After a good day showing i was very annoyed that after all the money it cost, that on the way out there was no-one on the gate to check out the dogs,as the public are allowed in i think its disgracful that any one could have walked out with any unattended dog left on the benches,i wont be using the benches no more ,where i go my dog goes:(

Surprised at your comments........ When we left with 3 dogs the security man checked our passes and looked in the car and counted the dogs.x

> any one could have walked out with any unattended dog left on the benches,i wont be using the benches no more ,where i go my dog goes

I don't think dogs should be left unattended on benches - I never do

BUT it was interesting to read, after similar comments about security at Paignton, that no one has ever had a dog stolen from a show.  That surprised me

There was also an underage puppy of 3 months there.

some times you have to nip to the loo and cant not leave them for a few mins, personally i dont leave my dogs alone but it only takes a second for some one to take a dog.As we left the show around 3 oclock , i think security had gone home,which is wrong as dogs were still being judged.

No one checked my removal passes as there was not a soul in sight on the gates...that was about 2pm. People were walking in and out with dogs at will.Why charge for unentered dogs then half way through the day abandon any effort to make sure people did not bring them in...Anyone who had a dog left in the unentered dog tent could have nipped out after luch and brought it in so It does not surprise me that there were puppies in the showground. It's fast becoming a farce and they may just as well abandon the strict "you must have passes" ruling if they cannot be bothered to police it. Many classes did not start till later in the afternoon and those arriving later ust walked in unchallenged.
Aileen

No -one checked our dogs either , could have walked out with anyone's dog !!

Peanuts

I lost my removal order, and they made me hand in my ring number to prove who i was.
I had gone to the secretaries test and told them I had lost my removal order, and was told that I didnt need one to get out!
When I got to the gate they wouldnt let me through, however when the security lady went to check what to do, a few people went though with there dogs.

xx

At many, but not all shows, the camping area is adjacent to the show area so you will often see underage dogs and also dogs from different days walking about

We left about 3.15pm - no security in sight...

we left about 2pm on the first day and no one on the gate and no one took our removal passes

some times you have to nip to the loo and cant not leave them for a few mins,

I wouldn't leave a dog unattended at a show if I was paid a million pounds to do so. There are so many reasons not to. If you're on your own at a show, you just ask the person closet to you if they can keep an eye on your dog whilst you nip to the loo, simple as that. I get asked that by other exhibitors lots of times.

I still don't see what difference removal passes make as the people checking them will not know if they are for the correct dogs or not.

> I don't think dogs should be left unattended on benches - I never do
>

If you show more than one dog and go to shows alone there is no other choice.

If I'm on my own my other show people in my breed will look after my dogs for the two seconds away.  I would never, ever leave my dogs on their own at the benching and in fact usually take them everywhere with me.

We arrived at about 9am, passes not checked, infact the guy at the gate was more concerned we had our parking pass in the windscreen. We left at nearly 5pm, and again, no check, not even anyone on the gate

> If you show more than one dog and go to shows alone there is no other choice

We are lucky enough to have a network of dog holders in our breed!  We hold leads ringside during judging for each other or stand by benches for the 'toilet dash'.

Beyond sometimes standing a bit further down the benches talking to someone, I wouldn't risk my dogs being out of sight.   Some dogs do appear to cope quite well being left but there are always a few that get distressed or are subsequently disturbed by passers-by or nearby dogs, and there are some that are neglected and left without fleeces or access to water.  Quite apart from the risk to the dog I think it gives a poor impression of our hobby.

Slightly off at a tangent ....

We were waiting to go into the group ring on the saturday and next to us was a couple with a small smooth coated, tan coloured dog - they appeared to be waiting too.

Talk turned to 'guess what new import is it now'.
We gave up with my best guess a 'scared witless hund' as it was terrified.
My friend couldnt bear it any longer and asked the couple who proudly declared it to ba a Jack-a-huahua and they were only watching, hoping to see another in the group :-(

We did laugh :-)

OMG Toolz that's soooo funny!  Gosh wonder how much they paid for it as it seems as though they believe it's a pedigree?

> Some dogs do appear to cope quite well being left

I don't think anyone condones leaving dogs on their benches for prolonged lengths of time.

As somene who shows in stakes classes, (occasionally has been BOB, so showing in Group) the ring holders are likely to be at the breed ring or gone home, so there are times that dogs will be unattended on their benches, and we need to feel they will be safe and sucure there.

OMG, those poor people, how did you manage not to laugh in their faces?? Reminds me of the grooming clients who phoned to say they had a Cavalier and a King Charles - when I arrived, they had a rather large long nosed Cavalier, and a rather small but nicely made...... Cavalier!! I did say they were both Cavs, but she was convinced she was right, and at the end of the day it doesn't matter if she thinks her dog is a Charlie, bless her! :-D

No Security when we left on Sunday either not a soul in sight

I too went to secretary yesterday and was told no removal passes were needed after I lost my 2. 

Then as one of the girls had to wait for puppy groups at the end of the day (they finished being judged at 10.40 so was a very long day!) my brother took the other girl off to play in the new forest and him and his gf went for a walk and came back for us.  He then brought the other puppy back in without anyone checking at all and waited for us.  At no point where our passes checked.  I did leave my girl briefly on the bench when I had to nip to the loo all my breed had gone and I just asked someone 4 rows away (that's how deserted it was) to watch my pup. 

The rules as I read them do say that all dogs must be benched at all times when not in the ring clearly they're not strict about this but maybe they should just ditch this rule

> The rules as I read them do say that all dogs must be benched at all times when not in the ring clearly they're not strict about this but maybe they should just ditch this rule

I thought that rule was no longer in place? and that you didn't need to keep them on the bench if you didn't want to?

Slightly off topic but we were on the caravan site so we could come and go through the back door without passes being checked ( should we have desired) What I did object to was being locked in at 10pm, I appreciate the wardens are on duty all day but what if there was an emergency and we had to evacuate or someones dog was taken ill in the night? We felt like teenagers again rushing back from our evening meal before we were locked out.

> I did leave my girl briefly on the bench when I had to nip to the loo all my breed had gone and I just asked someone 4 rows away (that's how deserted it was) to watch my pup. 

I must be a bit paranoid as in that situation I wouldn't ask someone to watch my dog as it might draw their attention to the fact that it is unattended and they could take it!

> I must be a bit paranoid as in that situation I wouldn't ask someone to watch my dog as it might draw their attention to the fact that it is unattended and they could take it!

I think that is a bit paranoid :-)  It's matter of fact, common place, happens hundreds of times at every show that someone you don't know (or don't know well) will ask you to watch their dog or bag while they nip to the loo, take another dog into the ring etc. This sort of community spirit works very well :-)  I wouldn't ask a spectator but a fellow exhibitor is pretty safe :-)

> I wouldn't ask a spectator but a fellow exhibitor is pretty safe

Ditto

RachelSetters - If its not in place that's great I just read it in my beginners guide to dog showing!  If it is still there then they don't enforce it and thats fine with me at my first show i was worried about taking her for a walk even incase I got told off but other exhibitors laughed and said it'd be fine!

I live in my own lovely world where I figure that all dog people are lovely and since they are benching their own dogs I like to think they'd be fine.  I'm sure we're all in the same boat.  I also think that as their hobby is clearly to show a stolen puppy with no papers and distinctive markings in a breed with next to no puppies born each year wouldn't be much use to them. 

There was nothing from the caravan park end, just walk straight in and out with any dog.

I never use the benches and take my dogs ring side as do most of the people in one of my breeds, though not the other one.
As for leaving a dog unattended on the bench, never ever would I do that, there are plenty of other exhibitors about to look after/keep an eye on your dog if you need the loo etc

As this seems to be a very one sided conversation ;-) I will just point out that although many people choose not to bench their dogs and keep them with them, many other people do bench their dogs and do leave them unattended :-)

Possibly they are just too afraid to post that.........

many other people do bench their dogs and do leave them unattended :-)


Yes -and when you have to walk past them they lunge at you, and they spend a lot of time barking and howling...........in many cases anyway!!

I thought that rule was no longer in place? and that you didn't need to keep them on the bench if you didn't want to?

Indeed -I made sure to save the press release about it which is dated 15th of December 2005, so quite a while ago. Quote from it:
These concerns for safety and security of dogs have been addressed with an amendment to Regulation F(1)17.a. to be effective from 01 January 2006.  This will allow exhibitors to take their dogs off their benches so that they may keep their dogs with them whilst they move around the show.  In light of this, the Regulation has been changed to give show organisers the authority to require exhibitors to return their dogs to their benches if, for example, a safety issue arises.

The Regulation has been changed as follows:-

FROM:

17.  Exhibition of Dogs.
a.  Championship, Open and Limited Shows (Benched):-
(1)  Dogs must be present on their benches at all times except
(a)  When being judged.
(b)  When being prepared for exhibition and/or being exercised for a period not exceeding 30 minutes.
(2)  Dogs may be removed from their benches by order of the Veterinary Surgeon, Veterinary Practitioner or Show Management.
TO:

17.  Exhibition of Dogs.
a.  Championship, Open and Limited Shows (Benched):-
(1)  Dogs should be present on their benches at all times except
(a)  When being judged.
(b)  When being prepared for exhibition and/or being exercised.
(2)  In certain circumstances dogs must be present on their benches at all times if required by show management.
(3)  Dogs may be removed from their benches by order of the Veterinary Surgeon, Veterinary Practitioner or Show Management.

> many other people do bench their dogs and do leave them unattended

The question really is whether that's wise from a security perspective and whether it's in the dogs best interest to be left. 

Just pointing out that people do different things, a handful on here commenting doesn't in anyway transmit to what actually happens at shows.

@Goldmali, - no different to the ones being held by the ring that also lunge ;-) Only those ones then drag their owners after them

Of course obviously not the ones in cages with covers all over them possibly happily roasting :-)

@Goldmali, - no different to the ones being held by the ring that also lunge ;-) Only those ones then drag their owners after them

Of course it's different -those dogs at least HAVE an owner attached to the other end of the lead. I've seen numerous dogs on benches almost strangle themselves when they jump off the bench to try to get to a dog walking past, and I've even seen them fall off inside cages -in fact picked one up once, think it was at SKC. Unattended dogs will naturally also guard a lot more than if their owners are around.

> Of course it's different -those dogs at least HAVE an owner attached to the other end of the lead.

Mmmm not sure that is all that effective in some cases.  There could be an arguement that it is safer for all concerned without the congestion of too many dogs walking about or stationed next to the ring.

I am not sure why you are making this into a 'who can scent higher competition' we can exchange anecdotes all night of what we have seen and experienced, but I am off to take my pavlova out of the oven now, ready to take to WKC where my dogs will be benched along with many other peoples ;-)

There could be an arguement that it is safer for all concerned without the congestion of too many dogs walking about or stationed next to the ring.

Well there has been several cases of children getting bitten at Crufts by benched dogs.......No owner around, no owner to say no, don't do that. In any event there is nothing more crowded than the area around the benches at champshows! Simply because how closely the benches are placed to each other and that so much stuff is kept there. And then of course there was Blackpool 2009.....I was out of the benching tent about 5 minutes before it all blew down, and I was very glad I was!

Stray children are their parents responsibility :) and whether the tent over the judging ring or the benches falls down is sheer chance so who can tell where you are better off.

Along the same lines, if you are showing alone, what do you do with your handbag/personal possessions when in the ring - presumably the bench is not secure enough to leave them there. 

Perhaps a naive question but does stealing go on at shows?

Another reason I won't leave mine unattended is I hate to think of them being stressed if they are just left in a strange place alone mine would get disstressed as they always like to be by me, I always try to have someone with me.

> but does stealing go on at shows?

I have never experienced anything or know anyone personally - I don't take a handbag - everything goes in my 'show' bag with grooming staff and treats/bowls and stuff!!!  but sadly it does happen :(

Having said that someone pinched one of my benching chains at a breed show once which left a sour taste in my mouth :(

Thanks for finding the ruling Marianne :)

My old veteran girl will bark on the benches when I'm there....
She's an attention seeker who has trained me well...

So sometimes it's better when I'm not at the benches for
those in close proximity to my benching :)
Or I have to sit with her in the bench.
If I'm not there she curls up and goes to sleep...madam.
If I'm there she wants my attention the whole time and if she
doesn't get it to her satisfaction she lets you know about it..

I'm lucky as we have some nice people benched around me so
we often look out for each others dogs and each other.

We had passes checked going in, but not on the way out, I left
at about 2.45pm on the Sunday.

Have to say that at a recent show I was shocked by the actions of a certain gundog breed. They all had just benching fronts only which weren't that secure, had a big gap where they could get their heads through and if they really tried their bodies.  A number of times a few of them really went for people as they went past especially when excited children went past them.  It was an accident waiting to happen.

We left at 1.30 and there was no one on the gates checking exit passes or cars.

I will leave my dogs on the bench unattended (not for longer than an hour) but boxer folk are always coming & going round the benching and tend to know which bench belongs to who so I never worry about dogs or stuff going missing and I highly doubt Razzle would let just anyone take him of the bench!

I have to say the only time I go to my bench is to collect a ring number. Thats it. Never have never would bench a dog. My breed is not small and I have never yet found a bench big enough for one of my dogs to settle comfortably in. If I were to bench I would want to put a cage in the bench and one that would fit the bench would not be big enough for my dogs. I do use the benching area at cruft for a dumping ground for bags and shopping and as a base but thats all. I take chairs and find a shady spot and set up camp there. Most of the time I am alone and rely on the good will of friends in my breed to hang on to one dog while I show another if I have taken 2 with me. I often only take one so I know I can cope alone. Much as I love my show days I would not compromise my dogs safety by going to a show with more than I know I can manage alone if needs be. I have missed classes in the past if I have gone to a show with 2 dogs and the friend who was going to help me has not arrived  for some reason, so I am left with no one to hold the other dog. Rare but it has happened but only at open shows with few entries in my breed.
Personally I think a cage area would be better and less expensive for the organizers. Then if you wish to you can take your cage and set up your camp as you want it.
Anyway we digress....If shows are not going to police gates then do away with passes etc... save money and cut the entry fee's. I think I am right to feel agreeved that in my £22/5 entry fee I have paid for a few bits of useless paper that no one gives a da** about, it is wasting our hard erned money and that is wrong.
Aileen

The other reason I won't leave a dog on the bench is that there are some not so nice people out there waiting to do things to your dogs if you leave them on a bench unattended.

I have had someone cut the fur off the end of my dogs tail at one show, he wasn't even left alone either :-(

A friend of mine left her boy at Crufts in his cage on the bench alone, he was so secure, I came back and he was half off the bench and the only way for this to happen imo is if someone pulled it off :-(

I'm not so worried about anyone so much as stealing my dogs, more that they 'could' cause harm or do something to them which would prevent them form either looking good or being able to be shown that day..

> I think I am right to feel agreeved that in my £22/5 entry fee I have paid for a few bits of useless paper that no one gives a da** about, it is wasting our hard erned money and that is wrong.

And not doing much for the environment either. We should all be trying to cut down on unnecessary paper/printing :-)

The environmental footprint of a champ show must be huge if you take into account all the travelling to get there. Not printing admission/removal slips might seem like a ridiculously small step, but at least it's a step in the right direction :-)