiding digestion. Dogs also unlike us  are not as sucseptibel to bacterial infections like salmonella just think what the average dog will hapily scavenge.
Plenty of dog behaviours to us are disgusting. I dont lick my bum and guess most us wouldnt either for example :)

You do need to research and remembr their are diffserent ways to feed raw. I only feed meat fish and bone some believe carbs ie cereal fruit and veg should be included. It is your interpretaion of raw feeding that is th difference. Either way the diet must contain as wider variety as possible.
My dogs have fish whole if possible , beef , lamb, chicken ,offal turkey rabbit and venison all parts of the animal and as chunky as possible I prefer not too much mince to keep what is offered as near as can get to what they would eat in the wild.
I buy in bulk and the costs are slightly less than kibble and the health gains are many.
As a raw feeder I would say my dogs are in better health have stronger immune systems have great teeth lovely coats. I know kibble feeders would argue against that but there is room for both of us here
Another book/ website to look at is Ann Ridyard   she breeds and brings up all her pups on raw from the beginning

I think you just havent been reading about dog feeding for decades think back to before kibble 20/30 years ago dogs were fed on table scraps or similar or on meat. Unless you have an enlightened vet I would suggest you steer away from their comments just yet if you really want to get some balanced veiws on both sides of the discussion. Most vets donot know much about raw feeding, their training doesnt cover it they believe most dog owners cant do it right and in some cases they have expensive kibbles to sell you.
Most vets will put you off before you start your research .
Note I do say most not all before Iupset some people.

I've been feeding raw for about a year and a half now, the dogs adore it, it's a fraction of the price of feeding a premium kibble and they are a lot healthier on it. I can't deny it is a bit more of an effort than opening a bag and pouring the contents into the bowl, but only in that I have to think ahead as to what meat they'll get that day ( you need to feed different types and species of meat to get a good range of nutrients ) and take it out the freezer, and yes, it is a bit yukky but you soon get used to it. I also like to think I'm not having to pay over the odds for some manufacturers advertising campaigns, or for a food filled with cheap fillers dogs have no use for. I do still have kibble as a back up, but I can't see me ever going back to feeding a commercial diet full time.

It costs me £5 for ten large sacks full of raw meat and bones from the butcher, the dogs love it and they stay much healthier on it. :) But no I won't touch it myself -that's what I have a husband for!!

> Plenty of dog behaviours to us are disgusting. I dont lick my bum and guess most us wouldnt either for example :-)
>
>

That is a very good point !! :) I never knew this type of feeding was very popular and had so many good things about it and I guess i didnt once think about their natural instincts !! I may not talk to my vet about it as he does seem very agenst things like that, I told him once i was including some veg and rice into my girls diet and he did not like it !! Thanks for the advice :)

> I assume you have a lurcher - I would almost guarantee that if he/she caught a rabbit it would be eaten very quickly if you didn't recover it in time

Yes I have a lurcher, a very fast lurcher who yes most deffinatly would prob eat the rabbit b4 I gets to it :) Shall I go and talk to my local butcher and see if I can get a deal of him each week??
I no this may sound a silly question, but i really am just learning about this, do i just put in her bowl aload of meat/bone, or do i have to be carefull and check whats in it first?? And what do u feed with, or do u just feed the meat ??

And sorry to everyone else who gave great advice that I have not replyed to theirs personally, I really amwriting to you all rather than one person :) All great advice and I will look forward to looking on the links sent and doing some reading on it. My lurcher can go throgh times of being a very fussy eater, does a raw diet most of the time eliminate this kind of behavour reaccuring??

What I get from the butcher is what he can't sell -chicken carcasses, offcuts, unsold meat at the end of the day (hubby has been known to nick some of the meat intended for the dogs to cook for himself!) so yes definitely worth asking your local one. It varies whether they have any left over or not though, we had to ask a few before we found one that has it regularly. This one has to pay lots of money to get rid of what he can't sell, so us taking it is saving him loads of money which is why he charges so little. Plus he throws the bones in for free because of it, other people asking for bones for dogs get charged a quid a bone.

If you are interested in this diet. First do your reading
A lot of people start off with chicken and maybe chicken wings and then build up from there. YOu could try a couple of wings as treat or exchange one of his meals for raw to begin with.
I have misplaced the approx amounts to start off with from memory an adult dog regardless of breed should be having apporx 2% body weight per day in raw food nothing else. After that you feed as you would yourself too much you get fat too little you get skinny.
Also if poo runny add more bone if poo too hard add more meat to the balance. Be prepared that with raw you have less poo to clear up becasue the dogs body uses more and it is less smelly and usually firmer. Mine only usually go once maybe twice a day. Can also help with anal glands and kkep them clear
As I said in my post I feed raw meat and bones not carbs others do include veg fruit and grains your decision after you research. I could explain the reasoning behind the differences but think it may be better for you to look at those links first.
Sainsburys frozen basics chicken bits are a good place to start what you dont use for the dog your can cook for yourself !
If raw bone is too scary to start with pah or many other pet shops do frozen with minced bone but aim to get on to chunky bits and bones asap.
Uncooked chicken bones are springy not brittle just check your dog is actually chewing them not wolfing them down whole. If he does try to swallow in one go either bash with a hammer first ( the bones not your dog lol) or hold one end as he chews to slow him down.
Seriously your dog does not need manufactured food at all and ideally both should not be fed together as they digest at different rates which can be a problem for some dogs.
Some dogs remain fussy whatever others yes change once on a raw diet. my pomx was one of those now eats everything

Its all very interesting but at the same time quite scary (does that sound weird??) i guess that its just new. But I have always been told never to give a dog a bone off a chicken as they often get stuck ?? Is this just an old wives tale or something??? But i would want to do what ever is best for my girl, so I will deffinatly be doing some much needed research on the subject and then decide one way or the other what I will be doing :)

> If you are interested in this diet. First do your reading

I second that - the research is crucial.  Kibble is very easy as the nutritional decisions have already been made for you.  Incidentally do you still have your dog on puppy food?

Also take the time to be be honest with yourself about why you are doing it.  I feed raw and I'm very happy with it for me and my dogs but it doesn't suit everyone and won't necessarily fix a fussy eater.  I'd be inclined to tackle that aspect of her eating first and wait until after you've gone back to work before deciding.  You will need a little more prep time, good hygiene for handling raw food, and a lot more freezer space...

Chicken bones become brittle when cooked and will splinter. So do all bones to some degree which is why chop bones etc should never be given to a dog once they have been cooked. When raw they are fine.

> But I have always been told never to give a dog a bone off a chicken as they often get stuck ?? Is this just an old wives tale or something

RAW bones are fine - DON'T give them cooked bones :) :) :) I've been feedng raw for 12 years without any problem. Both my two devour everything that they are given. One bonus is that their poos are smaller and firmer than on kibble and I can probably count on the fingers of one hand the times that they have ever had an upset stomach :) :) Don't give just meat, mine get raw eggs (shell included), raw fish, tins of pilchards, etc plus bits of fruit and veg (plus, I'm afraid, small quantities of human leftovers including curry and chilli). If either of mine refused their food I would take them straight to the vets as they would have to be really ill :) :) :)

Stuck , splintered bones is not an old wives tail but usually applies to cooked bones. There have been occasion not often when an uncooked bone causes a problem but my personal feeling on that is that there are risks in everthing including kibble feeding ie there is some evidence that bloat is rare in raw feed dogs. The risk is low
I take that risk on board along with throwing balls for my dogs (choking risk)
agreed daisy except the extras you including are just that extras as I have them. I am a newbie to raw only 4 years :) and agree if my dogs turned there noses up I would know they were ill

As others have said this is not a method of feeding to suit everyone.  It takes a bit of time researching, finding and keeping suppliers, preparing, portioning and probably finding space for an additional freezer.
I think you have to ask yourself, with work and a young child to occupy you, together will the other needs of your dog in terms of training and exercise to fit in on your hours off whether you really want to take this on.

Thanks every1 :) As you have all pointed out, yes there are also dissadvantages and so I will not be switching just yet (if i do at all) and will do loads of research and wait untill i believe the time is right and sort all out first. I think I will also talk to my vet, as I do actually value his opinion.
Doga a babe - no I have not still get her on puppy food, she seems to enjoy the adult food better and I have had no probs with upset stomachs or runny poo's with her on the adult food.
Does any1 think it will be a good idea to try her on a chicken wing as a treat once a day ?? See how she gets on with that and then see if it causes her any probs. Or would that maybe make her less inclined to eat her dog food at dinner time??

> I will not be switching just yet

If are are not comfortable swithing completely over to a raw diet, you can swap some of your dogs food with some raw. My dog was fed on kibble and raw tripe (not tripe form the butchers - that has been bleached & washed it's of no nutritional value, you can get frozen tripe from pet shops).

There is quite a selection of frozen raw foods available form pet shops if you want to avoid bones and fancied giving your dog some raw food. You can get beef chunks, minched chicken, tripe amongst other things.

Yes, lots of people who don't feed raw exclusively give chicken wings for a treat.
Personally I cannot bare to buy factory farmed chicken products so mine had to make do with the wings cut off our free ranger so that was generally just once a week.  You could try cutting one off your dinner (before it is cooked!) as see what she thinks :)

Just be aware that dogs often find the taste/texture of raw meat strange to start with :) My older dog would sometimes just play, curiously, with raw cubes of chcken breast and the first time I gave him a chicken wing he swallowed it whole, then regurgitated it, then proceeded to chew it :) :) Do persevere :)

Mine wouldn't touch chicken wings when I first tried them, but I took a tip from the BritBarf web site and flash fried the wings ( this has to be done VERY quickly so only the skin is browned and not the flesh or bones ) they were dead keen on them after that.

good advice celli I didthe same with offal

> good advice celli I didthe same with offal

Mine weren't keen on raw liver, so I blitz it in the food processor with raw carrott and they love it :)

My dad has/always has had Norwegian Elkhounds and they've never been fed kibble, always raw. They even get the guts of the moose that's just been shot, yum!
So for me raw feeding was a normality until I came over to UK and was convinced by vets that kibble was the way to go [young and gullible that I was..]
After I lost Archie for cancer I started looking into it again, decided to go for it and have never looked back.
I have Barfed for a while now and my last two puppies have been on raw from 8 weeks. The difference in them compared to the others that were on 'top quality kibble' is very noticiable.
Being a large breed they've had no growth bursts instead they've grown/developed all over and they've also been less hyper which is not a bad thing!
It took my older dog a bit longer get used to the bones because I truly believe that if dogs only ever eat kibble they don't know how to chew and will need some time to learn. Now she goes through lamb ribs like they were soft chews.
Gorgeous coats, no doggy smell, no bad breath, small poos, clean teeth, no drinking/beard wiping every 10 minutes! Plus you can never convince me that what mine have now, is not better than a dry food that has a 2 year shelf life..
I don't care what other people feed their dogs it's their business, but I will not feed kibble unless circumstances change and I absolutly have to.
For me the proof is in front of me every day and in non existing vet bills.

I have just spent an interesting half-an-hour plucking and dressing a wild mallard, shot by my sister's neighbour and given to me (gee, thanks sis....lol). The breasts are now in the freezer but the rest belongs to the doggies, apart from the wings (too much feather for very little return) and the main innards (apart from gizzard and heart). So you can be quite adventurous if you have the resources and/or are brave enough.

Nice to see you here, Miss Finn! ;)
I can agree fully with her, I've seen pictures of her dogs and they're in superb condition, especially her young pup who was positively *gleaming* in his last photo update!

I've fed raw and the results were excellent; great coat, great skin, a litlte more energy than needed due to high protein. I switched when my bitch was gearing up to her pregnancy/when I went to Australia for a couple of months and my mother couldn't stand feeding raw.

It's easily the cheapest diet I have fed, and the most satisfying. Mine ADORE it. However, I'm on the fence about it due to so many websites scaremongering both sides of kibble and raw. I want to feed raw again, but it will take a bit more reading and research on supplements (and freezer space) before we start again. I think we may do a bit less DIY next time and buy some ready blocks of the stuff.

In case you are worried about feeding your dog disgusting raw meat...I only ever bought human grade, andi t was still much cheaper. Cheapest meats, cheapest bones, cheapest veg; if you're on good terms with your butcher it's even better.

If dogs were living wild no-one would cook their food for them, they would eat most small animals in their entirety, and the majority of larger animals that is what as a species they re designed to hunt. 

They would also scavenge and supplement their diets with small amounts of fruit and vegetable matter.

One issue for many of us is sourcing enough varied items for a more natural diet at a price we can afford, as of course meat is expensive (waste grains etc are cheaper and is why they comprise the major part of commercial food), and even the parts we don't choose to eat are now used by pet food manufacturers or sold at increasing price with resurgence of interest in more natural feeding.

Another issue is storing raw foods and feeding if we are away on holiday.

I have always been too frightened of bones and whether I would be giving the right amount of food - as well as where do you feed them - raw meat is very smelly and dirty.  However my son's friend came to visit him with his dog and he had left over lamb bones before he went home - which he offered to my dog.  Meg finished all this bone and raw meat and her little eyes looked as if she had been drinking - she was so happy.  Now I too need to do some research - she had lamb bones which I thought would be a big no no - but apparently not.  I was told that she wouldn't eat the neck bones - vertebrae - because they were too hard and that she had hidden them somewhere.  Well they haven't turned up yet!!!  I feel really bad for not giving her this treat before.  However I don't think Tesco's actually sell meat for dogs do they? 

No, Tesco don't but you can get pre-packed stuff in P@H although I think that's quite expensive compared to frozen block meat from a raw dog food supplier. Saying that though, you can get the odd bits and pieces that are on their use by date for quite cheap in Tesco

I go to my local butchers once a week. I get all the lamb and beef bones free. If he has any fresh chicken frames I get them free as well, but he orders me a 10kg box of chicken carcasses once a week which I pay 78p/kg. I also buy hearts, kidneys and liver from him at a very fair price[can't feed mine raw liver cause they get the trots, but I bake it and use it as training treats]
So, basicly it's worth going to your local butchers shop and ask what they can do for you. Mine does pet mince as well, but he throws in pork, which I don't give to mine, so I give that a miss.
He would get me fresh tripe, but I just can't stand the smell so I buy that in frozen blocks.
I'm Barfing 3 Giant Schnauzers, so the amount of food I go through a week is not small, but it still works out a lot less than kibble and after a while you get organized and it doesn't really feel like a chore.
Plus it's sooo worth it ;)

>Meg finished all this bone and raw meat and her little eyes looked as if she had been drinking - she was so happy.

Awwww!   Bless her!  :-)  :-)

I have a lurcher, a saluki and two spaniels. My lurcher and one of my spaniels are on half raw/half kibble, my second spaniel is on all raw (due to allergies) and my saluki is on kibble only (also due to allergies). So I have experience with all ways of feeding really. LOL

I only feed minces with ground bone and for my spaniel also offal ground in too. I don't like giving raw bones other than large recreational ones (marrow bones) as I know someone who lost one of her dogs nearly to raw chicken wings and a second one died from it! I know this is extreme and it is a small risk, but for my dogs I am not prepared to take it - hence only minces for my guys.

I can honestly say that all my dogs are in good health and look great for their age whether they are on raw, half raw/half kibble or kibble only! I think the most important thing is that the diet - whatever type it is - is balanced and good quality (the kibble I use is Taste of the Wild, which is grain free and high in meat contents), dogs can do well on both types and what suits your dog and you needs to be taken into consideration too of course and with that, I feel that neither raw feeders nor kibble feeders should be made feel guilty because of their choices! 

> I feel that neither raw feeders nor kibble feeders should be made feel guilty because of their choices! 

I agree :) and although have been given some GREAT avice on the matter and I have enjoyed reading up on it and talking to loads of different people but I think at this time (due to her being fussy in the recent past) i may stick to what she is on, why change something that is working ay ?? and she is happy atm which is all that matters :) But I would never say never :)
Thanks again everybody

My dogs are fed raw, they have chicken carcass, lamb ribs, marrow bones, lamb and beef tripe and lamb and beef mince, heart, lung, liver, kidney. I also treat them to some pig skin every now and then. Some say don't feed pork, some say it's ok once in a while and others say they feed it often, I feed it every now and then to mine. I also give tins of sardines/pilchards in tomato sauce or oil, and on 'fish days' they will have whole mackerals, sardines etc. One of my dogs will only eat the head of the larger fish unless my Husband plays tug of war with it, disgusting but it's the only way he will eat it. They often have whole rabbits too, sometimes they will have it skinned and gutted, last time they had everything minus head and legs, the ones I have in freezer are whole fresh from the field. One of my dogs goes straight in, the other will poke about as if waiting for it to come back to life, quite comical to watch!
I won't feed anything else to my dogs, Iv been sold well and truely, the dogs love it, they have never looked better their teeth are whiter than white, they have gorgeous glossy coats, I just can't fault it. It's normally really cheap but my supplier is putting prices up day by day. Last order was over £60 for a month for 2 dogs, minus fish and rabbits, but my bitch is expecting so she's eating a fair bit.

And I couldn't help but laugh when you said why would they want to eat it as it's disgusting, my bitch is quite happy to snack on what comes from her back end, now thats disgusting! :)