Are Springer Spaniels not popular show dogs? Both of my two are working bred, so this is a world that I am not getting involved in. I have noticed a general lack of show ESS information, a lot of the kennels, ie. Badgercourt, rytex etc are working, not show, and I find the working gundog world a bit 'closed'. Do not yell ate me for this, it is just an opinion, perhaps it is different in other areas. Anyway, just an idle observation.

Luv Laura and the boys

There are plenty of show Springer kennels Laura but in Springer as in Labrador and Golden, show and working kennels don't mix! Their aims are totally different. The show kennel is looking for beauty just as the working kennel is looking for ability in the field and neither is really bothered about the points which the other is looking for. Shame but there it is! Really, when it comes to choosing a puppy, although I want a working dog I do still want it to at least look something like the breed it is supposed to be! By the same token, show judges should also be looking for show dog’s which at least look as if they are fit for the job they were originally bred for!

As for the working gundog world being a bit closed, to a certain extent this is true. It rather stems from the way a shoot is organised. Traditionally there is a "Them and Us" thought. The guns are all important, they have paid for the privilege of being there. The beaters and pickers up on the other hand are looked upon as the hired help. We are invited by the keeper to, in effect, help make the day for the guns and are "Paid" for the privilege. Paid may mean money, a brace of pheasants or in some cases the reward is just the chance to work our dogs. It's not easy to break into the world of working gundogs. A keeper would need to know that a dog is not going to run amuck or the entire day could be ruined for the guns and even the keeper's job could ultimately be at risk!

Once you have broken into the circle and have proved your dog then the offers of work start to roll in. Joining a gundog club helps get yourself and your dog known, also working competitively in summer working tests. If your dog is halfway decent then people start to notice and someone will offer you the chance to show your skills off.

As I said, it’s not easy but we all start from the same point and with a little effort you will break in.

Regards, John

i agree with that john, i show and as such have PRETTY dogs :rolleyes: , however hubby shoots and fishes etc, for the shooting we have 2 springers kenneled out, as springers go theyre good looking dogs, but nothing at all like their show cousins, but its horses for courses, they do really well and are often called upon during the beating season, hubby also has shares in a few shoots too ,so they are pushed fairly hard, they love every bit of it, tails never ever stop,

Have I seen a breeders web page who shows and works their springers? Seem to remember something.

It is difficult to get into working gundogs but as John says, best place is a club. However, if you live in a similar area to me - there just aren't any. I'm having to marry someone who works for the GCT so I can work my dogs ;-)

Helen

Thankyou for the replies. I do know about the wide gap between show and working Springers. Is it something that is being adressed by some people, or not? Seems a pity that you cannot get 'pretty' working animals. I think both my two are gorgeous (perhaps I am biased? :D ) but even they do not look the same. Jerry has a longer, narrower face. they are both working bred, though I think Tom must have some Show strains there somewhere.
I have got some details of a gundog club close to me and am going to give them a ring.

Anyway, thanx again.

Luv Laura and the boys

If you go right back to the turn of the 20th century just about all pedigree dogs, and gundogs in particular were bred by a big kennel, often own by someone from a military or aristocratic background. The show ring in those days was the shop window for these dogs. Even in my early days you had to indicate on your entry form if your dog was NOT for sale!

The general thought in those days was that you could not get the coats your best dogs torn out in the undergrowth so your best dogs did not work and if a dog was of too poorer quality to show then you might as well work it. Obviously, if a dog was a particularly good worker people would want to use that on their working bitch and so the show and working lines seperated. Now I'm absolutely convinced of "Inherited knowledge" in dogs so to me it follows that if you work generations of dogs that the line will eventually benefit from those generations which went before. From that it's quite easy to see how it came about.

As to people working and showing, At the top level of working in such breeds as Labradors Goldens or Springer’s, No chance anymore I'm afraid. But at a lower level, The Brittany which I believe won the gundog group at Crufts has picked up on a friend’s shoot and the Flatcoat which was BOB at Crufts again is a regular picking up dog on a shoot. I also know of several top show people in Labradors who enjoy a pleasant season in the field! So as you see, there are some out there, they just need finding.

Best wishes, John

My gwp's litter brother did very well in the show ring and he is taken up on the moor. Harvey is a real worker but I don't show him. Quite a good dual purpose litter.

Helen

The dog John mentions winning the gundog group at Crufts was Niriti Brown Hairstreak and is a sussex spaniel. I have also had showbred cockers and a number of clumber and brittany spaniels on the shoots over the years. Including FT CH Riscorgis Fleur De Lis.

Knew it had got a leg on each corner Polly. These foreign dogs all look the same to me! :D

Best wishes, John

Oooooooo wash your mouth out Mr W

Bear is ....... *unique* .... lol

Oop's! I did actually mean through the bottom of a glass of malt. ;)