>>Jo wasn\'t the OP - Balliesmum was. OP is Original Poster  Does that help?

Oh, okay.  That makes your point VERY intelligent and shows how VERY articulate you are then.  I stand corrected.  I am humbled in the presence of greatness.  :-)

Good :D

:D This has given new life to a very dull thread  :p

Welcome back Sitstay.........and Sara :)  So sorry you haven't managed to sort out your keyboard problem ;)

Thank you.

I can\'t speak for Sara but I certainly don\'t have MY \"keyboard\" problem straightened out.  I appreciate your concern though.

>I can\'t speak for Sara

:D

Really sara? Why don't you tell us what you do and what nutrition qualifications you have please?

To be fair Chlo, I think she already has in the 'Gusto' thread :)

Aaah, I stopped reading that when it went the same as every other thread on feeding - downhill :D

;)

>>Aaah, I stopped reading that when it went the same as every other thread on feeding - downhill <<

Well, you can rest easy on THIS thread, at least, as the level of debate quality has gone up considerably now that I am involved.  :-)

>as the level of debate quality has gone up considerably now that I am involved.<

LOL sitstay :D It is lovely to know all is not lost :)

I was starting to think i had entered the twilight zone

Look at that - you come on right after SitStay :)

:D

ROFLMFAO Chloe :D :D Now i have heard it all!! Paranoid or what!

Now i am starting to stoop to the levels of this thread,i really think i should retreat before i really lose the plot :p

Go on then, and take SitStay with you :D

You teach debate at the college level don\'t you, Chloe?  :-)

this thread is a million miles from debate, no qualifications involved!

No.

I remember a course, currently being undertaken, mentioned but I don't recall any qualification gained that allowed for the diagnosis or "treating" of animals.  I wonder what level the course is at and who is accrediting it?

>>still some of you will always find it easier to insult Rather than debate

Only those who arent intelligent enough to debate.  Why even bother with those types?

My main argument with it is the iclusion of so much sugar in it (what the meaty chunks ar full of), as dogs don't need any added sugar, it will lead to terrible tooth problems, and of course kidney problems linked to bad teeth, as well as I would think risks of diabetes.

As the OP illicited opinions from both camps

>are there people out there who do feed their dogs Bakers, and they too seem to be doing well on it??, or is the general feeling, stay well clear?<

It shouldve come as no surprise that those whose opinions were less than favourable would appear to 'counteract' those whose were favourable..ipso facto. and of course those that are favourable could be seen to 'counteract' those that are not....so why is it we are chasing our tails here??
   The feeding forum seems to be throwing up (pardon the pun) the same old same old debate,its a shame we'r not moving forward in any way..but getting all too quickly bogged down in the same old tussles!?
   I think Liberty summed it up really "live and let live"....people will read and make their own judgements if your reasons and experience are sound people will see that..let your and others experiences speak for themselves. :D
   I took the 'food facist' comments to be lighthearted...But if the cap fits??
;) :D
chill out....... :D

Whilst the term food fascist may appeal to your humours side, it distracts from the debate, why have an open forum if when comments are made that some disagree with, are then belittled and scorned by insults. Then you have lost the argument IMHO . I made the point that I think Bakers is a simple way of feeding  (convenience food) those who feed Barf take time to understand what they are doing- not a simple way.  Those who read labels and are interested in the effects of ingredients again do not take the simple way.-
live and let live works both ways-JO  

Jo some people don't have time for Barf aswell as spending general time with the dogs.

I work in a very well known pet store and spend times when it's not busy looking at ingreedients of dog foods, comparing and know whats what however I still feed 3 of my dogs on eukanuba because it suits them, one of wafcol salmon and potato and another on Pets at Home puppy complete!  Puppy was brought up on arden grange but put that infront of her and she won't touch it.  But she loves PAH :) and all I want is for my puppy to eat...not starve herself and have to be spoon fed to get her to eat.  One dog used to be fed pedigree untill they "improved" it recently and made it worse for my dog!

My Grandparents had one of their aussies in Bakers because it was the only light food that worked and she lost weight and stoped sagavging.  So pleased with that effect! :)

I don't think any dog could starve itself to death, anorexia is a human illness -
Humans live to eat -dogs eat to live .-JO

>Humans live to eat

>Humans live to eat -dogs eat to live

Vice versa, surely?

Perhaps getting vowels mixed up here.  Humans and dogs love to eat :D  We all eat to live though

god mine dont!! flynn will hardly touch a thing.its been a nightmare in the past.im now on my 3rd 15kg sack of Genesis. & hes STILL eating it! that is a minor miracle,usually he gives up on the start of sack 2 of any food. (he used to refuse barf too)

Which just goes to show that every dog, like every person, is an individual and should be treated as such.  Like some owners want to feed as natural as possible and put time and effort into every meal, others prefer to feed complete because they haven't got the same free time or money.  Then on top of this you have to face the facts and take the dog into consideration and accept that some dogs do very well if not better on the foods that others cannot wait to slate at every post asking about foods.

Sara, It's one thing to put forward experiences and opinions but quite another to lay on the emotional blackmail and try to make people feel that they are being cruel neglectful owners because they don't do what you do.

I'm sure she wouldn't starve herself to death but she refused food for 48 hours at only 10 weeks which did scare us as she needs food to grow.  She still now will not eat AG (have 15KG of it) but put a bowel of PAH down and she tucks right in and eats it!  Saying that IMO PAH isn't a BAD food at the end of the day, and I'm soon going to be allowed to read a booklet on it once I've finished reading about fleas, worms and ticks!  So then will have more knowledge on the food.

>anorexia is a human illness

Have you tried googling 'anorexia in dogs' (without the punctuation) and read the results? It's a recognised medical condition in the species.

Yes, Anorexia Nervosa is a human condition but anorexia is just a medical term for loss of appetite which any living creature could suffer for a variety of reason.

my MIL feeds her FCR X bakers and he is very hyper on it, that is my only experience of the food.

however- ive done a btec on animal health&welfare- on that course we intensely studied nutrition, we looked at various foods on market and saw it from both sides. due to my studies i largely avoid those feeds-esp bakers,

i went out to buy dog food for my first dog with the idea of 'find something thats more natural', and surprisingly i believe that food such as jwb etc- is more cheap as your not paying for fancy packaging/advertising etc, i also think you need to feed less of these foods than a food like bakers to get sufficient nutrition into the dog.

that is what i got from that course- that was taught by leading modern 'animal managers'- ie people in keeping/vetting/etc.

i dont have the right(nor i dont want)! to have a go at people who feed bakers or whatnot- but i do feel i should just mention there are others that you can feed.

Thank you Chris - thats a constructive post.
Believe me, I never thought I would be a Bakers feeder - however, I refuse to pay £40 a bag for Burns and have a very skinny dane even though he eats it all, when I can give him Bakers and he is putting on weight. No, its not the best food - but it works for us. Nuf said! :)

>Thank you Chris - thats a constructive post.<

Unlike your eh Chloe :rolleyes: Why are you congratulating chris on a constructive post when most of yours have been anything but,unless you call sarcasm constructive :rolleyes: :(

>Humans live to eat -dogs eat to live<

Jo i completely agree with your analogy :) Dogs will eat most ANYTHING to survive,they eat so they can live/survive,it would be anthropormorphic to say they live to eat

>Why are you congratulating chris on a constructive post when most of yours have been anything but,unless you call sarcasm constructive

I wasn't aware the two are mutually exclusive? :D

Oh I tried barf once - read Billinghurst book, joined various forums and yahoo groups etc. When it got the stage where people were discussing dog food in such obsessive, minute, granular detail as what herbs to include, and I was getting 3 million emails a day discussing vegetables I had never even heard of, I decided my time would be better spent playing with my already happy, healthy dogs - than reading about food on the internet.

ditto chloe really..

and here you are doing just that :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

No, I am DEBATING dog food - not reading it - there is a difference.

do you mean 'reading about food on internet'?
dont try to be sharp and witty/sarcastic- its pointless, can you not explain a little more? instead of putting silly little sarky faces?-
this is a reply to JO- chloe beat me to it!

sorry, did not mean to cos offence ,I will leave this post now as its getting aggressive -JO

By all means point out (factually) the various qualities, both good and bad of course, of various foods. However criticising the owner for feeding something which suits their dog's individual makeup even though you haven't examined the dog yourself and have no evidence to the contrary is dictatorial in the extreme.

Incidentally the BARF regimes often recommended on here are in fact contra-indicated for my particular breed, and in feeding it I'd be likely to cause longterm serious health issues.

crumbs, I am going to have nightmares about all this. I hardly dare confess that the only food that my puppy eats with any gusto  is the pedigree complete that my adult dog has, which ahe chooses over every brand of puppy food ( and please don't start a debate about pedigree bum )

LOL! im sure its not worth nightmares! i dont feed barf, but it doesnt make me a bad person, think the message is- if your dog is healthy and striving on it then whats the problem? pedigree bum!

Oh my god, what have I started????
Thanks for the posts which carried some sort of constructive comments, surely that it the point of this forum....when someone asks for advice on a subject which they may be a little less knowledgeable than some others, it allows them to ask for help.  I wouldn't dream of saying something sarky, just for the sake of saying it
I appreciate that Baker's is a food which some people would rather not feed their dogs, and Jo I resent the implication, that I feed it purely because "I like the simple life" and obviously don't care about the food my dogs are eating, if I didn't care, I wouldn't have asked!!

By the way.....you certainly don't get a Dane, if you like the simple life

I didn't intend to start a heated debate, I simply asked for the people who had experience of feeding Bakers what they thought.
And on an even more madder note...Sara, I certainly am not killing my dog slowly
If the PM you sent me is so helpful and well thought out, why don't you post it for all to see??

It can get like this sometimes :rolleyes: Makes a great read though

"Sara, I certainly am not killing my dog slowly "

ooOOoo that's not a nice thing to say to a loving doggy owner is it!!  Naughty Sara ;)

Oh my god, what have I started????

Don't worry, this happens every time somebody mentions the dreaded 'B' word. :D

My step sisters ex racing greyhound was fed Bakers for years and she lived to be 14.

However, if he's moulting badly and constantly, it could be the Bakers. You could try something like Vitapet's no moult supplement, but it's might be more economical trying food with less colours etc... I swear by Superdog Sensitive for my doggies and it's around the same price as Bakers.

Whatever you try will probably take a few weeks to show any difference. And if it doesn't work out, you can always go back to Bakers.