Poor girl.  I have followed this thread with some interest as I have vaguely toyed with the idea of possibly having a litter out of my springer one day, maybe, possibly ....  But the one thing that keeps going through my mind is what if the pups are not sired by the same breed.  Worst case scenario she could have been got at by a bulldog or some such that requires c section and nobody will ever know until it is far too late

Very good point indeed, I'm surprised that didn't pop into any of our heads sooner :-) as of course who or what the stud was can not be truly known if from the origins she is said to be from, if indeed she is in whelp at all.

Another reason added to the many others why this poor girl should not be made to go through this ordeal.

I really fear for this poor bitch, she is not being put first, the thirst for these potential puppies is outweighing everything else screaming no!

I am NOT a BYB, 2007 was me but 2010 I didnt even own a dog I had a friend who was asking advice so I was typing what she was asking me as she didnt have internet access at the time. Ive already said that I once bred miniature jack russells so thats no great secret. I help (and foster) with a husky rescue because thats my breed. I wanted to help her and all I seem to be getting is grief.
I wont be coming back here for advice because you are obviously just finding anything possible to paint me in a bad light when all I wanted to do was help this little dog.

As people have said I don't think anybody is questioning you want to help her it is just the way that you are doing it.

If you have her as the main priority over anything else then you should look at the majority of the advice rather than your heart as it sometimes is very difficult to do :-)

(((Suzzypoo))) hope all goes well for you

>This is why people breeding dogs for the first time are urged to find a mentor - and a mentor is someone with a lot more experience than the average local vet and has brought many new lives into the world, knowing when something is wrong; able to cope with a bitch that goes into birth hysteria (it does happen); how to recognise uterine inertia; how to carefully reposition badly presented pups with minimal stress to the mother; how to resuscitate those born without breath; when to know it's time for a C-section.

Oh WOW, didn't want to copy all of this post, but have to give a big, big THUMBS UP for such an accurate piece of advice.

> but 2010 I didnt even own a dog>

But in that thread, you quite clearly state 'my girl'.

*shrugs shoulders*.  Go figure.

If all you want to do is help this little dog, then really, the advice is there for you in black and white. 

Interesting. So given the fact that Suzzy HAS decided to continue with the pregnancy and do her best for the bitch with whelping and rearing the puppies, anyone prepared to offer her some advice in this quest? Or is it a case here that if she hasn't heeded the majority view of terminating the pregnancy that no advice will be offered?

BenjiW, I'm fairly sure that if the OP comes back and needs advice on whelping, rearing etc, there will be many posters on here willing to offer it, but the attitude from the OP seems to be that she only wants to hear advice if it agrees with her opinion, so I doubt she would take the many experienced and well repscted posters advice on rearing etc either, after all, she knows best, and that attitude comes across very clearly in her posts.

Have a wee read back over the posts, BenjiW.  I think you will find that Suzypoo got the advice she had asked for in spades.  She also got the opinions of well-respected breeders too which must have been harder to take(the truth usually is).  The problem is, she doesn't want to listen to the advice or hasn't the means to adhere to the advice given.
My bitch delivered her litter with little bother and in record time but as it was a large litter for her size, she was tired at the end.  Last puppy and mum couldn't muster the energy to get the little one out so at 4am, I called out the vet.  I put mum and puppies into the car and drove to the surgery.  My vet helped get this puppy out and then scanned to check she had no more.  He gave AB's to mum and checked all the pups and charged me £180 for everything.  I thought that was great and I could've kissed him anyway for saving my girl from a section.  But the OP is saying she hasn't got transport, can't afford/doesn't see the point of scanning, etc.  I wouldv'e done anything for my girl to be healthy.  That's the difference!(and where everyone's on edge).
PS  I, too have 4 kids, one of which is disabled.  Doesn't stop me being a good breeder.

There are plenty of threads that are about that sort of advice so why don't you spend some time looking for her as you seem to want to help her :-)

Advice has been given in terms of getting her scanned to start with to determine if the bitch is pregnant them I am sure if she is still determined to go ahead with it of she has any questions then there are plenty of people who will be more than happy to help.

I would have thought though the OP should be doing lots of research and preparation anyway instead of being reactive if things occur :-)

Also she should be looking at getting the shopping list together very quickly and going out and buying everything she is going to need as I hope she won't be waiting to see when she gives birth and then doing it :-)

A list of things was given earlier in the thread which should help.

BenjiW

I'm curious as to why you feel Suzzypoo needs to "Stand by your guns girl" and receive hugs.  Also from what information have you gleaned that she is going to "do her best for the bitch with whelping and rearing the puppies".

From all that I've read I can only see risk to the bitch, and to knowingly proceed when there are other options (paying for a scan for instance) seems negligent.  I've also seen little evidence that this poster will heed the advice she's given.  She won't entertain termination, despite good advice and explanations as to why that might be the kindest and safest option and do you remember what she replied when it was suggested she get the bitch scanned?  She "wasnt willing to travel to another town on the bus and WASTE money".

Cracar, thanks and I think writing your experience is helpful in giving an example of what can happen. I do agree that a trip on the bus shouldn't deter anyone from necessary treatment though I personally have never had my bitches scanned so there are some that deem that to be an unecessary feature. However even I would have this bitch scanned if it were me, just because there are so many unknown's, who the Dad is, her background and health etc so would do this in this case. And one friend of mine who has previously owned and loved dogs and been a fantastic owner and really wants a dog now won't actually have one because she has no transport and feels she could never get the dog to the vets if she ever needed to, she's on benefits so would qualify for PDSA care but couldn't afford the taxi (not on bus route) so as a good dog owner knows now is not the time to have one. So I do agree that transportless this bitch might have been better off with someone else who does have transport so she can get the care she needs when she needs it.

LJS, I guess the op is doing research by coming here and asking for advice.

Dogs a babe, purely because of the arrogant attitude (imo) of so many here, and also that I too would allow the bitch to have the puppies as would be my choice providing the best care medically and otherwise that I possibly could. I am according to your definitions a BYB but I am extremly proud of the healthy well socialised litter I produced recently all thriving in their new homes. The first litter I bred (this recent being my second and final) was from a bitch I bought with no intention of showing or working, however her prodigee were shown and placed regularly but I don't feel I did anything wrong breeding her either. So I come from a different standpoint from many here and I see many posters act like a pack of hyenas because of the attitude towards BYB and when people get upset about the attitude they get told they are just not liking the advice given whereas it is not the advice given that is a problem but the attitude and manner.

I will leave it here.

>  I am according to your definitions a BYB but I am extremly proud of the healthy well socialised litter I produced recently all thriving in their new homes. The first litter I bred (this recent being my second and final) was from a bitch I bought with no intention of showing or working, however her prodigee were shown and placed regularly but I don't feel I did anything wrong breeding her either.

Nothing stopping YOU helping her, you seem to share many views.

"when people get upset about the attitude they get told they are just not liking the advice given whereas it is not the advice given that is a problem but the attitude and manner."

That seems a little unfair. A lot of respected breeders have taken the time to give the OP their opinion, all with the dog's best interests at heart. I bet if you asked the dog she would not want to have the litter but would choose to go off and start her new life asap but that isn't going to happen. Instead, she is going to be put at risk, potentially, to deliver who knows how many pups by god knows what sire. She is already at a disadvantage because of her neglected condition, let alone the absence of health tests for her and the sire.

Like others, I am also of the opinion that if you don't want to 'waste' money on a scan, which could tell you so much, and can't afford to get the bitch spayed because you haven't got the money yet, then you can't afford to breed as so much can go wrong. Even when things do go right, it is still an expensive experience. I did an eight hour round trip, on my own with 8 pups, to have my litter eye and hearing tested. My bitch went off her food after the litter was born and would only eat the best of everything - so fresh fish, roast chicken, steak etc for at least 7 weeks. I'm a vegetarian and I can assure you she ate better than my husband and I! And none of it was begrudged because it had been my idea to mate her, not hers. How will you feel when you see the pounds slipping out of your purse in a constant fashion for eight weeks and then to hand the pups over for nothing to those who want them? You could ask for a donation to give to an animal charity but what if the pups develop problems further down the line? As the breeder you could be liable as you bought them into this world. It's a lifetime commitment towwards those pups, I hope you are prepared for that. Can you take them back if people change their minds/have a change in circumstance? Again, if money is an issue it's something else to think about.

> Interesting. So given the fact that Suzzy HAS decided to continue with the pregnancy and do her best for the bitch with whelping and rearing the puppies, anyone prepared to offer her some advice in this quest? Or is it a case here that if she hasn't heeded the majority view of terminating the pregnancy that no advice will be offered?

As Suzzy/huskymummy whatever has had at least one litter in the past - not KC registered either :( - she does have "experience".  

Personally, I don't have the time to waste on people who come on here attempting to "advertise" a potential litter and asking gratuitous questions!  

Suzzy/GB/huskymummy has been the recipient of our advice on several occasions - and has ignored most of it - so why spend more time and effort on her?

> shes a bit timid when she hears a loud noise or raised voice

So an unsound temperment in addition to not being health tested :(

I'm closing this now as we are now going round in circles. If suzzypoo/huskiemummy does need further advice on any aspect of raising this litter (should Molly be pregnant), she's welcome to start a new thread.