> She has, so far, had three Cavaliers brought in as a result of last night's programme.

Seems a little outlandish to me.  I wonder if there were other issues and this is either an excuse or, to be more charitable, the last straw.

More to come Isabel look at Thompson1's post on the sister thread,

Can we combine these two threads Admin?  Getting Tennis neck. :-D

The KC have a further statement on their web site now.  I think this in particular is very pertinent to some posters views

>The Kennel Club has no legal standing, unlike some similar bodies in other countries. We have to work on these issues through partnership and persuasion - not coercion. The danger of introducing draconian measures is that some breeders could choose to operate outside the Kennel Club's jurisdiction; with absolutely no controls. That cannot be the best way forward.

> Can we combine these two threads Admin?  Getting Tennis neck.

:-D

Its gonna be the same as with Staffords when they are on TV with bad press loads end up in rescue the same will happen to cavs now I reckon  , all the sheep run out and get rid of the dogs which are polictically not correct and pour their money into bad breeders as they have no real idea of whats going on and see kc breeders now as bad and go elsewhere, only what they are told by the media which is going to be one sided obviously as good news doesnt sell does it?

Edited to add - jimboddb I dont think you have any idea of how breeders operate if you say no one can care for 10 or more dogs responsibly???
That is a very out of order statement to make as Turbos breeder had many staffords and all were happy, healthy, health checked, walked and had the biggest garden to roam in AND a luxery back room devoted to the dogs and it had lush cusions sprawled everywhere and a crate each for their den do you offer your dogs that kind of care with top quality food too? Breeders probably look after their dogs better then you or I because they are breeding dogs and need special care to keep them fit and agile, so they look after their dogs very very well indeed and Im sure many breeders on here will back this too as many on here have more then 9 dogs and they are all healthy and well looked after too so dont know where you got what you said from as its completely untrue.

the bbc  has worked on you then
the so called designer dogs . mutts in other words are being bred by BYB and puppy farmers
no responsible breeder would breed cross breeds
and i would never pay the stupid prices they charge.
the programme showed  a very one sided view
both the breeds i have have been health tested and most people i know in the breeds do the same
i agree the cavi breeder with the bis dog is utterly irisponsible, and i did not agree with culling of puppies
we need a follow up programme showing the good breeders
i have no time for the KC they only care how much money is in the pot and they know who is breeding what and how many litter.
the ABS is a total farce, more puppy farmers and pet people on it than good breeders,
the kc should make testing compulsive, no tests no registering pups
i would also like to see licenses for all breeders ,even if you only breed one litter. may be that would stop the pet people getting on the bandwagon,
and lets face it a awful lot of cavi,s are bred by pet people and puppy farmers
and its all about money
the swedish kc sure lead the way as far as breeding
i can see joe public panicking now and rescues will start receving more dogs and breeders stuck with litters
i,m glad i  only bred one litter years ago and have no desire yet to breed another,well not for some time yet
i wonder how many breeders are finding puppy sales cancelled this morning
as for labradoodles etc, the training club i go to has a few
they are tottally over the top, a nightmare to train and the owners are all under the impression they got a pedigree dog, they don,t have a clue
by the way i have had mongrels too, all from dog homes and they have been just as healthy as my pedigree dogs

Not all cross- breeds are accidental matings- there is a litter I have found advertising a well known cross both from eye tested and hip scored parents.

  IF i were to go and view these pups I would ask to see proof of testing. JUST as I now would with a litter of pedigree pups. This programme has opened my eyes, as to joe public a KC reg breeder who shows successfully is assurance that the breeder is held in high esteem- therefore trustworthy. Not any more, I'm afraid.
  These are my views.

  And yes, I would rather spend £600 on a unique mongrel than £1000 on one of the 50 pugs in the UK. I want a dog who can walk and run freely, breathe properly and see without folds of skin obstructing it's view. And if that costs me £600 or more, then so be it. Price of a lifelong friend is priceless.

> by the way i have had mongrels too, all from dog homes and they have been just as healthy as my pedigree dogs
>

Not doubting their sometimes healthy but be honest not always is it? just seems now people are taking on the view of all cross breeds are healthier so Ill go and BUY one!!
Why buy one when there are so many in rescue??
Its heartbreaking that these dogs are being shunned and forgotten for the more fancy cross breeds, once again the labradoodle pops up, when you could get a dog from rescue and make a donation to a good cause rather then pay hundreds for a mongrel to a back yard breeder who has no intrest in the health of the dam or pups just the ££££££££ which they will happily take and also offer no advice or even gurantee by testing that you have a healthy dog, just pot luck with crosses Im afraid :(
Bet these back yard breeders are rubbing their hands together and waiting for people to flood in buying their illicit and badly bred pups :(

>I have just spoken to a friend who works for Cavalier Rescue. She has, so far, had three Cavaliers brought in as a result of last night's programme. they are all fit and healthy, but the owners are frightened of the thought that their pets might go down with syringomyelia, and are getting rid of them before they are faced with heavy vet bills or euthanasia.

>I have just spoken to a friend who works for Cavalier Rescue. She has, so far, had three Cavaliers brought in as a result of last night's programme. they are all fit and healthy, but the owners are frightened of the thought that their pets might go down with syringomyelia, and are getting rid of them before they are faced with heavy vet bills or euthanasia.

Sounds like the perfect excuse to me, I'm afraid. They were perfectly happy with their dog yesterday, but today they're afraid it MIGHT go down with a disease in the future and MIGHT cost them money. People who loved their dogs would not take that action.

M.

Hi LucyDogs

I've owned Rhodesian Ridgebacks since the mid-80s and have bred (6 litters in total) and shown with considerable success.  I've always health checked my dogs in accordance with the breed clubs' codes of ethics.  My last litter was 6 years ago (various reasons for not breeding more recently)  I would be reluctant to breed a litter at the moment, there are far too many puppy farmers/pet people/"hobby breeders" who breed purely for money and they are flooding the market with poorly bred specimens, which for the most part come from parents which aren't health tested. Lots of these "breeders" haven't even heard of dermoid sinus so the pups aren't checked unless someone like me (ie nosey!) happens to see an ad and then contact the "breeders" with an offer to check the pups (and yes, I've found sinus) The internet has made it easy for people to just Google for pups for sale, so far fewer people now contact the breed clubs first.  If they did that, they could speak to knowledgeable, caring people and be put in touch with responsible breeders who health test.  I used to have lots of enquiries via the clubs, as well as through showing, word of mouth etc, and used to welcome people to come and visit my RRs at home just to talk RRs.  Now people just don't bother to do this, it's far too easy to just find a pup and buy it.

I've only had one ridgeless pup - I most certainly had no intention of "culling" her.  She was booked 2 days after her birth by some lovely people who just wanted a pet.  However, I would say that the majority of people, especially first time owners, want a correctly marked pup so it isn't always easy to home mismarks or ridgeless.  This is a large, powerful breed and all homes have to be carefully vetted - RRs are not for everyone!

I think the same Lily :(
So sad someone can just give away their years long companion based on pure media :(
They are going to be devasted when tests come in for it or something is done, wasted a good friend for nothing but hear say and scare tactics by the BBC :(

Edited to add - I never ever agree with the culling of healthy pups just to make syre everyone knows where I am on that!!
Our friend has a ridgless RR and he is just as gorgeous as one with it, lovely face too so having no ridge makes no difference really does it only to the people buying him/her.

So the kc has made another statement, it can't turn the clock back though. if they gave a little less time counting their money, and stopped the badly bred Kc reg puppies it would help their case. But, as they register puppies from the bottom of the pile they are hardly showing that they care about health and conformation. Their AB, which they are touting again, is full of puppy farmers, who would want to buy there, yest they say its their kitemark.

As to breeders leaving the KC, well what of it! Any breeder worth their salt will be more than happy with health checks etc, and KC reg would actually mean something if the rogue show breeders and the BYB and puppy farmers were excluded.

I wonder if any of the 'show' breeders from last night belong to breed clubs?

you right rach85
the byb and puppyfarmers will be cashing in on this
i can see loads of crossbreed so called designer dogs popping up
and lets be honest mongrels and pedigrees can be unhealthy
if i wanted another mongrel i would be going to a rescue centre not buying one

> if i wanted another mongrel i would be going to a rescue centre not buying one

Thank you Monty :)
and totally agree with what you said here!

I would not care if a Rhodesian ridgeback had a ridge or not . I expect a lot of what you call " pet people" wouldn't care either. Its just the same years ago with White boxers 25 years ago- they were very rare- now they are everywhere- Is this a bad thing for the boxer breed?  they are a reduced price due to not being able to show them, but only the same as when you want a bitch rather than a dog- dogs normally are cheaper Ive noticed. Which personally I think is wrong- as I find a lot more males in rescue centers than bitches.
I think to save all those fine Rhodesian ridgebacks maybe they should change the name to "Rhodesian lion dog" then the issue of culling  pups would be gone and a healthier dog would result in 10 years time.? Talking as a "pet person" :) They are a fantastic looking dog anyway with or without the ridge.

> Its just the same years ago with White boxers 25 years ago- they were very rare- now they are everywhere- Is this a bad thing for the boxer breed?

Probably, as they have a very high incidence of deafness.

>maybe they should change the name to "Rhodesian lion dog" then the issue of culling  pups would be gone and a healthier dog would result in 10 years time.?

I do like the sound of that :-) However it does have a rather encouraging name for the unsavoury characters don't you think?

i watched with horrer last night ,breeding and knowing that dog had problems , and puppig healty pups down ,i cryed having to do this my self last sat with our poorly pup in the litter ,its sick just sick and if this is kc then stuff kc !!!!!

i think culling puppies is absolutely disgusting and unacceptable, any breeder who culls imperfect puppies cannot call themselves a responsible breeder in my eyes.

i too was fuming to hear this stuck up cow saying how she happily culls ridgeless puppies and tried to justify herself and say she would rather it was euthanised in her care than it end up in a fighters hands???? what planet is she on and would she cull any imperfect children or grandchildren then, she sickened me to be quite honest!
She didnt have any comment to make about the fact that Dermoid sinus only occurs in puppies with a ridge, so whats the imperfect puppy then? Hmmm

There was also a bassett owner who proudly went over her dog bragging about it furnishings (extra skin) and when asked what is the purpose of the surplus skin she replied 'oh its just the way the breed is'???? Hello!

culling because they are not cosmetically perfect is dreadful, puppies with health problems or deformities are obviously a different matter altogether.

These people were not true animal lovers, not in my eyes anyway, very very sad :(

Dermoid sinus occurs in Ridgeless dogs and other breeds as well.

Does not take away from the fact that no healthy pup shoud be culled :-(

The easiest thing would be to change the breed standards wouldnt it for certain breeds?
Like with the RR the KC DID get them to remove the passage saying all ridgless pups should be culled and I know the damage is done and they probably already knew, but its small steps at the mo ist it?
I think culling a pup cause it has no ridge is horrendous and barbaric, but if a pup is ill or has a deformaty it cant live with then I agree it should be done to save the pups welfare.

I think with culling pups its very important that the minute you stop caring about culling pups or having to do the wrong but 'right' thing if you see what I mean, is the time you need to stop breeding.

Probably , as they have a very high incidence of deafness

I'm not sure that they do? do they? any more than Dalmatian's, White Alsatians, American bulldogs and white English bull terriers. I've meet more bully's with deafness than white boxers ?

About the name it really does not matter even "Rhodesian" would be good. I don't think this breed would get many chavs buying them for fighting as they are not a working breed like a rottie, doberman or terrier's- staff or pit, plus they have a lovable floppy eared look about them that would not do at all for the macho type's at all. 

> I'm not sure that they do? do they? any more than Dalmatian's, White Alsatians, American bulldogs and white English bull terriers. I've meet more bully's with deafness than white boxers ?
>

If it is more or less than these other breeds I could not say but it is still a problem.

> plus they have a lovable floppy eared look about them that would not do at all for the macho type's at all. 

They look like a big, powerful dog to me.

> and say she would rather it was euthanised in her care than it end up in a fighters hands????

I'm not clear whether you are caller her a lier or suggesting the latter would be better than the former.

I very much doubt she was condoning fighting isabel if thats what you mean?
I disagreed with that breeder too, thats a silly reason to cull a puppy when you could say the same for all staffords and bull terriers, they end up in fighting so should they all be culled at birth just in case?
It was a quick answer she probably regrets now (the breeder on the show) of course they wouldnt end up in fighting hands just for not having a ridge, thats stupid and untrue, if you waited lone enough someone would come along or even book it up because its different from the rest, alot of people like the dogs which stand out and not having a ridge stands out, and theres no defect in the pup apart from beauty so no need to cull either!!

> Why should a cross breed cost less than a pedigree pup? If you like the look, the temperament, parents are health tested, then why is a cross breed any less than a pedigree???
>   Having always thought of pedigree dogs, I for one will now consider a cross. Why? To avoid an exaggerated 'type' and ensure there is some genetic variation.

Very few crossbreeds will have come from health tested parents.  The breeders are unlikely to have had to travel and pay large stud fees.  they will not have spent huge sums proving their dogs at shows or work etc, so why should the pups from litters cheaply raised cost as much as those from breeders who have worked hard and spent a fortune to maintain and improve their bloodlines.

I have numerically small breed and to keep the gene pool wide along with other breeders have had the expense of importing a dog,a nd travelling abroad.  Neither of these endeavours have managed to be recouped from pups bred and sold, far from it.

This is called investing in ones breeds welfare and quality, sadly not what most people who breed dogs do.

The problem is that there are many people who breed dogs, but few breeders worthy of the name.

As for breed standards, how many standards have the program makers read, as none call for traits detrimental to the dogs well being, in fact the opposite is the case and standards have been amended in breeds where exaggerations have occurred due to bad interpretation by breeders and judges of the wording.

In fact in the last year or so instructions have been added to judges that any dog showing signs of anything detrimental to it's health and welfare should be penalised.

Also the program makers stated that only one breed club demanded health testing, which is blatyantly untrue, as ours certainly does.

*Applause*
Well said Brainless!!! :)

> I very much doubt she was condoning fighting isabel if thats what you mean?
>

No I certainly did not mean that.  I meant that emotions might not be allowing her to see that the former is preferable to the latter if that really is the choice you are faced with.

> staffords and bull terriers, they end up in fighting so should they all be culled at birth just in case?

A reduction in the vast overbreeding of the Stafford, in particular, would probably suffice.  I don't think they generally have large litters and they are a popular breed so, if reduced down to responsible breeders I doubt they would face these problems.

>of course they wouldnt end up in fighting hands just for not having a ridge, thats stupid and untrue,

With respect, I think the breeder is likely to be more familiar with the breeds "market" than someone without that experience.

>> and say she would rather it was euthanised in her care than it end up in a fighters hands????

> I'm not clear whether you are caller her a lier or suggesting the latter would be better than the former.

Its quite clear that the poster was saying that the breeder doesn't have to sell ridgeless puppies to dog fighters. Why can't they find good responsible owners like they do for ridged puppies?

The reason: she can't be bothered and would sooner kill them than plan ahead or put in a bit of effort.

The programme only confirmed my very low opinion of breeders and showing people. On this board breeders who sound otherwise responsible are very keen on killing healthy puppies for cosmetic reasons or simply because they're the wrong sex.

> in fact the opposite is the case and standards have been amended in breeds where exaggerations have occurred due to bad interpretation by breeders and judges of the wording.
>

Instigated by the KC long before Jemima came along. 

> Why can't they find good responsible owners like they do for ridged puppies?
> The reason: she can't be bothered and would sooner kill them than plan ahead or put in a bit of effort.

So you think she is a lier.  It's not my breed so when someone tells me this is the difficulties that face a particular breed I feel I would have to have some experience of my own to contradict them as what I do know from my own experience is each breed is certainly capable of having it's own particular issues.

>On this board breeders who sound otherwise responsible are very keen on killing healthy puppies for cosmetic reasons or simply because they're the wrong sex.

On this board I have never known anyone keen to kill any dog nor advocating the killing of any dog purely for cosmetic reasons only when a welfare issue arises out of it.

The reason: she can't be bothered and would sooner kill them than plan ahead or put in a bit of effort.

I reckon that too 100% she was a terrible breeder, terrible. :(

Isabel , what you said about staffords made my blood run cold, I was only joking about culling you seem to have taken it seriously with a breed which has no deformaties or problems apart from a couple of genetic ones which they are screened for anyway.
Culling isnt the be all and end all you know, there are other ways.

> Isabel , what you said about staffords made my blood run cold, I was only joking about culling you seem to have taken it seriously with a breed which has no deformaties or problems apart from a couple of genetic ones which they are screened for anyway.
>Culling isnt the be all and end all you know, there are other ways.

I think my suggestion was another way.

Karen1

Your response has made me quite angry.  Are you saying that you think that programme was balanced???  I'm sure you've got the intelligence to realise that it wasn't. 

Of course there are people out there who breed for all the wrong reasons and genuinely don't care about their dogs or who are misguided - but there are plenty of us that DO care VERY MUCH and make great efforts to breed healthy dogs that fit the breed standard!  And I very much doubt that you'll find anyone who is "very keen on killing healthy puppies for cosmetic reasons".  You may find a few people who have considered it, or who have done it - but I doubt it was easily done.

Please read my comment higher up the page pertaining to homing Ridgeback puppies.

Isabel I just re-read your post and apologies, I misunderstood you 2nd part of paragraph and when I read it again the 2nd time, I got what you mean lol
The stafford needs nothing but responsible breeders as does any breed, but culling still should not be an option unless the pup has a defect, in a way we got ourselves into this mess with breed standards etc and we are gonna have to get ourselves out without effecting the breeds even more then we have in some cases - for example pugs etc which have very visable problems due to over breeding with a small gene pool but their not like the cav which is genetic with its problems and cant be helped only screened and not bred from is the only way to help these breeds which have problems.

In an ideal world We need screening for all genetic problems for all breeds if you dont screen you cant legally breed or cant legally register the litter, licences to be able to own a dog legally and training courses before hand, (just 1 hr for 2 weeks on dog ownership and handling) and also a license to be able to breed dogs too.
Police would be able to stop dog owners in the street and ask for proof of licence if they feel they its needed, oh imagine the world if everyone had to do all that?
there would be less breeders with better bred dogs, less owners and all with expierance with dogs due to training and less dogs in rescue as people know what they want and what their allowed for their living quarters, would be a beautiful world :)

Hi i am a hobby breeder watched last nights programe if the show breeders did outcrosses & linebreed there dogs only with tested dogs and not inbreed there dogs, woulded that help to make healthier dogs. I have cavaliers do all the tests & only will i mate my girls to health tested stud dogs, and i do not show so who's the responsible one. Thought last nights show on bbc1 was very one sided.

cant believe you needed to ask that question isabel, you have replied to enough of my posts to know the love i have for dogs!!!

i wasnt doing either just stating what a lame excuse she came up with for her reasons to cull! :(

Thanks for that Ridgielover, yes of course people should ideally have enquiries before breeding, but I'm sure you've had the experience of 90% of these people suddenly changing their minds, or in my breed not having the colour or sex requested by people.

Its the same with any breed tho Lucy, suppose you just have to have a back up list or be prepared to keep the pup/pups on till suitable homes are found, after all their the breeders responsibility and hopefully most wont cull just because a home cant be found.

> cant believe you needed to ask that question isabel, you have replied to enough of my posts to know the love i have for dogs!!!
>
> i wasnt doing either just stating what a lame excuse she came up with for her reasons to cull! :-(

It might seem lame to you but another way of loving dogs is to think about their future welfare and to sometimes face up to doing what you feel you have to do to ensure it.

Hi LucyDogs

I'm delighted to say that I've never had anywhere near that percentage of people changing their minds!  I will have spent hours talking to people - who will in most cases have visited me and met my dogs at home (very occasionally not feasible because of distances involved) - before they make it onto my waiting list.  I have however had a litter of 9 bitches and 2 dogs when, of course, most people wanted dogs.  My pups were still all booked  well before 4 weeks.  I am fortunate enough to have a good reputation and so other breeders will happily pass on suitable enquiries.

Isabel the pups welfare isnt affected by the fact is hasnt got a ridge, its effected by the way breeders (some not all of course) wont be seen to have a ridgeless pup in their litter so want rid of it quickly and easily which means culling sadly enough, its an easy answer and its used all to often.

Why dont we cull the chilkdren born with downs syndrome or babies born deaf or blind, their life will never be the same as anyone elses and its bad to their welfare and they will maybe never find love or have children of their own, they might not fit in at school, be bullied and so on, but we persist and get on with life learning to cope with their disability, why should puppies be any different? Their own dam would keep them safe and treat them no different, who are we to call god and take lives we dont see fit to live when they are actully perfectly healthy its just they dont 'look' right by someones reckoning, bad bad bad practise and so morally wrong :(

> the pups welfare isnt affected by the fact is hasnt got a ridge, its effected by the way breeders (some not all of course) wont be seen to have a ridgeless pup in their litter so want rid of it quickly and easily which means culling sadly enough, its an easy answer and its used all to often.
>

I agree welfare is not affected by the lack of the ridge per se and that is not the reason the breeder gave, nor the one that you have suggested that they would not want to be seen to have such a pup.  Your reason does not seem likely considering the breeder was not making any attempt to suggest these puppies do not occur.  It may not be what you would choose to do but I see no reason why people should think she was a lier when giving her reasons.

definately on the same level here rach, that is exactly the point i raised earlier on about imperfect children too, they have the right to life so why doesnt an imperfect puppy.

isabel i am fully aware of taking responsilbity of the future welfare of my puppies and if i had an imperfect puppy (not a deformed or sickly pup) i wouldnt contemplate culling, there is always other options it is just that culling is quick and simple and also the added benfit that no-one has to ever know that breeder produced a puppy that wasnt perfect - sorry but there is just no excuse and if breeders are not willing to spend time and money to do whatever it takes to find that puppy that they brought into this world a loving pet home then they shouldnt be breeding at all!

No one has called the breeder a lier - just purely heartless!

i bred 4 years ago an imperfect puppy that had a few problems and he is here with me today where he will stay :)

i bred 4 years ago an imperfect puppy that had a few problems and he is here with me today where he will stay

Just like an normal person would.  I think this program has had a bigger impact than I first imagined as I am currently expecting a litter of pedigree dogs which I only bred because people were asking to go on a waiting list for one of my dogs.  So I have decided I could do with another dog for myself as well.  My bitch is due anytime now, hence the bags under my eyes from being on nightwatch.
I test my dogs for PRA even when it isnt my coat type that has the issue, all my dogs are DNA registered with theKC so consider myself to be doing the checks I can.

But I have had 4 people call me today, thankfully on a day off!  Two to say they would still have a dog from me regardless of the programme, One wanting reassurance about the health screenings and general health of mum and dad, and one which I got a bit mad with that has said she isnt going to buy another pedigree dog even though she was the one I had down for a good dog as she was so passionate about starting to show all because of this program.  Thankfully I always have twice as many people as puppies.  But have been ringing my backups today to see where they stand.  My breed wasnt even featured so I hate to think of the people pulling out of deals in the breeds that were featured!!!

I just cant believe what damage this program is and will do to dogs

Emma and a still very pregnant bitch.

> i bred 4 years ago an imperfect puppy that had a few problems and he is here with me today where he will stay

That's your choice but I don't think you can call someone heartless that has a different view on welfare.  Their beliefs, even if they differ from yours, can be equally grounded in what they believe is best for that dog.  I personally do not believe animals have the right to life that humans have, nor does the Church, nor does the law, nor do the majority of people in the UK.  I do, of course, believe in always considering their welfare and quality of life.

> I test my dogs for PRA even when it isnt my coat type that has the issue, all my dogs are DNA registered with theKC so consider myself to be doing the checks I can.

Did you obtain KC permission to breed from your dog that had the testicle altered?   The programme also looked at the issue of surgical alteration of inherited conditions.  Permission is, of course, obligatory rather than the mandatory health tests but I wonder if they are not always observed either.

> I have cavaliers do all the tests & only will i mate my girls to health tested stud dogs, and i do not show so who's the responsible one.

The neurological problem in Cavaliers has only very recently become acknowledged.  do you in fact MRI scan all your bitches and use MRI scanned stud dogs?

I think a big problem is that so called Pet breeders do not make themselves aware of what genetic conditions there are in their breeds, and few if they do know care to test.

There are maybe some show breeders who also fail to acknowledge and test for problems, but I think you will find that of those testing their dogs for health issues the vast majority are people that breed to show, and breed to the breed standards.

Sadly even among working Gundog etc breeds there seems to be an Ostrich view re health testing.

> Hi i am a hobby breeder watched last nights programe if the show breeders did outcrosses & linebreed there dogs only with tested dogs and not inbreed there dogs, woulded that help to make healthier dogs. I have cavaliers do all the tests & only will i mate my girls to health tested stud dogs, and i do not show so who's the responsible one.

Are you really responsible when you breed from under aged bitches ????????

-/- By minnie mousesDate 30.06.08 13:57 GMT
I have cavaliers 18 months to 2years is the right age for there first litter on there thred season. After the tests have been done.

Are all your bitches MRI scanned clear & all the stud dogs you use scanned clear & over 2 1/2 ????

Rhodesian Red Dog?

Just a thought lol

Did you obtain KC permission to breed from your dog that had the testicle altered?

That was a comment on a dog that is long since dead from old age.

> i think culling puppies is absolutely disgusting and unacceptable, any breeder who culls imperfect puppies cannot call themselves a responsible breeder in my eyes.

> These people were not true animal lovers, not in my eyes anyway, very very sad :-(

As stated isabel, in my eyes, therefore this is my belief and i DO feel culling is heartless and thats my opinion and i have the right to it thank you.