Champdogs Information Exchange
28.01.05 10:19 GMT
My 13month old GSD is on her 3rd bout of cystitis and antibiotics. Are there any natural remedies or anything preventative that I could give.
28.01.05 10:32 GMT
cranberry is the best thing for humans as a preventative thing. I don't know whether it's appropriate for dogs, but I seem to remember somebody recommending it. Have you tried doing a search on yahoo/google etc?
this sells cranberry capsules for pets to help prevent cystitis. I imagine if you shop around there will be others.
28.01.05 10:38 GMT
I tried giving her Cranberry Juice, thinking the same way as you but she would not touch it. Maybe more people will come along with some help.
28.01.05 10:39 GMT
my pup loves cranberry juice! :-) Try not to let her get it if I can help it (don't imagine the sugar does her teeth much good!)
i take cranberry tablets from the health food shop,prob easier to get done than the juice!!!!!
Cystitis is not nice in humans so i can imagine what wee thing is going thru.
Did u try the capsules in some food?
Hope it clears up soon.
28.01.05 10:56 GMT
I have just done a search and Dorwest herbs say garlic, fenugreek and mixed veg. No clue to dosage. She already has garlic mixed in with her home made tuna bread treats but the fenygreek? I have some in my dried herbs for cooking. Will this be the same? How much to give? Maybe I could add this to her treats mixture?
A handful of pearl barley boiled in water for 20 mins
then allow to cool and allow the dog to drink the water
you can then use the pearl barley if she needs any weight on.
28.01.05 11:06 GMT
Thanks Carolyn. I will try this one. My vet is really quick to prescribe anti biotics and I'm sure just like us, the taking of them all the time can not be good for them.
28.01.05 11:23 GMT
are the barley water and fenugreek recipes preventative or curative (is that the right word??). I'd suggest you start giving her something as a preventative measure once this episode has cleared up so she doesn't have to go through it all again. The cranberry capsules given daily would be a good preventative thing I imagine, although I'm not sure what sort of dosage you would need! Hope she feels better soon :-)
I would give her organic cranberry capsules & plain natural live yoghurt daily to help with current problem. Also to encourage her to drink plenty of water, add tsp of honey to water bowl. As a preventative maybe look to a change of diet :)
28.01.05 23:07 GMT
What sort of diet do you recommend? Vet was talking about a special diet. Low protein I think. Thought he was just trying to push their exspensive tins so I asked if this was really necessary. He decided in the end to just go with the medication (anti biotics, Cystaid and HSAP tablets) in the end. On getting home I looked into the Struvite he mentioned after testing a sample of her urine. Everything I have read does mention diet to help. One site I was on (Chinese medicine) gives a diet to put together yourself, 50% meat, 25% rice or potato and 25% eggs, Yoghurt,carrots or squash. Is this the sort of thing your talking about? It goes on to say that this is a low protein diet and must not be continued for too long. I would appreciate anyones thoughts on this diet.
If you're after a lower protein diet I would go in the Chappie direction (as recommended by my vet).
28.01.05 23:46 GMT
Whatever you decide I would discuss your decision with your vet to check it is suitable as if there is any question of loss of kidney function it is important to get it right.
29.01.05 00:17 GMT
The problem with Vets advice re food is that they always want to promote their own foods for the most profit on sales. My vet also does not agree with the BARF principles. I do not feed BARF at the moment but from all the good Press from the posters on this Forum, I am interested in going down this route. As one of the posters says, they are Vets and not necessarily experts in nutrition.
29.01.05 00:33 GMT
That certainly not allways the case, my vet does not sell food. They are as likely to understand nutrition as anyone else and will certainly have the best understanding of what is required for your dog and her problems as they have examined her certainly in terms of a prescription diet when something like kidney function has to be considered. I don't think there should be any problem with a raw diet I just think you should run it past them to ensure it is at the level of protein that is appropriate for your dog and her problems.
I have had a bitch suffer from bouts of cystitis and I found the best cure for her was cranberry capsules - from Asda's - one twice to three times a day. Cleared it up no problem. The Dorwest remedy didn't work for her.
There is a homeopathic remedy too but I can't remember it at the moment!
Hi Gaby, your dogs only young so unless vet thinks theres something else going on with the kidneys maybe, I don`t understand why a low protein diet? And yes I was thinking along the lines of a raw diet ;) :) I like Dr Richard Pitcairns book, Complete Guide to Natural Health for Dogs & Cats. It gives recipes to aid all kinds of ailments & alternative remedies.
For now you could give VitC, 250ml for small dogs x 2 daily & 500ml for medium dogs x 2daily & 500ml for large dogs x 3 daily.
Heres a good link for diets/foodhttp://www.bowchow.com/
I successfully treated one of my cats for acute cystitis with homoeopathic Cantharis 30c. :)
30.01.05 18:05 GMT
My vet says that because of the large amount of Struvite Crystals in her urine she may have or be developing stones. This was the reason for a special diet. He wants her to try medication first to see if it will clear. He says that if she already has any stones the medication will not work and then x-rays would be needed.
Hi Gaby, thats a shame & she`s so young.
Well you have the links for alternative diets & treatment....Iv`e got the Pitcairn book & could let you have the recipe if you`re interested??? :)
02.02.05 11:20 GMT
Hi Christine, I would like to have the Pitcairn recipe you mentioned. Many thanks for your trouble.
*Canine Kidney Diet for Kidney Problems*
Half a cup(quarter pound) regulr fat hamburger mince/meat
2+3 quarter cups cooked white rice, enriched.
2 tablespoons cold pressed safflower, soy or corn oil
600 miiligrams calcium
Eighth of teaspoon iodized salt.
2 tablespoons parsley, finely grated carrot or other vegetable (optional)
Half -1 clove garlic minced.
Dog vitamins (as recommended on label for medium size dog)
20 milligrams-level B complex.
5,000 IU vitamin A
1,000 milligrams vitC (quarter teaspoon sodium ascorbate)
Mix all ingredients together & serve raw if dog will accept it. Otherwisw, mix all but the vitamins together, bake about 20mins in a moderate oven & then wait till it cools to mix in the vitamins. Occasionally substitute 1 TO 3 teaspoons of liver for part of the meat. Be sure to provide plenty of fresh pure water, filtered or bottled at all times.
Generally, feed as much as your dog will eat, but as a guidline this recipe should feed a pound toy for 3 days or a 40 pound dog for a day. By tripling it you can feed a 60 pound dog for 2 days. Muliply the recipe as needed for convenience.
Pitcairn also says, first, change your pets diet. If it mostly centres on commercial foods, the condition is almost sure to recur......
Hi Kath, good idea :)
01.02.05 19:56 GMT
I would suggest that you find out the cause of the continual infections as this is not normal. You could look up a product called D-Mannose; cranberry is more often used for urinary crystal formation but it doesn't harm to try. Anti biotics are rarely any good in clearing the infection on a long term basis and to me it's just puting more chemcials into an already stressed system so perhaps looking at some Immune Remedy like Echinacea would be of benefit. Avoid as many chemicals as you can like vaccines, flea and worm treatments unless done naturally or homeopathically as I do with my dog.
I am a believer in Detoxing and use homeopathic detox and for this type of infection would consider a bacterial remedy along with a combination of prepared remedies in one to cover a UTI type problem. Hope that helps.
03.02.05 11:24 GMT
I agree I would love to find out the cause of the continual infections. Today she has started itching again. She was only cleared of dermodicosis and ringworm at Christmas. We have another appointment with the vet this afternoon. I am by no means an expert but have had GSD on and off for 40yrs and none of my other dogs ever had these problems. She had the same problems last time she was on heat. First Cystitus, prescribed anti biotics, followed by anal gland probs, itching followed by the dermodicosis and ringworm. It took hte vet 3 months to get this under control and now 1 month later starting all over again. What should I be asking my vet to look into blood tests, x-rays or what? Last time he tried more anti biotics and steroids before even doing a skin test. He only did it after my sujestion after someone on the forum asked me if this had been done.
03.02.05 20:18 GMT
Hi, your dog sounds like she has had a lot of problems which will have no doubt caused her Immune System a great deal of stress. If this all started after vaccinations I'd consider that as a cause and take action by doing a very specific Vaccine Detox, this would also help with the skin. In doing this one has to consider the Liver and Kidneys, especially with this case, and so alongside that you can do a Detox. All these do is get rid of the harmful toxins. Any dogs taking drugs should detox as a matter of course. They don't disturb the workings of the drug but they do remove the chemicals and toxins that form to cause the other little hiccups you seem to be going through.
Steroids work, then they stop working and the condition can often reappear. So to me that says that the treatment is ineffective.
What came up on the skin test? the Ringworm? is that now controlled?
You could get your vet to at least ascertain if this little dog had any crystal formation, usually struvite, then you can treat it and watch the diet to avoid these coming back and you don't need a very expensive vet prescribed diet, it depends on how much you can spend and how much work you can put into home cooking if that is needed.
Where is she itching? is there any redness or sores, spots etc? can you go into any more detail or is it all listed on the forum, which if it is, I'll go back and read.
I would certainly think about when the first bout of cystitis started. Then if it is close to the taking of any meds, vaccines etc. your dog has no tolerance to these drugs and you have to think of alternate ways of treating them. You can vaccinate homeopathically, you can worm homeopathically and as for fleas, well, normally this is not treated as a good diet and strong immune system helps. I have known many dogs who have flea treatments and still get fleas so in the past my advice has always been treat the problem you have, not treat the problem that does not exist. Rather like me giving you a paracetamol just in case you get a headache next week! So other than this bladder thing, what else is there going on? and please, look into detoxing. I suggest homeopathic because that is what I understand and I know works but if that is not the way you wish to go, then there are other preparations. How efficient they are I don't know. I avoid herbs because you need to know if your dog has a problem that is not tolerant to certain herbs and Chinese herbs are especially strong. Also, these herbs have to be of the highest quality and I see a lot of rubbish advertised on the 'net which concerns me as this is an area I study and understand. I do know the answer is not in drugs, so if you can have a think and see if something rings a bell, and get a urine test done, or if you have done, type up the results, perhaps we can help you more.....T
04.02.05 14:22 GMT
she was cleared of ring worm and Demodex Mite at Xmas. I have been to the vets again and he had to empty her Anal glands. He says this could have been why she was chewing her backside. The first time she had cystitus, she was not on any other medication at the time. 2 months after vacination. No change to her food at the time. It followed us going camping. The second time it was her season and this time also at her season. Her urine sample this time showed a large amount of Struvite crystals. Cost and time no problem as far as diet is concerned. She is on tins of Butchers and Pedigree mixer. I was about to change her to Barf system and taking delivery of my first lot of meat tomorrow but if she has to be on a special presription diet I will cancel the delivery.
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