Hi,

A few months ago I did some research into the breed of dog I wanted and tracked down a seemingly reputable breeder.

The breeder in question is the secretary for the dog breed club, had a website etc. I arranged a visit to the breeder to meet the potential parents which went very well. Being happy with everything I paid a cash deposit for a puppy to collect end of August.

I was contacted by the breeder in early July to notify me that there were problems with the birth of the puppies and a limited number had survived but the one designated for me was fine. Another email arrived shortly after with the sad news that there had been complications with my puppy and it had been put to sleep. I was offered my deposit back to be returned the next day which I agreed to.

Since then I've had a number of reasons (bad knee/can't get to the bank etc etc) as to why the deposit has not been returned to me. I've been very patient and have done all the chasing myself, at no point has the breeder proactively contacted me to say there will be a delay. After 7 weeks of waiting I'm reaching the end of my patience. My options are to very publicly "out" this breeder, proceed through small claims court or just write off the amount and forget about it (which I'm reluctant to do).

Any thoughts or advice would be most welcome.

Thanks

Absolutely do not write this off, that is unjust.

As you visited before can you not call again in person?

I agree with chinablue , i wouldnt let this go either , even if you have a bad leg surely someone could post a cheque  for you  , you could always give her your details and she could transfer the money direct to your account , most banks have phone banking these days.
not sure if you could do this but if she is a breed club member she was most likley on the clubs puppy list , maybe the threat of reporting this to the puppy liason officer (if they have one) would spur her on a bit.

I would ring her and ask for the return of my deposit within 7 days and if I havent received it threaten to take further action...did she cash it have you checked ? some breeders dont cash any cheques until the puppies are near enough ready to go .
I dont take deposits not worth the hassle and leaves me in control of my puppies.

oops! just ready it again cash deposit

call the breeder up on GOOD terms and just ask if you have been given your deposit.
a little reminder!!!

There really is no excuse for this kind of service, not only have you ended up with no pup, but no return of deposit.............yet!

The litter was all homed in August so there is no excuse of no money to give you and no excuse for loose ends to do with this litter.

Borrow or use a dictaphone, record your conversation with this breeder and ask her to post you a cheque out for the refund of your deposit, she does not need to travel to a bank, are you telling me she has no cheque book? (I know we rarely use them today, but what a ridiculous excuse.) All she has to do is pop a cheque in an envelope and ask someone to post it for her, if she is not well enough to go to a post box herself then she needs to ask a friend or family member to send one out to you instead and sort things out with them, tell her you are not a friend or family member who needs to be understanding and you will not wait any longer, this was a contract between you, it is broken and sob stories are not what you wish or want to hear, you plain and simply want your money back.

No need to pussyfoot around now, it's past that, you've given her plenty of grace here, your deposit should have been returned immediately no matter who she is.  After you have finished talking to her, tell her you have recorded this conversation and will be going to a small claims court if your deposit is not received immediately, some people just see no other person as important but themselves as this case seems to be, none of this is your fault and her circumstances are not your problem, you need to remind her that you are important and she needs to get her finger out..........immediately! 

> Borrow or use a dictaphone, record your conversation with this breeder

no point really the recording cannot be used, it is illegal to record someone without their knowledge

no point really the recording cannot be used, it is illegal to record someone without their knowledge

Not in this country, as long as not for commercial use, see below: :-)

The law on recording telephone conversations is that it is perfectly legal to record any conversation without informing the other party provided it is not to be used for commercial purposes, in which case the other party must be informed. There is a special dispensation to this for reporters. People who say otherwise have been watching too much American TV, where it is illegal in some, but not all, states. This was primarily about protecting film stars et al. in California.

Where is that quoted from, Carrington?

This site says that it's only legal to record a conversation without someone's knowledge if you are not "intending to make make the contents of the communication available to a third party. If you are you will need the consent of the person you are recording." If you intended to use the recording in court it would be disallowed.

it is illegal to use. meaning if she for example wanted to use it in a court of law (small claims) it would be dismissed

If the Breeder is the Breed club sec as you say, Get in  touch with the Clubs
President  and ask ((him or her))) to bring up this mater at the clubs committee meeting

I think I'd be tempted to knock on the breeder's front door  in person asking for the return of my deposit.
Hope you manage to get it back, after all you acted in good faith...

Thanks for all the replies.

After viewing the parents I moved a long way away from the breeder. I was prepared and much looking forward to doing a long drive down to pick up the puppy. I'm not really willing to drive back down there to sort out the deposit, whilst it is a reasonable sum of money it's a good 6/7 hour journey each way.

The replies from the breeder have been sporadic and here is some text from one I got 5 weeks ago:

"Yes I did get you email but my knee op as caused me some problems and getting onto buses is impossible. Unfortunately the dog money is in my Barclays account which only I can draw on, I do not even have a hole in the wall card for the account".

The breeder is married and had a car in the drive when I visited so I'm going to assume that she has managed to leave the house in the last 7 weeks, just not managed to get to the bank! (yeah right). I try to see the good in people and she was nothing but welcoming on my visit but it does seem to me like she would prefer to keep my money rather than return it.

I think I will go with Starryeyes suggestions and give 7 days for the return of the funds or I will take further action.

Whilst I could get a bit evil (I have come across the contact details of a large number of her friends/colleagues and could inform them of her dishonesty) I would prefer to remain civil.

I'll let you know how I get on. Thanks again for the replies.

I hope you get it sorted!

I have to agree that you can only record her if you first inform her you are doing so 'if intending to use in court'.  

give 7 days for the return of the funds or I will take further action.
I think that is right but maybe 'take the matter further' could sound less confrontational and leave all your options open? :)

>Not in this country, as long as not for commercial use,

In fact I've since learned that the unauthorised recording of telephone calls is itself a tort, meaning the person doing the recording is liable to a civil action against them. So best the OP doesn't go down that route! ;-)

I would contact the Chairman of the Club or as one poster said The President (although they are often just figureheads) are you a member of the Club?

I've also found the breeder listed as club secretary on the breed club page on the Champdogs site.

The breed in question there are not many of these dogs around, I've found the presidents contact details so I'll drop them an email to see if they can be of any help.

says that it's only legal to record a conversation without someone's knowledge if you are not "intending to make make the contents of the communication available to a third party. If you are you will need the consent of the person you are recording."

I stand corrected if the courts are also classed as third party. Third party in the way I have always understood this clause is consumers using recordings for training or used to sell a product without someones knowledge. Or to be used to do some sort of wrong doing.

How do newspapers get away with recording wrong doers and being able to print word for word what is said? All the news........gates we have are from recordings without the persons knowledge, have not recordings been used in courts as long as you can prove it is that person speaking? It is only in parts of America as I've understand this law that it is illegal.

I have never included third party as 'The Courts' they are the Law not a party who can gain from the recording.

However, I apologise if I have this wrong, I would not wish to lead someone down the wrong path, but to be honest I still find it confusing as to how you read it.

Nevertheless, the good news is, it is not needed anyway, the OP has e-mails and hopefully a deposit receipt and bank statements to prove it has never been paid back.

Hope that everything works out. :-)

>All the news........gates we have are from recordings without the persons knowledge, have not recordings been used in courts as long as you can prove it is that person speaking?

In several cases the phone evidence has been deemed inadmissable because it was obtained without permission, either from the people involved or from the Home Office.

I wonder ... were there any surviving puppies in the litter?  Could this have been a scam, and everyone's deposits kept, hoping that people would write them off?  Sorry, I am a bit suspicious sometimes.  Did the bitch look pregnant when you visited her?

@Debussy

This breed isn't very common and it did cross my mind what you mention above or that someone may have offered a lot more money for my pup.

I've sent the following today and will see if this prompts any action:

"I'd like my deposit returned by Friday 11th September either by bank transfer or cheque (details below) or I'll unfortunately have to look at further options to get my deposit back.

It really shouldn't be me doing all the chasing, getting in touch with you every week. If you had a problem sending the money back I'd have expected you to tell me.

I appreciate you've had problems with your knee but 2 months is an unacceptable time to wait for the deposit to be returned."