A friend at work the other day showed me a picture of a 4 week old border collie puppy that her friends mum had just had 9 pups all together. She told me today that all 9 of them had been born deaf and blind. They were worried that the pup's where not getting looked after properly by mum that she kept trying to bury them and when the pup's were picked up they just froze in terror. So off to the vet to be told  that dreadful news. The owner did contact the local dogs trust centre and they surprisingly told them if there had been 2 or 3 pups with this problem they would of taken them, but being 9 could not pick and choose which to take and decide which to P.T.S , sadly all P.T.S today.

Just makes you realise what heart ache to be prepared for if thinking of breeding your pet dog.  

In the circumstances it was probably the most sensible decision and I would hope that once mum has recovered from the whelping that she is then spayed aswell. Although I do wonder if this was a merle to merle mating :(

How very sad :(

>when the pup's were picked up they just froze in terror.

Poor things, deaf and blind :( Hard to imagine how frigtening thier short little lives must have been for them. Having them PTS must be the best for them, poor babies :(

That is so sad.
R.I.P. little ones.

Poor, poor little things. :-(

It is a sad fact of breeding that you have to take responsibility for the pups you breed, no matter how hard it may be. I don't think passing any on to the dogs trust would have beena good idea. It sounds like the decision made was the right one for the poor little things.

feel so sorry for them and the mum who knew something was wrong. best thing to be pts, I'm suprized the dogs trust even considered having any of the pups had there been less numbers, they can't home the dogs they have now never mind deaf and blind ones. **shakes head**

I'm suprised they would have even considered having them too......being deaf and blind is absolutely no life for a dog, even if you can find people to care for them. Sad story :-(

I did asked the young girl if there were as you said blue merle. Seems that some of them did have blue eye's but not all of the puppies. The vet told the owner that the dog & bitch had the wrong gene's and was a fluke of nature, that they could breed from her again but not with that same dog. I was very surprised that the dogs trust even considered having some of those pup's too- no quality of life at all. 

Blue merle refers to the coat colour not the eyes, although many do have blue eyes I believe.  Whether they need to have blue eyes to create a problem when breeding two together I don't know but I suspect it will.  Do you happen to know what coat colour they were?

It doesn't always follow that merles have blue eyes or that deaf or blind puppies do either for that matter. However merles shouldnt be bred together as the insidence of producing deaf and blind puppies is far far greater. As to the vets advice :( well I'm sorry I do wish they wouldnt give such advice. I don't suppose they even suggested having the bitch BAER tested either.

No didn't ask her about what colour the mum & Dad are but looking at the photo of the pup it was black & white.  I will ask her monday see if she knows..

This is a blue merle.  Some look very "flecky" but others look almost black and white.  If they are anything like roans I would image the pups would look black and white. Do you think your friend's friend's mum knows not to breed these dogs again?

I do hope they do not breed from her again, I know I would certainly not. I am shocked that the vet told them that it was due to the both dog's being put together and that chance's are it will be OK next time with a different male stud. The bitch was not bothered about the pup's being taken off her so she knew there were not right so at least she hasn't the trauma of missing her brood. It does sound like there are farm dogs as the mum was trying to bury the pup's in the straw - can only assume that mum & pup's were outside in a barn?

It is such a sad situation around this area- Devon as I know that you can buy a collie pup around here for £10.

> I am shocked that the vet told them that it was due to the both dog's being put together and that chance's are it will be OK next time with a different male stud.

Well that would be true and perhaps it was that he said to them it would be OK if not using a blue merle male which would also be true as you can breed a merle to a non merle but it sounds as though they don't know what they doing anyway.

No merle puppies don't usually look Black and white at birth they are born with the merling, with some particular exceptions(Sables and ee reds) where the merle pattern is masked. Roaning is more like the ticking pattern that can develope as some collies grow older. Double merle( merle to merle breeding) however quite often carry a high percentage of white coat.
Edited to add there is of course more than just blue merle to consider.

When I mentioned roans I was thinking cocker :-)

I know Isabel I am familiar with cockers as my parents own them :)

I didn't realise merle to merle could result in deaf & blind puppies?. We have a black & white with with a blue eye, his parents were black & white, Mum had a blue eye, they produced no merles.
I just thought merles were the result in a brown, black, white mix!! Good job we weren't  thinking of breeding. Borders around £10 in Devon!! why so cheap? We paid over £400 for our Border Collie (worth every penny I add hastily!!). He's not KC but ISDS.

I ve got a blue roan cocker, have you ever heard of a "steel roan" in cockers? or are they just dark blue?

Yes, I think some people call dark roans steel, perhaps more in the working fraternity as they do like their imaginative descriptive terms :-) but I think generally if it was a show type it would just be registered as a blue roan.

In very basic terms Merle is a seperate gene to the colour it works on the black coat to produce blue merle or on a brown coat to produce red merle  and when put to another merle can cause abnormalities in the puppies. Eye colour doesn't have to be related but quite alot of merles do carry some blue flecking (mine doesn't :) ) As the Merle gene is dominant at least one  parent must be a merle for a puppy to be a merle.This  is where breeders really have to know what they are dealing with as it explains the merle markings are masked by this colour.Black and white Border Collies with a blue eye just have what's classed as a fault they aren't merles.

Edited to add only a fault as far as the standard goes nothing more

Thank you thats a great help to understand where Jake comes from, great pictures as well.

Yes my cocker looks almost black with a grey muzzle and grey "trousers" and someone asked me if he was a steel blue and I had no idea whet that was, KC he's blue roan but that also covers dogs with a lot more white on, he gets mistaken for an old black cocker and people are surprised whan i tell them he is 16 months. Hardly any silver or grey markings at all, Mum & Dad were well marked and lovely coats, were are still waiting!!

I think you will have a long wait for more markings :-) They never grow more white but darken into maturity.