Only here to add my best wishes that the poor boy makes a speedy and hopefully full recovery, everything crossed.

Poor piglet, stones are so painful - so I was told by a boyfriend who frequently got them. (too much milk for him). I found this site that may be interesting and I think they may even do low purine foods. While you might not want to ship from the US the list of ingredients may be of interest for home meals. Then again the dollar in the proverbial toilet so 1/2 price today. I'm so sorry JG, it's a horrible thing to happen. You try to do the right thing by your dogs and it backfires.

Big hugs and healing thought sent up to the brave boy and his mummy.

Edited to add - I forgot to mention, there were a lot of breeds on that page that are predisposed to stone formation so it's not just Dalmatians.

There are some great links everyone has suggested. :) My printer's been working overtime churning out the pages so I can take them along to the vet and we can work out a diet together. Thanks everyone! :)

Hi JG,

I'm really sorry to read about Piglet but so relieved for you that he's improving - please God he will make a full and speedy recovery and his day to day management will be easier than you presently imagine.

Although I can fully understand your upset at the moment, as far as I'm aware there is no "Dalmatian specific" commercial diet on the market so to lay blame on those advocating natural / raw foods is surely no more appropriate than to lay blame on Waltham, Hills, Nestle Purina et al?

If a breed has specific dietary requirements or no-go foods, surely it is the responsibility of the breeders of such breeds to be fully aware of same and ensure that their inside knowledge is passed on to everyone they sell a puppy to? 

Equally, don't you think one could reasonably expect the veterinary profession as a whole to be aware of common potential dietary problems in the breed, therefore ensuring that anyone unfortunate enough to purchase a puppy from a questionable source which provides no back-up or "inside knowledge" is equally aware of good management?

And why is such information not emblazoned across the breed club web sites, printed year after year in club hand books, and included without fail in all newsletters as a matter of course?  (I'm only assuming, of course, that it isn't since you're lengthy involvement in the breed left you without this seemingly vital knowledge).

And of course there's the KC - does their breed profile give due mention to such serious issues? 

In any event, I have fingers, toes, eyes and everything else crossed that Piglet and family are now firmly on the up and up!

best wishes, Teri :)

Only just seen this post.  Sorry to hear about Piglet JG, it is something I always worry about with my Dally.  My vet always asks about his urine everytime I see him, he has seen quite a few cases like this.  He says the things to look out for are mainly stop start peeing and dark thick looking urine.

I wouldn't use stop/start peeing as an indicator. Harry pees like that and his wee has tested clear of crystals, thank goodness.

I'm not laying blame on anyone, Teri - apart from on myself, of course. :) My dog, my stupidity. :rolleyes:  All I'm saying is that nobody should expound a 'one size fits all' theory of feeding, whether 'natural' or commercial, because clearly that has dangers. I posted this to hopefully warn others and prevent their dogs suffering the severe, avoidable, distress that mine has. What I'm trying to do is avoid the situation happening to anyone else, and the more the message gets across that each dog has individual dietary requirements, and what suits one might well be unsuitable for another the better, and this is a very good site for getting the message that recommending a particular diet, whether it's commercial, home-cooked or raw carries risks. To be perfectly honest, I would never have thought of feeding mackerel (for example) to my dogs if I hadn't read it here. But then again, I would never have thought of pureeing fruit and veg for them either. It's swings and roundabouts, and both the possible benefits and possible risks should be equally emphasised. :)

>of course there's the KC - does their breed profile give due mention to such serious issues?

I can't find the breed profiles on their website, so don't know. I rather doubt it because they don't have BAER testing as a recommended health test.

The new club website makes good mention of the problem, and of course it's in all the books of the breed - which is why I knew what to look for and knew what an emergency situation we were in. So the publicity saved Piglet's life. :)

>the more the message gets across that each dog has individual dietary requirements, and what suits one might well be unsuitable for another the better,

Couldn't agree more - as you know, many of us point this out (almost) ad nauseum ;)

I'm really glad that there is good publicity on this problem within Dalmatians - hopefully other breeds with similarly sensitive dietary monitoring make their needs high profile too :)

As is often mentioned on here (and all too often poo-pooed by some :rolleyes: ) many breeds, indeed, dogs in general, suffer from intolerances of varying degrees to a multitude of food types and I'm certainly with you all the way that it's important to EQUALLY emphasise these issues - every dog that can be saved from a potentially serious problem is of paramount importance to me and I'm sure that goes for all contributers.  There but for the grace of God!

Give Piglet a cuddle from me, Teri :)  

There's the worrying fear that the message frequently put on here is that 'dogs don't need carbohydrates', the inference being that feeding carbohydrates to any dog is bad. That's just not so - they can be a lifesaver. Mine, for example, should have been on about 50% carbohydrates, and Piglet will now need a higher proportion. Grains? Yes - and plenty of them! :)

Sweeping generalisations can have grave dangers.

>Sweeping generalisations can have grave dangers

I agree :)

I'm certainly not guilty of them - I do believe that in the main, most dogs will be fine with most foods - in any form, be it complete, home made, raw or a combination.  I have always been a strong advocate of acknowledging that there are an increasing number of dogs which require careful dietary management (a fact borne out by the myriad of specialist and prescription diets perhaps ;) )

We each want to do the best for our own dogs and IMO it is our duty to read labels, research what foods are available and ideally most suited to our individual breeds' requirements.  More importantly, we should "read" our dogs - if they are truly at their optimum on a particular feeding regime then there is neither a need to supplement nor change :)

I do think, however, that routinely suggesting urinary analysis before embarking on adding treats to a diet is perhaps taking precautions a little too far.  Stress is a very grave danger too ;) 

But we're not talking about the occasional treat, are we? We're talking about major dietary changes.

Luckily those who ask "What can I give to my dog/bitch to stop the wee making my lawn brown?", and those who suggest withholding water have the dangers of so doing pointed out to them. It should be the same with foods. Although it's dals which are prone to urate stones, all breeds can be susceptible to struvite and other stones, depending on the PH of the urine, and the dietary correction for one condition will exacerbate the other. It's important to know the PH before making changes.

I've misread you - I thought Piglet shared tinned fish etc with your other dog(s) but only in addition to his previous diet   Had you started on a raw food regime?

I am suprised at you using offal, however, as I learned many years ago that it was dangerous to Dals from a trainer at ringcraft (bearing in mind that this is neither my breed nor in my group at shows so exposure is very limited!)  Perhaps the info from the breed clubs has only become more widely acknowledged in recent times?   Very sad and clearly very dangerous :(

No, you haven't misread me; they did all share the occasional tin of sardines on their (slightly smaller to compensate) dinner, though I was toying with the idea of crossing the Rubicon! Luckily I was too cautious to go the whole hog and follow the usual suggestions I've read. I've not fed offal (though again, people post that 10% of a dinner once a week should be offal, without knowing anything about the dog), even as showing bait or liver cake 'treats' for well over a decade.

But you opened with

>and it's more than likely that the recent addition of sardines, offal, mackerel, beef etc that I've read as being suggested as 'healthy food' has turned the potential problem into a real one

Hmmm, not following you I'm afraid.  Perhaps I need a caffeine boost ;)

Sorry, I obviously didn't make myself clear! :o I'm old enough to use 'recent' as meaning within the past 5 years; not quite geological time ;) but not the last couple of weeks! :D The beef and other red meat levels rose, I added tripe (classed as an offal by many) and the oily fish. Those are all out now. :)

Ah, maybe it's you that needs the coffee :D 

Dagnabbit I'm gonna have one anyway - with a low purine toffee cheesecake ;) 

The new club website makes good mention of the problem, and of course it's in all the books of the breed - which is why I knew what to look for and knew what an emergency situation we were in. So the publicity saved Piglet's life.

Well it would appear that 'they' who knew didn't make good enough mention, because if someone with your knowledge, experience, reading and passion for your breed didn't know that you were doing anything wrong, then what hope for the rest of the owners of the breed? :(

I hope that Piglet is feeling more comfortable today.  My ex husband had an episode with stones, rolling around the bedroom floor in the middle of the night and was told to carry pethadine tablets with him at all times afterwards! :(

>Well it would appear that 'they' who knew didn't make good enough mention

I think that's very true. The problem's mentioned, but by no means stressed strongly enough. I think it's usually a case of 'it'll never happen to me' - but it can and does!

I've since learned that stone-formers shouldn'e be allowed to go longer than 4-5 hours without an opportunity to empty their bladders - how can fulltime workers cope with that?

I worry about being out two full days a week and not wanting to leave doors open.  But even when I am here he won't go during the day, only goes morning and evening, what can you do?

Missed your post earlier JG, what a horrible experience for yourself and poor Piglet. Luckily you spotted a problem quickly. It sounded to be a bit touch and go at some points, glad that he is ok now, and with the help of your vet I am sure you will soon find yourself and Piglet in a nice feeding routine again.

Bless him, big cuddle coming his way.  ((((  :-)  )))))

I've since learned that stone-formers shouldn'e be allowed to go longer than 4-5 hours without an opportunity to empty their bladders - how can fulltime workers cope with that?

Get a dog flap or a dog walker :)