Dont know if I am being naive, or just plain gullable, but I have just received two breed record supplements from the Kennel Club, and many many bitches are being bred from twice in a 12 month period, this seems to apply to most breeds to a greater or lesser degree, with GSD's being the most obviously over bred (in my opinion) My query is this, I had always understood that the KC would not register puppies to a bitch under 1 year, over 8 years, and not more than 1 litter within any 12 months, unless written authorisation had been obtained from the kennel club.  A lot of the GSD's bred from at their next season had previously had very large litters and gone on to have another large litter, so only one or two puppies born first time was not the reason for a subsequent litter so soon.  As I say perhaps its me being the dummy, but surely if the kennel club is there to promote the wellfare and wellbeing of all dogs ( as they proclaim on there website)  why are they encouraging this overbreeding by allowing greedy xxxxxxxx to register there litters,  I feel sure if litters could not be registered unless they conformed to a code of conduct, and there fore less money asked for a puppy without papers the owners would perhaps not be so ready to use there bitches as breeding machines.  The sad thing is there are so many of these discrepancies in the BRS that it cant even be said that it is just the occasional breeder.  Rant Over

It's only licenced breeders (those who produce 5 or more litters in a year) that are banned from registering two litters within 12 months from a bitch.

The one litter in any 12 months from a bitch only applies to  breeders that are required to hold their councils breeding licence. The KC did introduce it for all breeders at one stage but found they were recieving a vast amount of applications for prior authorisation.

guessed i was being a dummy

I still think it should apply to all bitches regardless of whether the breeder needs a license or not?   What justification is there for registering 2 litters within a 12 month period?    There's lot of cat breeders out there who limit their queens to 1 litter a year and cats are far more prolific breeders than dogs, the GCCF will register a litter every 14 weeks from a queen so it is permissible to breed frequently from cats however all the reputable breeders I know, wouldn't.

Surely a bitch of a non-licenced breeder will need the same time to recover than a bitch from licenced breeder :rolleyes:
Or do these two types of breeders have somehow different bitches?

edited to add I realize it is probably there to stop licenced breeders breeding and breeding from their bitches out of every season.
Surely somebody with just one or two bitches is more likely to do this as they do not have the choice of bitches a larger scale breeder will have( ignoring the puppy farming industry here as surely just being licenced breeder does not mean you are irresponsible).

If a bitch has a very small litter on January 1st you'd expect her to be plenty fit enough to whelp another litter on December 31st. That could even include having a clear season between matings.

But could the special premission be used here?
If you only get few pups I agree the bitch is likely to be fully recovered within  year.
After having a small litter surely you woud then know you might want to breed again sooner than later and could put the application in.

And there's another point as well as a bitch possibly having a litter of just one pup: she can have a litter just days away from being a full 12 months. I had a litter born on the 26th April 2005 and another from the same bitch that ended up being born on the 24th April 2006. I.e. less than 12 months but only by 2 days. Had I had to wait another six months, the pups would have arrived at what was for me then he wrong time of year, and there were also several reasons for not waiting 2 years. Obviously when you mate you cannot predict if pups are going to be born a bit early or a bit late, and it would have been awful to NOT be able to register a healthy litter from healthy parents just for the sake of 2 days. This is the problem -each case can vary so much. A licensed breeder is more likely to abuse how often a bitch is bred from -lets face it, how many of us not licensed breeders would breed 5 litters a year?! How many good breeders at all would? But how do you stop the NOT responsible and NOT licensed from breeding with just 6 months in between? I have no idea. :(

As mentioned the GCCF doesn't have a particular rule here for cats, BUT I do know that if somebody registers too many frequent litters from a queen they will send that breeder a warning.

Controversial though this is, I feel that I am going to be in the same position fairly soon!  I have a girl, who I consider to be probably the best I own (as far as bloodlines go.)  She had her first litter at the end of January this year.  She has obviously had a season since then.  I discussed bloodlines with my mentor of this particular breed, and he advised me which dog he would use for the second litter.  She is now in season (a little early), and I have provisionally booked the dog.  It does mean that by the time she is ready, I am likely to have a litter a week or two before the 12 months is up.  I really, really want a show pup out of this girl.  So far so, that I intend to run on all pups that she produces.  It may be two or three, which would be normal for the breed.  I didn't make the decision to breed twice in less than 12 months, but she had only 2 pups in January, she whelped easily, was an excellent mother, and she is fit, healthy, and in super condition.  By the way, I am not going to be breeding her like this for the rest of her life!  I would be mortified if the KC wouldn't accept registration of this litter.

I think that having put the rule in place in the first instance, the KC were a bit rash in completely rescinding it. The 12 month rule introduced all manner of problems for responsible breeders, but a 10 month rule would probably have taken most of these out of the picture and reduced the applications for exceptions greatly.

Difficult, as those of us who breed responsibly would give a great deal of thought to breeding at consecutive seasons, but the rules need to cover those who would give it no thought at all.

M.

The GSDs you see being bred every season are in most cases puppy farmers or BYB IMHO. I guess you won't have seen the Gundog BRS if you had you will realise that it is not GSDs that top the number of puppies being bred. GSDs are not a particularly overbred breed when you compare them to Labradors who have over 45,000 puppies registered every year & most people in the breed reckon an equal number that are not KC registered. Also Staffordshire Bull Terrier & SBT crosses now out number all other breeds that go through Battersea Dogs home which is a good indication as to what breeds are over bred

The problem is in the UK all you have to do to breed is have a bitch. Regardless of whether it is KC registered & then when in season get it mated & lo & behold you are a breeder. Even with KC dogs there is a restriction on only one breed the Irish Setter, they have to be DNA tested CLAD clear before the KC will register puppies from them.

The whole issue of being able to become a dog owner should be overhauled IMHO & owners should be licensed BEFORE they are able to obtain a puppy/dog, but that is a whole different ball game

I've not received my BRS as yet to look at numbers etc within my breed - but what annoys me more than anything is that some KCAB are also breeding every season!  I have taken this up with them and they say that it's ok!!  I suppose it all boils down to each person being comfortable within their own breeding 'practices'.  If I have enquiries for puppies and cannot help, I will always give them numbers of like minded people to me and tell them what to look for in a breeder that cares about their bitches.

I think this topic is more relevant to those who has done back to back matings from their bitches rather than those 2 days off of whelping within a year.    Regardless of how many puppies a bitch produces she has still gone through a huge hormonal & physical change to her body within the space of 9 weeks (+ several days if you include the time from beginning of her season until mating) and then the subsequent weeks she has rearing her puppies afterwards.    

You could be looking at conception to weaning taking a lot out of her over 4 months and then she is put back through this 4-6 months later.

The Kennel Club allow two litters to be registered from a bitch with a five month gap between! They could at least make the time between litters registered up to say 9 months to stop this sort of thing from happening, and that should reduce the applications for special permission problem also cf when it was 12 months. :)

I do know of a lady who has a breed that regulary have to have the pups out by ceaser and she had 3 litters back to back , all were registered with the KC, the KC did not query it just took the breeders money!

Peanuts