Have just been looking at the latest yearly BVA data sheet of hip scores http://www.bva.co.uk/public/documents/Breed_Specific_Statistics.pdf

Something that is most interesting is that apart from the overall mean scores they also give a 5 year mean score.

this is very useful to show whether gradual improvement is being made and quite an eye opener.

It is very interesting indeed. Pleased to see Malinois is joint 5th lowest over the 5 year period! On the other hand the worrying part of course is there will always be breeders that don't score so the true picture could be different.

> Pleased to see Malinois is joint 5th lowest over the 5 year period!

I wonder which Malinois it was that scored 60, though!

I can guess MsT!!!! One of the breeders that don't normally score, or stopped after that! Could name several -none of them show people.

The table on page 17 of the recently published Dog Health Group Annual Report 2010 is also interesting to see how the scores have come steadily down in the more popular breeds from 1996 to 2009.
http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/download/10884/doghealthgroupannualreport2010.pdf

However I wonder if all of the apparent reduction in scores is due to actual successful selection for breeding for lower scores. Quite a few other factors may have contributed, such a Vets becoming more skilled at doing the work, better equipment being used over the years, breeders selecting Vets know have perfected the technique. Also maybe less presentation of likely higher scoring dogs as cost have gone up.

What about the dogs whose owners decide not to send the plates on to the BVA once they have seen that a high score is likely? Maybe we could get a more accurate response if the service and cost was presented as an all-in-one package instead of a two stage process, e.g. you present your dog for scoring and the plates are required to be sent off to the BVA with scores registered on the KC health check site.

The other worry for example is in breeds that have taken for granted they don't have a problem, like dobes and too few people routinely score, their mean score is getting worse.

Pleased to see that breeds like Gordons that had a too high mean have really improved.

> Maybe we could get a more accurate response if the service and cost was presented as an all-in-one package instead of a two stage process,

all the Vets I have used have only ever offered the service in this way, if you have them booked for hip scoring the plates go up.

Maybe we could get a more accurate response if the service and cost was presented as an all-in-one package instead of a two stage process, e.g. you present your dog for scoring and the plates are required to be sent off to the BVA with scores registered on the KC health check site.

I agree. I think it's terrible that some vets actually suggest the plates not being sent off. You've got to think of the breed as a whole.

I did have a vet suggest some plates were NOT sent off. I refused and requested for them to be sent off anyway. That dog is now listed as the ONLY high scoring offspring from those parents (in breed records, not KC site) -makes you wonder how many others were never sent off as several are simply down as not having been scored.

I think it's terrible that some vets actually suggest the plates not being sent off

I haven't come across vets suggesting this, but I have come across breeders insisting that they see the plates before agreeing to pay to have plates sent up--what vet will take these people on in an argument?

I believe that owners and breeders should have their dogs scored/health tested to comply with breed recommendations, but most of all so that they don't inadvertently do damage to the dog through inappropriate stress from agility or working. I can tell you that when I asked for my oldest boy to be hip scored while he was under GA for inguinal orchiectomy my then vets were extremely reluctant to do so--"you can't use him to breed from," "why waste money" etc. They couldn't believe it was only about adding to knowledge of the breed. Their reaction was the last straw and I moved on to find a better practice.

> What about the dogs whose owners decide not to send the plates on to the BVA once they have seen that a high score is likely?

If a breed is required to have a hip score before being used for breeding, then an Accredited Breeder would either have to go through with submitting the plates, or else move that dog on without breeding from it. Not of course, a non-Accredited Breeder.

Scoring is something that could be tightened up if the KC had a will to do it. But as they are considering having confidential MRI scans for CM/SM then I guess they will not be tightening anything up any time soon :-(