when your partner gives a command the dog looks at them like they're speaking spanish.

and even worse when your partner STILL doesn't use exactly the same word or phrase as you do
Most of the time mine, with strangers, isn't aloof or choosy he seems to be just disinterested in them. He will accept a very brief fuss or a pat but never looks for it from anyone he doesn't know. completely different to the Rott Daughter had, her attitude was 'eye contact = you want to be friends - here I come'

completely different to the Rott Daughter had, her attitude was 'eye contact = you want to be friends - here I come'

Mine are always on the look out for fuss from other people. They thrive on it. Not like they dont get enough at home. Im happy that they love people

or husband has a complete conversation with the dog and wonders why she doesn't understand the instruction

Well my best friend who I have known since I was 6, has had GSDs all his life(his parents were good friends with Gwen Barrington-look her up her affix was Brittas)he has only ever had direct German GSDs-no English breeding ever.

His dogs are never aloof not suspicious if strangers & as for GSDs not needing training to guard-jeez that's like giving a toddler a loaded gun with the safety catch off. Who ever this person is you know from the internet with 30 years of experience of GSDs do they actually work stock with their dogs or do protection work or what ??

GSDs shepherd stock i.e. act in place of the Shepherd. They are not flock/herd guards & do not bond with stock the way real stock guardians do(like Great Pyreneans etc) I don't like Wikipedia but this is interesting & not entirely inaccurate

Ha, ha FF - yes - as in "Now, would you like to be a good boy and sit down there's a good chap?"  !!!!  But I'm not complaining - he adores the boys and they him!

I'm sorry but you clearly do not know anything about the breed , German shepherds will protect there owners naturally thats why there are so many stories of people who have been protected by there had from muggers or burglars and a family member was one of them his dog was always confident and friendly but when a stranger tried to mug him while out walking the GSD protected him by biting the mugger. I don't care what you say over 29 different owners on tow GSD forums have said you don't know what your talking about. If you keep talking rubbish about the breed I will just ignore you.

Really ? Now you are an expert on GSDs & these 29 other owners also all experts believe as you do that a GSD will naturally protect it's owner(untrained) because it is a guarding flock guardian breed.

I may never have owned a GSD, however I have over 60 years experience of dogs & stock & GSDs are NOT a flock/herd guardian breed. To work "naturally"as a guardian breed, the dog has to bond to the stock, they do not & never have herd the stock, their sole work us to become a member of the flock & protect from attacks of wild animals(& in some countries other dogs) like wolves, wild cats. In Africa they are being used successfully to protect against Big cats(which themselves are endangered) instead of the farmers killing the Big cats.  In the USA they are used to protect from Coycotes etc & are more successful that farmers hunting them. The secret of the success of a guardian breed is the early bonding of dog & stock the dog being kept with the stock from puppyhood

GSDs are never used in this way, they are a herding breed developed to move stock from area to area & to restrict stock to an area designated by the human shepherd/farmer. Nowhere in the HGH side of working GSDs is the dog called upon to protect the stock from human or animal attack.

The GSD like other pastoral/herding can be trained to do other work & over the years the biddability the original reason for the breeds development. The key word is TRAINED. Natural instinct is not enough to rely on as there is no inbred instinctive control in any breed.

Just because a dog "sees off"an attacker doesn't make it a guarding breed. Are you & your fellow internet GSD experts aware that ALL service(i.e. police, army etc) have a degree of protection training ? Irrespective of breed ? So drugs, firearms, explosive dogs are all trained to protect their handlers albeit they are spaniels, retrievers etc. This is for the protection of their handlers(especially if they might be comfronted by humans intent on evading being caught or harming the handler)

Your dog doesn't have to be a guarding breed to prevent you being attacked or mugged etc but a high prey drive dog untrained of any breed acting on pure instinct is unable to be controlled & stopped from protecting it's owner in circumstances when that instinctive protection is inappropriate.

Whoever you are Zara80 you clearly believe that a shepherding breed & flock guardian breed are one & the same thing, fine you keep on believing that. As a retired shepherd/stockman I will leave this increasing silly thread & pop you on my ignore list. I'm treating myself this year to a continental trip to watch GSDs doing what they were developed to do herd & work stock in their HGH trials & no stock guarding required

I have to agree with Tommee on this, a friend of mine has two working GSDs whose lines are mainly from overseas and although they don’t greet people the same as labs they do go up to people and are very friendly. They always are very happy to see me, and I’ve only met the 2yr old twice before so I wouldn’t call them or the breed ‘aloof’ imo. Also I think it’s more so the bond that the owner and dog have that will protect you, to a certain extent, if you’re in a mugging situation etc. One of my girls is a trained therapy dog that does occasional assistance work, she’s so calm and will wait and listen to my instructions (most of the time ) but a few months ago we were walking towards a park quite late at night and there were 2 young lads approaching and stopped so we couldn’t get past. The girl I mentioned (I was walking my other girls too) started growling that then led on to barking, I shouted that if they didn’t let me past then I’d let go of her (I doubt she would’ve actually done anything, just carry on barking) and they let me past and ran off in the other direction I’d come from. She’s never done anything like that before or since that incident but I put it down to the fact I’ve never been in a situation like that before or since. To have a dog that will properly protect you requires training imo.

To have a dog that will properly protect you requires training imo

No, it also needs an owner to probably/potentially face criminal prosecution & his/her dog potentially PTS >note, a dog that has been trained to attack on command means >preplanning< before any hostile event has occurred or is threatened, in the event of a hostile event someone issuing threats and coming forward at the same time anyone can only use 'reasonable force' appropriate to verbal threats, the law only allows 'reasonable force', a dog trained to defend attack is only different in 'form' than carrying a gun to defend.

Note, I think there was some modification of the law after that recluse guy in Norfolk shot one of the 2 intruders in the dark, he ended up in jail, research that. sometime in the nineties or maybe early this century I think!

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Link 1 is to the Norfolk shooting case (he shot one of them dead), Link 2 is to the 1975 Guard Dogs Act:
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1. https://bit.ly/2K0vF3i
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2. https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1975/50/contents
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Just to add, my understanding is that only the military can deploy a security do to attack, the police use them sometimes to 'apprehend' which is different.
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Thank u for  detailed explanation of their origins and the differences  tommee.i admit to have learned inspite of owning the breed.

Certainly I would never rely on my dog to " protect " me, yes she barks at people coming up to the door but that is it! My Ex's OES would also bark at the door.. hardly a guarding breed! If I was mugged, I truly believe that she would do sweet FA. And that is how I prefer them. A dog who takes the choice into its OWN paws as to whether someone is a danger or not is a danger to the public itself, what if next time, instead of the mugger, its someone who's going to shake your hand or a friend who the dog has never met hugging you? and they get savaged by this dog?
Protection trained dogs are just that- trained, they're trained to know the difference between an attack, and social contact, trained to out from the bite.
I have enough issues getting people to accept my soft goofy GSD is not a threat to them just because of her breed, without people going around giving them reasons to be scared!

I was lucky enough to meet & chat in-depth to the late Carl Fuller, who bred wonderful working GSDs(Kennel Kirschental). I was allowed to watch his dogs working & being trained(& yes this included protection training for control purposes)
Not all HGH bred dogs will instinctive shepherd stock & need to be trained to patrol stock etc They never bond with the sheep/cattle as they are not required to protect them. It was fascinating to watch young dogs developing their skills & immensely impressive to watch fully trained dogs moving their flock/herd along the lanes from pasture to pasture/farm

Well you can't tell me that 29 owners on tow different forums are wrong and 4 behaviourist are wrong either, 4 of those owners have 30yrs or more of experience with the breed , there is no way all are wrong.

And the point I was trying to make was NOT about guard dogs it was about the Aloof trait. Maybe aloof is the wrong word for some but it's the word they use on the GSD forums , the point I was trying to make is that GSD are not labradors and are not interested in saying hello to every single person , even every book I have read says this.

I was not talking about guard dogs I just mentioned that all books I have read and all owners I have spoke with said they were livestock guardians.

And yes a guard dog needs proper training , guard dogs is not what I was talking about I was just saying that some GSD have protected there owners without training , like my friend he got the breed for other reasons however he did not want a GSD to be a guard dog and he only ever trains basic obedience and socialized well but when he got mugged his GSD started barking the mugger would not go away and as soon as the mugger grabbed him the GSD attacked because the mugger grabbed her owner she protected her owner without traning , yet she friendly to everyone she knows and is fine with strangers once she knows them.

That all I was trying to make a point of that GSD take longer to warm up to a stranger than a Lab and that some just are not interested in saying hello.

The only last thing I will say is how do I delete my account on this forum as I will not have some talk to me the way tommee has and everyone agree with her when your not reading my posts proberly or not understand what I was trying to say. And one member who has commented on this said they agreed with me in private message but yet on here your not saying that instead it seems your agreeing with tommee!

I will not respond to any more replys about this matter I know who I believe and that's the people who own and live with the breed 24\7 . Even if you know your wrong I don't think you would admit your wrong tommee , were I would that's why when you said GSD are not aloof I asked on tow forums first just incase I was wrong and they all said I was right some said they would not use the word aloof but indifferent with strangers can love em or leave em , not interested like I said , if they had said the same as you then I would have admitted my mistake. But even behaviourist have said your wrong and one of them has been a behaviourist for over 40yrs and has even worked with Victoria Stillwell and other great behaviourist learning and improving.

All I want is to know how to delete my account on this forum.

From my experience in the breed (owning, training, showing) , if I was to burgle a house, I would quite happily go in with a GSD barking in my face. A quick swipe around the head with a bit of wood will see most pet-owned GSD off crying into the corner (No i have not tried this!) or some sausage thrown to the corner would distract a lot of them! 
And as I previously stated, I absolutely would consider muzzling any dog in public which had " defended" me from a mugging. Dogs making their own decisions with no training is DANGEROUS. So your friend who got mugged- I'd suggest he considered Muzzling before the police and DDA came crashing down on him- You can be done under DDA now for attacks on your own property. Not worth the risk IMO and " fine with strangers once she knows them" what does she do before she is fine with them? this would be a huge red flag for me for this dog.
There is a huge difference between not wanting to be best friends with everyone ( like labs) and making the leap to biting a human.
100% agree that the GSD breed is disinterested in strangers and as very handler focused breed, this is a bonus. But disinterest is just that, acting like they don't exist, rather than treating them with suspicion.