We are looking for a choc lab puppy in the Kent area. Can anyone give me any details? At the moment we are thinking of a bitch but has anyone any advice on whether a dog or bitch is more suitable for a family pet? My Email is Suemdench@aol.com.

Hi

I would contact the Kennel club, as I am a Golden Retriever breeder and found the kennel club very helpful, in fact I sold most of my pups through them (10 puppies last year).

I find that bitches are more affectionate BUT it depends on wether long term you want her to have a litter, if not then a dog would be advisable.

Bitches do need to have at leat one litter as this stops problems later on in life.

Let me know if you find one

Angie

Bitches do need to have at leat one litter as this stops problems later on in life

Rubbish!! I'm sorry but that is complete rubbish and is a very, very old fashioned idea. There is absolutely no reason for any bitch to have a litter unless the owner intends to breed in a responsible manner.

Fiona
x x x

I have to agree Fi. What's the point in breeding from an average dog? There are so many labs out there anyway . . . .

Well said Fiona, you are 100% correct.

Joan
Take the rough with the smooth

Hi Fi
Too true! What a load of rubbish!
I would say that a bitch should have her first season before speying, certainly not a litter!
I know a lot of people don't even agree with having the 1st season, but I think it is a good idea so that you know your girl is fully mature mentally & physically, particularly in late maturing breeds.
Can you imagine the extra overpopulation problems we would have if everyone who bought a bitch (no matter her quality) followed Angie's advice and had a litter!
Nicky

And what are the chances of all those one off breeders doing relevent health checks prior to breeding, hip scoring costs money

Hi All
Have just run a quick check on this members posts, they only started posting today and already have been v.active with what appears to me to be v.dodgy advice. :(
I just replied to their post on the "Would you sell 2 pup's together" thread.
Nicky

Before we end up with a lynch mob here, can I remind you about the forum Terms of Service.

Sorry Leigh, if my post seems *inflamatory* in any way. :O
I just can't sit by and say nothing when I feel guests are being given the wrong advice. Sorry.
Nicky
P.S. Have edited previous post.

I agree totally with what you say here. There are enough unwanted puppies without having anymore.

One thing though is it the same with dogs as humans ?It was on the news this week that the more babies a human mother has and then breast feeds for a good length of time, then it greatly reduces the risk of getting breast cancer ?

Lucy

Not quite the same Lucy :). The equivalent would be if all women who plan not to have babies had a oophrectomy (removal of ovaries) shortly after their first period the breast cancer rate would be reduced, but I don't think many would opt for that route do you :) But bitches having this route chosen for them by their owners will have no pangs of remorse. Of course in humans not only would the emotional factor matter but lots of early oophrectomies would lead to a huge increase in osteoparosis and heart disease, something that does not seem to affect bitches following a spay.

MMMmmm actually not sure about any increase in heart disease in spayed bitches has anyone seen any research into this?

Well, when I took my Golden Retriever puppy to the vet for her puppy jab, I asked about speying and she said that as Lacey was going to be a big dog, it would be in her interest to let her have one season first and to aim for about when she is 9 months old to have it done. I do not know what to think because I have seen lots of posts here saying that there is less health risks later on if it is done before the first season, and the vet saying to wait. Has anyone got any thoughts on why the vet said to wait? I am confused.

Debbie I don't recall that there have been a LOT of posts claiming before the first season brings greater health benefits, I think most posters have opted for the view that 2/3 months following the first season, or even after a couple of seasons in a large slow maturing breed, appears to bring all the health benefits while allowing the dog to mature physically and mentally. Personally I suspect if earlier spaying does increase the health benefits it is likely to be only slight. Another option is to not spay at all, balancing the slight risk of pyometra or mammary cancer together with the inconvenience of unwanted suitors (not always as bad as you think) with the risks of major surgery....but now I'm making life even more complicated for you :D

This may be going off the mark a bit (leigh if you want me to start another thread that's fine)..but is there any reprocussions (Sp?) in a bitch that hasn't been spayed???

Not sure what you mean Natasha There will remain the risk of pyometra and mammary tumours and I suppose the risk of an unwanted mating although of course that can be prevented from coming to fruition of course.

Sorry Isobel, didn't word it very well :D

What I meant to say is that I have a bitch that I am not going to breed from, and she is at the moment entire. I just wondered what the pros & cons were for either getting her spayed or not. i.e, if she is happy (entire) should there be any reason to have her spayed??

If this makes any sense!!!

If you look at my reply to Debbie, Natasha I think I have covered most of the pros and cons. There could be changes to coat but personally that would not figure very highly in my decision. Change in temperament might be an issue but I find bitches can shift a bit in temperament one way or the other as they age anyway it would be very hard to say how it had affected an individual. Thats all the points that I am aware of, maybe others would like to add more.

Must say I'm one of those who believe you should spay before the first season. Why put your girl through a season? I don't believe at all in the theory that spaying early means the dog will not fully mature. As you British say "What a bunch of rubbish!".
If the regular pet owner were to take the advice of waiting out a season, I can only imagine how many accidental matings would occur. The fact is a lot of pet owners know squat about a bitch's cycle and aren't capable of the dealing with it (protecting the bitch from suitors especially).

Carissa

Carissa,
We're in the minority on this board that believe altering is done best before the first cycle :D :D It's ok. :) We're both a product of the Spay/Neuter campaigns of the US that have been going on for at least the last 15-20 years to combat the huge amounts of strays and unwanted pets that abound throughout the country. Many households have happy healthy bitches that were spayed at 6-8 weeks, plus older just before their first heat cycles. They go on with long-lived normal lives.

But regardless, it is perfectly acceptable to disagree when it's exactly 'best' to alter, if ever, on the forum. Everyone is entitled to their own experiences and opinions. Reproductive matters are never one sided :D :D :D I just think that if an owner has never dealt with a heat cycle, reading versus actually living through one is a complete shock :D :D Preventing an unwanted pregnancy is crucial. Silent heats are even harder to do that with. :(

Important to Note the one singular point that we here on the board all seem to agree on: is that a bitch DOES NOT need a litter to be healthy, or 'fulfilled' or 'complete.' This is a myth that will not end. It seems to perpetuated within all areas of pet ownership -- breeders, vets, neighbors, relatives, etc.... grrr

Not saying everyone within these realms are spreading it. To the contrary, just few enough are emphasizing it to continue the myth :( It just won't stop. :rolleyes: All a load of rubbish. Well put, Fiona!
toodles

Hi Bumble, bearing in mind some bitches may come into season at six months, would you therefore be spaying at say three to four months?That is far too early in my opinion I know that dogs are fairly quick to mature but I would advocate spaying AFTER the first season, just my opinion :) (and Im all for spaying and nuetering)

Thanks Isabel

Natasha

Natasha,

type 'early neutering' or 'spaying' into the search facility at the top of the page and you will find hundreds (slight exageration) of threads on spaying be it early,late or never :-)

Thanks Leigh

Natasha :D