Hi. Just curious, Anybody have King Charles? (not Cav,although I love mine)

Sorry not me, although I think they are lovely dogs :-), but the title of the thread did give me a fright!  I thought the Queen had died!

Ditto - glad I'm not the only one LOL!!

No, just Cavs. I've never seen a King Charles outside a show ring, though I meet loads of people that don't realise they own a Cavvy and not a Charlie!!

Yes I know loads of Charlies (owned by CKCS breeders) but don't own one myself. My handy man has 6 of them.
I thought the title of the thread was yet another of those mistaking one for the other but at least it would be better than one I have been  asked for ....King Edwards!!

> ....King Edwards!!

is that a super chubby and slightly potato like cav? :P

Puppies in their jackets!

with butter and salt??

Like LucyDogs, I have never seen a Charlie outside of a show ring - I do like them but I think I'll stick to my cav! I always remember that as a girl, I had a dog book and the Charlie was described as having a face that "only a mother could love" - I always thought that was a bit mean!

While on the subject, are (or should I say were) their tails docked? 

Some were, some weren't & some are born with short/screw tails

Thanks Moonmaiden. You learn something new every day :-)

Yeah, I know what you mean. I have lost count of the times I have been asked for a King Charles when they mean a Cav. I try'patiently to explain the difference.Never mind eh.

I have to admit that Charlies are lets say an aquired taste! Although I confess that I do dislike the Cavs with the longer than prescribed one and a half inches, of which, there are quite a few. Reference tails yes, they were a docked breed but now of course they have to be undocked. Takes a bit of getting used to as they look slightly unbalanced

> Although I confess that I do dislike the Cavs with the longer than prescribed one and a half inch

??????? ! 1 1/2 inch what ? Muzzle ?

>Length from base of stop to tip of nose about 3.8 cms (11/2 ins)

My Joedee would look most odd with such a "long"muzzle, but then he is only 7 kg in weight & is correct in proportion Lou on the other had being a bigger boy looks fine

Xavaine said they did not like to see them longer than 1 1/2".  I don't think they would object to something shorter in a smaller dog :-)

A little OT (hope you don't mind) but.........

I didn't realise there was a difference between the two breeds. Have just Googled them to find out more and came across this

'cavalier king charles spaniels have fur and are average shedders, while cocker spaniels have hair. '

Is that correct?

Cockers should be hands stripped otherwise they look like woolly bears, Cavaliers gaily cast their coats each year

I don't know what they mean I don't think any dog has hair does it   Cockers are perfectly capable of shedding although the hand stripping will reduce it or organise it into a planned event if you like :-)

And how!!

The 'And how' was meant to refer to sheddingcoats in Cavs

what would you describe then as the difference between a king charles and a cavalier king charles ?  I read up on them and found that a king charles is black and tan, a prince charles is tricolour and then you had the blenheim and the ruby./....

You have the same four colour combinations in both breeds, called the same thing too.  The differences are basically the overall size, the King Charles being the smaller, and the head shape.

ok thats interesting - I'm fairly sure mine are all Cavaliers none of them have those squashed/flat faces...

I'm sure they are from the pictures I have seen :-)  King Charles are pretty rare less than a couple of hundred bred each year so I doubt many if any end up in rescue.

Thanks for explaining about the fur/hair :-)

Differences between King Charles Spaniels & Cavalier King Charles Spaniels

1-Size-Cavaliers are bigger
2-Heads-Charlies(as KCS are known)have low set ears, a domed skull between the ears & are Brachycephalic(ie havean almost flat face) Cavaliers have high set ears,flay skull between the ears & have a length of muzzle(around 1.5 ins)
3-Colours-the colours are all named the same-Ruby(Tan), Black & Tan, Blenheim & Tricolour-however "freckling"or ticking on the white is a fault in Cavaliers, but not in Charlies
4-Tails-Charlies were customarily as were Cavaliers originally,however the practice died out in Cavaliers entirely & in Charlies stopped last year. Charlies can in fact be born with shortened &/or screw tails
5-Temperament-Cavaliers should be very outgoing & Charlies are more reserved at first, but both breeds should be friendly

Originally there were two breeds The "Royal"Spaniels-Black & Tan or Ruby & the Blenheim Spaniels which were tan(now called Chestnut)& White. There were very close links between the Royal family & the Churchills(as in John Churchill whose home was called Blenheim he was of course better known as the first Duke of Marlborough) & the two breeds were interbred to produce the King Charles Spaniels(named after King Charles II). The breed fell out of fashion(except for the Churchills who continued with their dogs)& were replaced by Pugs(they looked more"baby"like. Queen Victoria preferred the look of the "Pug"& bred the spaniels(along with ladies of the court)with flatter faces than the original dogs. In the 1920's a prize @ Crufts was offered for the dog that most resembled the original spaniels & this was the beginning of the Cavalier King Charles Spaniels

Those were the old names from the 16th / 18th century I think, king charles, prince charles and all that. Weren't the black & tans 'truffle dogs' once? Must go back and re-read my breed books!

A very comprehensive description. Charlies are quite difficult to breed. I aI have a bitch who at the age of 2years and 7months has had just one season.I  have optimistically booked a stud dog for when and if...
Her mother was 3 years and 5months befor she whelped her first and only litter. She had to have a caesarian and had to be speyed. So I had to hand rear 4 pups. All lived and are stong and healthy now. Mind you, give the girl her due she had 4 bitches

Would you not worry about breeding in fertility issues to your line?  I know this is a rarer breed and therefore sometimes needs must but being involved with another even rarer breed, where much of that is attributed to fertility issues, I think I would proceed with caution.

No I am not worried. Actually when I was speaking of my youngster I realose I have made a typing error It should read,'She has only had one season at the age 1 year and 7 months.' The lines from which my dogs derive from are well tried and trusted. Nevertheless I can understand your comment.