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Up Topic Dog Boards / Controversial Stuff / US firm applies to house Beagles for vivisection
- By snowkitten [gb] Date 25.05.11 12:03 GMT
I'd like to bring to your attention the fact that a US company called Marshall Farms has applied to East Riding Council, Yorkshire to build a facility to breed Beagles for vivisection and lab use. As a Beagle exhibitor I am horrified by this and our national Beagle Club has written to the council and the KC opposing such a place. http://www.thebeagleclub.org/images/File/Documents/BC%20News%20Release.pdf

Fellow dog lovers I ask if you would take a few mins of your time to contact the council and express you opinion to deny this place to be built. You'd be saving so many lives of my beloved breed. Thank you.
- By Goldmali Date 25.05.11 12:10 GMT
There is already a thread about this. :)
- By Stooge Date 25.05.11 14:16 GMT
I think the previous thread was deleted, presumably as against TOS.
I would not sign anyway as I would find it hypocritical knowing I would be glad to use the developed research if myself or loved ones needed it and would prefer the animals to be raised and kept in the UK where we have much stricter welfare laws than the countries where they are likely to end up.
- By LJS Date 25.05.11 14:26 GMT
Agree 100 % Stooge :-)
- By AlisonGold [gb] Date 27.05.11 17:24 GMT
I have signed the petition and will contact the Council. I cannot agree to rearing dogs and using them in this manner. Many times it has been proven that some of research results cannot be used for humans so I cannot see the reasoning. If I want something so bad I would be happy to be a 'guinea pig'. These poor animals are pack animals and are being kept in cages without the socialization they require. Really it is against all that we preach on here. I thank God that I don't have a breed that they use for this purpose.
- By Brainless [gb] Date 28.05.11 07:06 GMT Edited 28.05.11 07:11 GMT
Have to agree, are we talking vivisection or medical research?

If it's medical research and testing that is not being repeated for no good reason then sad as it is animals do sometimes have to be used.

If we accept that they do need to be used we need to make sure that where possible alternatives are used first, and that the dogs are treated humanely and stringent rules applied to avoid unnecessary pain or suffering.

I would prefer if dogs that were already destined for euthanasia were used, but unfortunately they need animals that are alike and have been reared and kept the same to reduce variables.
- By colliepam [gb] Date 29.05.11 07:31 GMT
ive emailed the council,but failed miserably at the petition,cant get the link to work for some reason.good luck with it.Surely theres no need for vivisection any more?
- By snowkitten [gb] Date 02.06.11 07:44 GMT
It is for vivisection Brainless. Totally pointless IMO but then it's my breed that gets used for this as they are so placid.

I wonder Stooge, LJS if it was your breed would you still have the same opinion?
- By bertbeagle [gb] Date 02.06.11 11:04 GMT
I think the previous thread was deleted, presumably as against TOS.
I would not sign anyway as I would find it hypocritical knowing I would be glad to use the developed research if myself or loved ones needed it and would prefer the animals to be raised and kept in the UK where we have much stricter welfare laws than the countries where they are likely to end up


Unfortunately Stooge these are dogs are going to be bred to be supplied to other countries where the welfare standards of animals been used for testing is just awful. US Marshall tried to set up a breeding facility in Italy and that planning application was declined...so they are now trying to do the same here in the UK. US Marshall have applied to build 4 units to breed beagles that is a total of 2000 dogs, this is totally accessive!

Do you know how these dogs live Stooge? - they live in small pens with 20 plus in each pen, they are not allowed outside, there are NO outdoor runs, no toys, they do not see any daylight, the bitches they breed from are continuous cycle of having litter after litter. Apparently that's an acceptable standard of care!

Did you know that there are already 9 breeding facilities in the UK who supply beagles? Do we really need anymore?

In 2009 about 4500 beagles were used for testing in the UK, we do NOT need another beagle facility in the UK.

I would suggest you read the front page of the Dog World if you get that paper and do some research on this topic then maybe your opinion might change.

Your not been a hypocrite signing the petition, we are asking people to sign as we don't need yet another facility in the UK to breed these dog especially as most of them will be shipped abroad. It is totally excessive!
- By happyhoundgirl [gb] Date 07.06.11 14:16 GMT
As an ex-owner of a beagle it sickens me to think that this practice is still going on. We have lots of other areas open for medical research these days and I'm afraid that human systems vary massively from those of dogs and fail to see what possible research value these studies provide.

Will try to sign against it and maybe at somepoint someone will twig we have alternative methods open to us.
- By Nikita [gb] Date 07.06.11 15:38 GMT
It's known that results from animal research of any kind is unreliable due to the anatomical and phsysiological differences - and with other methods available, I do not personally see a reason for animal experimentation to still be going on.

It also contravenes the 5 freedoms and the animal welfare act - dogs in research facilities cannot, IMO, exhibit natural behaviour; and by the nature of the experiments, both they and the countless other animals used for such research suffer pain, fear etc.

I recall from college (which was not long ago), a guideline for when to call time on rats undergoing such experiments - PTS was not considered until the rat's fur was 'staring' (fluffed and sticking out, a clear sign of severe pain and/or illness) and the rat was not moving because of the pain it was in.  That is cruelty, as the guideline was not advocating putting the animal out of its misery until it was in a LOT of pain.  That is the failure to adhere to the 5 freedoms (freedom from pain, injury and disease) and the welfare act (exhibiting natural behaviour, not suffering etc).

A lot of the time experiments are repeated unnecessarily, and falsification of data also goes on - and adding in the unreliability and the suffering that goes on - how can we continue to use animals in research?
- By LJS Date 11.06.11 17:22 GMT
If it was purely for animal research and they needed to use labradors for the research then I would still have the same opinion.

I think people are hypocrites if on one hand disagree with animal testing and then thankfully accept medical treatment which this research has enabled and contributed to the advances we all benefit from.
- By Stooge Date 12.06.11 19:54 GMT Edited 12.06.11 20:03 GMT

> I wonder Stooge, LJS if it was your breed would you still have the same opinion?


Yes.  I feel pretty much the same about all dogs really, I certainly don't have anything against Beagles and think they are lovely dogs.  I just think this is necessary as, unfortunately, we have not reached the stage where research can miss out the animal testing stage.  I am sure as soon as it can be it will be dropped as there are enormous difficulties and costs that the research companies will obviously wish to avoid if they could.
- By Stooge Date 12.06.11 20:01 GMT

> I would suggest you read the front page of the Dog World if you get that paper and do some research on this topic then maybe your opinion might change.
>


I do appreciate that this type of rearing necessitates conditions that we would not like to keep dogs in ourselves but it will still be better than those offered by many other countries. 
The fact that they then have to go to other countries for the actual research may be, in part, because the difficulties that have been created here in preventing research facilities developing.
- By Celli [gb] Date 30.06.11 08:36 GMT
These dogs will be kept in bare concrete pens with no outside access, including dogs kept for breeding purposes, which can be constantly bred from for nine years or more, this to me is no different to puppy farms who also keep breeding stock in barren pens and breed from them constantly. So surely, anyone who disapproves of puppy farms is also being a hypocrite ?.
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Up Topic Dog Boards / Controversial Stuff / US firm applies to house Beagles for vivisection

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