Well, before my last post (asking for opinions on Markus Muehle food) vanished, someone suggested that I should buy a bag of it and try for myself. So I did just that. Easy to order from Zooplus, and came very quickly. It looks very boring - muddy brown colour, but the dogs absolutely love it.

These are the contents: Poultry, whole grain rice (broken down), whole grain corn (broken down), game tripe, game bones, beets (no carrots due to possible red pigmentation in hair), ocean fish, maize germ, fresh green herbs, bilberries (heidelberries), egg yolk, plant oil mixture (cold-pressed), wild salmon oil, Jerusalem artichoke, algae mixture, trace elements, vitamins.

As I wrote before, I'm still trying to get my head around canine nutrition. I think this looks quite good, but I'm not quite sure about the beet and have never come across bilberries and artichokes before. Does anyone have any opinions on its appropriateness? My dogs eat anything - but I still don't want to feed them rubbish!

Well one thing you have to look at is although the 1st ingredient/largest amount appears to be Poultry/Protein the next 2 are Carbs and they are split so wat you find is that this type of food remains top heavy in carbs. 

It takes a wee while to read through the smoke screen on complete foods.

Have a little look her some of the comments explain things quite well.

http://www.dogfoodanalysis.com/dog_food_reviews/index.php/cat/1

Thanks for that Blue. Perhaps you can answer a question for me? I have terriers which are pretty energetic to say the least, and can be quite sparky. They get plenty of exercise as I work with horses and they are with me all day. I thought that dog food was like horse nutrition - ie, if you were to feed a child's pony on oats rather than nuts you would end up with a hyped-up lunatic - but I've read that this isn't true, and that the protein content does not affect behaviour. Experience tells me this doesn't seem to be the case. A high protein food really hypes them up. But is it in fact that the lower protein food is higher in carb and that leaves them feeling sluggish (like us eating burger and chips rather than steak and salad)? What I'm trying to find is a quality food that balances decent protein without making them too manic. I'm also a bit worried about extruded foods as I have read that the manufacturing process could possibly be carcinogenic, and having lost two dogs to lymphoma in the past I'm a bit paranoid about that. I tried Laughing Dog, which is baked rather than extruded, but they were like a pair of coiled springs on that. I've also tried Burns, but it really didn't suit them, we had a week of vomiting bits of undigested food and what looked like fermenting bile - not pleasant (added to which they really didn't like it!)

Hi I am no expert on food , tent to avoid the food threads really. :-)   I just crawl though the review sites etc and form my own opinions :-)    I cant really honestly bare the food experts on most forums to be honest a lot seem to just regurgitate what they have read without much substance or their own experience of a product.   Like wise the food manufacturers also ..   Not helping much am I lol :-)    Last year at Crufts I stood for 5 mins and listened to someone at the Burns stand and thought they were talking a lot of tripe but some like it :-)  For me though the higher the carbs and larger % of fillers the cheaper a product should be.  

I used to think too much protein was also a problem till I started to do some reading AND experimenting and I realised "real" protien is what dogs need and it should be the highest % in their food.  The dog food people are fly though they group things into protein that I personally don't think should be there.  Ie Corn etc and they also split the carbs into smaller groups so it looks like there is less but if you look at it closer when you have added  the 20% and the 18% and the 12% what is the other 50%??

There are some food some would say is rubbish but some dogs seem to do well on.    I went away from complete foods solely a long time ago infact about 10 years ago with my last pet boxer who used to be sick in the morning a lot, when I put her on a meat, RMB diet etc she was better almost overnight.

I find some dogs seem to keep weight on more with some foods than others. With a multi dog house hold now and relying on help from others to look after them I now do a bit of everything and do use some complete as part of their food.  If I am away at shows or working for a full day etc it is a bit easier for me to use some simple foods so that My OH or my mother who helps a lot won't get it wrong or get stressed out. :-)

Off the top of my head in my dog fridge/freezer I have various blocks of meat, mostly tripe and lamb though, trays and trays of chicken wings/thighs.  I was using Royal Canin as a breakfast and had done for several years but something has definately changed in it recently  perhaps since it was bought over so about a month ago I started to use Orijen after a bit of research on it and being honest I  have found that very good. 

I tend to give a mix of everything above and vary it day to day.

Not sure how much that helps :-)

It helps a lot - thankyou!

I've looked at Orijen, and I think I may try it. I was worried about the protein level for my hooligans, but I think what you say makes sense - although there must be ingredients in some foods that make the dogs more hyper (it's not colouring agents and similar things because I'm very careful to try and avoid those).

Still I'm continuing with this Markus Muehle until I've finished the bag - the dog's love it, their coats look good and they have plenty of energy without being silly and argumentative. 

My personal, completely untested theory is that dogs that are "hyper" are healthy dogs.  They may just have too much energy for the typical household so they are labeled as hyper.  Putting them on lower protein food means that they actually do not have enough fuel for their bodies and the effect is that they are less hyper - but the reality is that their bodies are malnurished, so compared to their normal state they are slowed down to a crawl. 

I think  you are right, I have some hyper and some so laid back , I think it is their make up.. :-)

Putting them on lower protein food means that they actually do not have enough fuel for their bodies and the effect is that they are less hyper - but the reality is that their bodies are malnurished, so compared to their normal state they are slowed down to a crawl

I think I know what you are trying to say, and there's some truth in it, but the way it comes over is rubbish :rolleyes: My dogs are fit, and certainly not malnourished, and they never 'slow down to a crawl' However, on some foods they can be extremely noisy and argumentative - just like kids really - and what I'm trying to do is ensure that they get a decent diet, but one that doesn't 'hype them up'. Coming from an equine background I know that some foods, eg oats, do affect behaviour in horses. Is it the same with dogs? It would seem that it isn't necessarily protein levels that affect behaviour. What I'm hoping is that someone can suggest the sort of foods that are perhaps best avoided (apart from the obvious colourings). Some foods seem to have a higher metabolic rate than others. Obviously a 'burger and chips' diet won't give the same level of health and fitness as 'steak and salad' in humans, and I presume that something similar applies with dogs. But even those who live on steak need a little carbohydrate occasionally :)