Lost my confidence is a pup born on the 28/11/2009 still a puppy at a show on the 28/11/2010?

It is entered in junior but I think it is still a puppy - conformation or a put down equally welcome.

Still a puppy, although can obviously go in junior too.

M.

As long as the 28th is the first/only day of the show, of course!

M.

Also eligible for Yearling, being 12 calendar months old, but also still eligible for Puppy, being not more than 12 months old.

Yes

Thanks everyone, I sort of knew I was right but lost my nerve and did not want to give the stewards a bum steer. Had good news just through from the printers, we run a Group Open Show and we have 5.7 per class entry, chuffed.

>It is entered in junior but I think it is still a puppy - conformation or a put down equally welcome.

Is this a class entry you have received?  If the owner has decided to put it in Junior - so not a mistake on their part - the show secretary doesn't change it do they?

I'm just thinking that they may have legitimate reasons for wanting to enter Junior rather than Puppy...

> Is this a class entry you have received?  If the owner has decided to put it in Junior - so not a mistake on their part - the show secretary doesn't change it do they?
>
> I'm just thinking that they may have legitimate reasons for wanting to enter Junior rather than Puppy...

Yes, they may be going in Junior to stay away from something/someone in Puppy & should they win Junior be able to challenge the Puppy class winner for BP in Breed??

Yes, I understand that but when I do the stewards sheets up I let them know the puppies entered in the breed and which class they are in so they can be called into the ring to challenge for Best Puppy in Breed if they are un-beaten by another pup. It was just in this case I did not wish to give the steward the wrong information and although I knew that it was still a puppy I needed conformation because I have known to get it wrong and was having a laps of confidence.

>when I do the stewards sheets up I let them know the puppies entered in the breed and which class they are in

Gosh that's very good of you.  I learnt to tell the steward I had a puppy and even then (probably due to my lack of knowledge) it didn't always work out quite right!  Sometimes we only had breed classes for Grad and Open and people had entered puppies in each which is quite confusing for stewards

I was always told to move up a class from the day. If 12 months on 28th then into junior.

> I was always told to move up a class from the day. If 12 months on 28th then into junior.

You may have been told that but it is perfectly acceptable to go into Puppy, on the day of its birthday(first day of show rules apply).

Wish I'd known this before lol.  One show was on the day so would have been niceto keep here here. 

Can they go the day after?

> Can they go the day after?

If the first day of the show is on 27th & your group is on 28th/29th/30th then yes you are elegible for puppy(or junior if 18mths, yearling if 24mths)

Gosh, how organised of you, I've never been told that at any show I've stewarded at. In my breed you often find an older puppy in Junior so I have learned to check Junior (and often PG too to be safe) for any puppies when I steward, and I make a point of reminding the highest placed puppy that they can come back to challenge for BP, as often they don't know!

I only learnt that this year when I saw it happen, puppy was in junior so able to also challenge for BP.

Recently i saw a puppy win two classes and come placed in two classes.  They then won BP as apparrently they remained an unbeaten puppy as the other two classes were not puppy classes and no pups in them.  Strange and didn't go down well with a lot of people.

It should not cause any problem Best Puppy in Breed, in Group or in Show is chosen from puppies who have competed and remain un-beaten by any other puppy, so why would people be upset.

I like to give the stewards every help I can that way things go smoothly and people are happy to steward another time. Nothing worse than trying to sort out the pups from the small print in a catalogue and at the same time run the ring.

Because in their eyes he was a beaten dog as there were no other puppies in the classes.  I'd never seen this before and thought it counted as normal when you can be beaten in another class so not go in the line up.  I had someone explain it to me on the day when i asked so am now a little more knowledgable on this complicated business lol.  Recently saw a similar thing where the puppy went back in the ring to challenge, don't know the whys and wherefors around it, just know it had something to do with a puppy getting reserve/best of breed then given best puppy.

> it had something to do with a puppy getting reserve/best of breed then given best puppy.

Yes, if a puppy gets BOB/RBOB then it is automatically BP in Breed. Same thing with group 1 or 2 & even BIS/RBIS.

Puppies only compete against puppies for Best Puppy in Breed, being in a class where they are beaten by adults or juniors mean nothing. This puppy was beaten but not by a puppy, it will meet all other un-beaten puppies in that breed and compete against them for the title best puppy in breed. Still at a loss to understand why people would find that somehow unfair as juniors and adults are not able to compete for Best Puppy, that contest is open to all puppies who have competed (in any class against any other of their breed) and remained unbeaten by another puppy.

For example, a pup may be entered in Open against a number of adults, it, the pup, may be chucked out of the class with no award but the steward will call into the ring all puppies who have entered a class and not been beaten by a puppy to compete with one another and in that competition the pup that was chucked out of open may well win this contest. Bear in mind that the pup in the adult classes may be there because of a sibling in puppy or because it has already won a CC and it's owner think it unfair to put it in puppy at an open show, that does not stop it competing for best puppy in breed and to my mind is in no way unfair it is just logic.

We're going to be in exactly this position for Birmingham National with our new baby.  The first day of the show will be Bella's first birthday, so she will still be eligible for Puppy Bitch.

My mentor Jean Walter-Browne, a member of the Steward's Guild, would always have her co-stewards look for puppies in the later classes that would be invited to challenge for Best Puppy, right up to twelve months on the day of the show.