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Topic Dog Boards / Behaviour / Scared of going for walks.......
- By Msfunshine [gb] Date 01.01.09 12:37 UTC
Hi, I have a 2 1/2 yr old border collie x (I got him as a 'rescue dog' at 6 months old-no history on him) Initially he was an outgoing dog...loved long walks. We live near a train line...and over time he became 'spooked' whenever he could hear a train-even in the distance.I ignored this behaviour-as l thought reassuring him would reinforce the behaviour-but his behaviour escalated and was very distressing to witness-rearing up,bucking,pulling etc. My dog walker and l now cannot get him to walk under the railway bridge near my house regardless of whether any trains are in the area.
About 3 months ago my dog was attacked whilst on his lead (hes never off the lead out of my garden) He was out with his dog walker at the time.Sam was grabbed on his throat by the dog and shaken-sustained scratches by dogs teeth-and my dog walker was bitten on arm....
Since then,Sam has become more and more reluctant to go for walks (bearing no relation to where he was attacked) One day he will walk fine... the next day...same walk... he will point blank refuse to walk and pulls to go back where he's come from fromor worse he heads off in another direction...and l struggle to get him back to the car etc....I have been assertive and calm and continued to walk,but this has resulted in him rearing up,bucking etc... and he has managed to 'slip' several collars AND harnesses-despite them being tight! Obviously then he bolts as he is really distressed-so is a danger to himself and others. This can happen on any walk....anywhere... a new place or an 'old favourite' walk. At the time l cant see,smell or hear anything unusual-and often there is no one/other dogs around...
Obviously lm trying very hard not to 'pre empt' worrying before walks-as l know he will pick up on this-but its hard. At the moment l feel lm not giving him a good life as he wont go out walking more and more. Whilst lm at work my dog walker exeriences the same problems... He has just had a spell in the vets and they found the same problem when taking him out-l had pre warned them about the collars/harnesses and he slipped theirs too... when l collected him he was double leaded....inside!  He has also ALWAYS been calm when going to the vets... never any problem having his vaccinations etc.... But when l took him for his booster 2 months ago-he point blank refused to walk from car to vets... I eventually had to carry him...something I did NOT want to resort to...he then emptied his anal glands once in the room....  :(
He is also scared of men who come to the house/car etc...barks/growls lots...but is ok with 'quiet' men he knows...or ok if he goes to their houses...
I apologise for this being a long post...but... l wanted to try and outline whats happening with us...and ask for advice please...as l want to give Sam as good a life as pssible-and feel lm failing him at the moment...
I have contacted a 'dog whisperer' for advice...not met her yet...but she's recommended reading Jan Fennel-the dog listener...before we meet....?
- By Moonmaiden Date 01.01.09 13:18 UTC
Please don't go done the JF route, her theories are all based on "domination" & this isn't what your dogs needs. I do think your dog would benefit from the T Touch approach

Have you ever taken him to training classes at all ? Do you do any training with him ?

You can get "escape proof"harnesses & these people will make one for you to fit your dog & as they are a "non profit"making group who give all their"profits"to the "smaller"sized dog rescues(as in the rescue being smaller not the dogs ;-) )
- By Carrington Date 01.01.09 18:41 UTC
He has a lot of issues here, forget reading books, you need someone hands on, each problem he has needs a different solution and someone needs to watch your dog and work with him to see what is working and what isn't, with a dog with so many worries here, doing the wrong thing can set him back so badly.

You must be positive around him though, you need to be upbeat around his problem areas to re-inforce the message nothing is wrong or to be feared.

How is he with his basic training, sit, down, stay, walking to heal, retrieving, have you got him trained either by yourself or in classes to these stages, if so why not get his confidence built in joining agility classes, being around other dogs and keeping busy, you could even get him involved by doing basics in your garden.  Along with a good behaviourist with time, (talking upto a year here) you could very well get him to be tolerant of most of his fears, and begin to enjoy his life much more.

It is no good giving a solution without fixing the cause of the fear, (books can't assess that) only a behaviourist will be able to do this. :-)

TTouch I agree will be great for your dog, (you can get a book on that :-D ) and also you must use praise and reward, no negative treatment on this dog at all.
- By Gunner [gb] Date 01.01.09 19:36 UTC
Hiya
I am sure that this can be sorted, so keep calm and make sure that everything you do is considered and not as a knee-jerk panic reaction!  :-)  Glass of wine and chill as Huskygal on here would say!  :-)

Right, is this dog whisperer you have contacted on the APBC list?  If not, why not and what are his/her qualifications?  I'm afraid that ANYONE can call themselves a dog whisperer and that that is no indication as to their expertise or experience.  Soooo..........step back for a mo and just assess.........is this the right direction to go in?  Anyone on the APBC list will require a vets referral to ensure that there is no underlying physical cause.  Sooo....whilst you contemplate this.........in the meantime find somewhwere 'safe' to exercise Sam. Knock on the doors of a few farmers and proffer a bottle of decent malt whisky in return for access to a securely stock fenced field that they aren't currently using that has no public rights of way across it.  You will then be able to burn off some of his nervous energy  and hopefully start to build and cement the bond you have with him through play, safe in the knowledge that you aren't going to be interrupted by any intruders.

If Sam has some calm friendly doggy friends, I would see if you can invite them along too.  You need to build his confidence.  There are a number of issues here: dog v dog interaction; trains/loud noises; vets; confidence in you etc etc.  They need to be professionally assessed and prioritised for the order in which to tackle them.  Noone on an internet forum can advise you, I'm afraid.....we can only offer suggestions and theories.

Good luck and keep us posted.
- By freelancerukuk [de] Date 02.01.09 15:45 UTC
Beware modish monikers. I would tend to avoid anyone labelling themselves a dog whisperer. Go for someone APBC or APDT registered and make sure they have bags of experience. Your vet may be able to help with recommendations.

Like the rest of the posters, I agree this problem is complex and you need expert help.

Your dog may be innately "nervy" and less able to deal with life's pressures, so don't beat yourself up about giving him a good life, you are doing the very best you can. Without wishing to sound pat and heartless, try to be as relaxed and calm as possible. Your dog will feel safer if you are as upbeat and not worrying. Easy to say I know!
- By Msfunshine [gb] Date 14.01.09 14:51 UTC
Hi all
Many thanks for all your help on here,it is very much appreciated  :)  Sam is currently getting over an op on his tummy,so is just getting back to running in the garden again-but unfortunately walks remain a HUGE problem. Once he is completely physically better (hopefully in the next 2 weeks) I will contact someone who is APBC or APDT registered to ask for their help. I've already asked my vet for advice or assistance/recommendations re Sam-but they can't offer any unfortunately. In the meantime l will continue to encourage him to come for a walk every day-tho because of his tummy op,the minute he refuses to walk,I do let him return home-as l don't want to put unecessary pressure on his tummy at the moment . Sadly this can be within minutes at the moment-but when he knows we are going out he looks so pleased and excited.... I wish I knew what was going on in his lovely head..... :)
Anyway.....thanks again for all your advice and support.....l'll keep you posted :)
- By freelancerukuk [de] Date 18.01.09 20:15 UTC
I'm glad you are going to get help from a registered behaviourist, this is the sort of case that needs it.

It strikes me though that this post op period may present a wonderful opportunity to resensitise him to the outside world. Don't do this now but discuss with a behaviourist as soon as you can. My advice is don't wait, get someone to see him now.

My thinking is to keep the walks very,very short. You might think of doing many tiny ones a day. try to anticipate his reactions, that is the point he refuses to walk further because of pain or fear/arousal. If you can, stop each mini walk before he reaches that point of refusal and go home again. You want him to think you are taking that decision, not him, so he is not calling the shots and thereby feeding his phobias. The fact that he wants to go out and is excited is good and you wnat to keep that level of pleasure with him wanting more each time you bring him back. You then slowly build up the length of the walks, tiny steps at a time.

Your expert might say not a good idea, they'll have all the info to hand, and you must take their advice, I'm just sharing a thought with very little to go on and it may be the wrong way to go. I'd really try to get someone on board now.
- By RootyTooty [gb] Date 19.01.09 17:26 UTC
Hi Msfunshine, Your heading caught my eye and I can sympathise with you. I'd just like to share with you our experience with Rufus our 2yr old dog.

Like Sam, Rufus was scared on walks. With him it was traffic. His fear started when he was a young pup and I was trying to socialise him to sights & sounds. We were sat on a bench on a quiet road when a car drove past, not too fast, which absolutely terrified him. He was scrambling like fury to get away. After this he wouldn't venture far from the house, keeping to the quiet side streets. Silly me thought he would grow out of his phobia. He didn't. It became worse as he became stronger. He would walk past parked cars and easily get in them, but 95% of the time when he heard them coming he would freeze then back out of his harness and collar or try pulling me up someone's driveway and I had to carry him back down. It was a pitiful sight.

To cut a long story short, this is to give you hope and encouragement that things can get better. It did for us. We got a vet referral to a super behaviourist who we spent a long time with and asked us to send on a video of Rufus on his walks. Then her trainer came to visit us to experience what it was like walking Rufus. With lots of patience and perseverence, following what we were told to do, I am so happy to say that we now 'go where no dog has gone before' well Rufus anyway!!
Topic Dog Boards / Behaviour / Scared of going for walks.......

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