Hi guys

After watching that "programme" I have been looking at the various tests etc available for when ever we are lucky enough to get another dog.

I was speaking to a number of breeders.

On said because hips are only 25% genetic and the rest what you do with the large breed puppy ie walking them too much or letting them up stairs its all down to the owner of the pup really.  She then said that one of her dogs scored 77 and would still breed off her.  She said she sold this pup to a lady who excerciesed it for miles when little and allowed it up loads of stairs etc.  She said the pups would be fine as its only 25% genetics

The other breeder said she didnt belive in hip scoring as she lost a dog when having it done and also said the same the genetics are on 25% of the problem.

Its a mind field out there and wondered if anyone could give me some advice in lamens terms as to what the scores represent and whats considered as good and bad and if there correct in what they were saying.

Sorry Im a novice in this area, so appologise in advance for my nievity, however Im going to do as much research now as physically posible (it will eb a few years before we get another so got plenty time ha ha)

It is very difficult for a novice as the whole issue could take a three page thread and people still won't agree just what constitutes an acceptable animal to breed from therefore for a novice I would suggest you check on the ABS whether the breed you are interesting in is recommended as having hip scores and look only for breeders that do.  As far as the score it self, again for a novice, it would be much simpler to look for parents that are below the average for that breed.
I think only if you are considering showing and breeding do you really need to look more deeply as to whether breeding from dogs with higher scores are justified in any particular breed due to the other consideration of the gene pool.

Hip dysplasia is considered polygenic and multifactorial - ie a number of different genes involved, and also outside influences like diet, growth rate and exercise. Personally I would say that hip scores are an important factor - that is why people in GSDs started with doing them in the 70s, and the scheme has grown since then and is encompassed by the BVA and KC. Different breeds have different averages for hips - and what would be considered good hips in a rare breed with a small genetic pool would not be the same as in a more popular breed. But to me the idea of breeding from a dog with hip score 77 is grossly irresponsible and the explanations sound like excuses.... if you have a look at the highest breed average on the link Isabel has posted, you will see that it is well below 77.... (ETA the average is BMS).

I think the table on the American OFA website comparing the various methods of hip-scoring around the world put scores into perspective when compared to their grading: http://www.offa.org/hipgrade.html

Basically scores (both hips added together) under 18 would be classed as normal (they grade as Excellent, good and Fair), between 19 and 25 borderline and anything above that would be dysplastic (graded Mild, Moderate and Severe).

wow i wouldnt breed from a bitch if it had over 14 let alone 77!!!

OMG 77 score and still bred from, shocking

She then said that one of her dogs scored 77 and would still breed off her.  She said she sold this pup to a lady who excerciesed it for miles when little and allowed it up loads of stairs etc.  She said the pups would be fine as its only 25% genetics

Yeah, I knew a breeder like that...........very wellknown too. She bred from a bitch with a score of 60, used a "known hip improver" and said my pup would be fine. Well his score is 96...........and I've always been cautious when exercising my dogs as pups. My other scored dogs, from parents with good scores, total 11, 11 and 9. So it wasn't my treatment of the dog with HD that caused it, that's for sure!